Price per pound for boats

[PM]

First off, sorry,I kind of hijacked this thread idea from another post. It was quite old so didn't get any play. Briefly one owner observed that many boats seem to be actually priced, valued and sold on a pretty much "By the Pound basis".

I agreed 100% and used my 1978 thirty six foot Albin as an example. Purchased about ten years ago for a fair price of about $18,000. (About $1.10 per pound)
Probably worth a tiny amount more right now, maybe $1.20 per pound mostly due to the new engine I put in last year for $20,000 (about $28.00 per pound).

I got the Admiral for a few bucks a pound, 50 years ago. Can't put a value on her now. Sometimes very high, sometimes not so much. A considerable investment made over time though.

Tell me about your boat price per pound. Include make, model, year, etc.

pete

 

[Ken E.]

Pete, You are in dangerous territory, pegging admirals' weight to value. But maybe there's an inverse relationship?

 

[oscar]

Interesting concept, although I wonder about it's statistical validity. Apples and Kumquats so to speak..... But I'll play.

A nice vintage 1978 Hatteras 53MY in very good condition..... $2.72/pound.

 

[oscar]

Pete, You are in dangerous territory, pegging admirals' weight to value.

The term "death wish" comes to mind........

 

[koliver]

This thread reminds me of shopping for my first cruising sailboat. That was in 1976. At the time I had quite q few boats in mind. put all of them into a database (before I knew about spreadsheets) to keep track. One of the factors I found to be most indicative of value was price per pound.
At that time, $20k was "real money"
I wanted at least 30'. Most new were about $4/#. When I got one, at only $2/# I though I had done really well.
The next boat cost me $3.68 in 1988 and the last one $3.47
Mind you, the first was brand new, the second 6 yrs old and the last one 14.
@20k is no longer "real money"

Notice how I didn't mention SWMBO?

 

[Gris]

My current boat, the 1983 Hatteras 43 DC, ran about $2.50/lb this year.

 

[Lou_tribal]

Like one said before, things sold by the gram are usually much more fun than things sold by the ton.

L

 

[Simi 60]

1985 Milllkraft trawler
Converted to cruiser 2005

0.52 cents to the lb

 

[DW1979OA]

1979 Ocean Alexander Mk1 stretched to 55’
Purchase in 2012 for $3.42 per lb

That is close to the same price per lb for my 11lb mutt from the humane society. Not touching the Admiral thing.

 

[Art]

I'll gladly touch the Admiral thang!'

Mine is worth more per pound than gold! That I joyfully say!!

Regarding our Tolly: Sept 2008... got her in perf condition for $1.79 a lb. [dry weight]. $1.45 a lb, if ya wanna calc her fully loaded - LOL. And, damn glad we did!

 

[DDW]

40 year old boats can be had for $1-2/lb. New boat $15 - 30/lb depending on build quality. New custom boat $50 - 80+/lb depending on build quality. This is the reason long lasting FRP boats have made boatbuilders lives hell.

 

[jleonard]

Sold mine this summer for about $1.33 per pound.

 

[smitty477]

Bought our last RIB for about $12.50 #.

 

[hmason]

Perhaps more interesting is to divide your life insurance payout by your weight in pounds. That’s something the Admiral could relate to.

 

[David Ess]

Price per pound doesnt even make sense. A new really light, carbon fibre Hinckley costs way more per pound than that old steel garbage scow.

 

[Hippocampus]

Was involved in a LLC building Peter Ibold designs for the US market. We priced boats by the pound. Thought about them when budgeting by the pound. So yes on the production side it was a very meaningful way to look at boats. For full displacement boats done in solid grp or Fe that remains true in large degree imho. But just like with race cars taking off the first few pounds takes hundreds of dollars. Then next few thousands. But the last few tens of thousands. So when talking about some SD, but all foiling or planing hulls you’re spot on and the race car paradigm is probably more appropriate.

 

[Wayfarer]

Well lets see, my 1985 custom aluminum 44 footer worked out to $3.46/lb with about half filled tanks, and 20 years worth of Passagemaker Magazines aboard.

I've no admiral to annoy, but for anyone who's looking, I come at a bulk discount!

 

[woolf]

Was involved in a LLC building Peter Ibold designs for the US market. We priced boats by the pound. Thought about them when budgeting by the pound. So yes on the production side it was a very meaningful way to look at boats. For full displacement boats done in solid grp or Fe that remains true in large degree imho. But just like with race cars taking off the first few pounds takes hundreds of dollars. Then next few thousands. But the last few tens of thousands. So when talking about some SD, but all foiling or planing hulls you’re spot on and the race car paradigm is probably more appropriate.

EUR per kg of finished metal structure is a common way of pricing FE and AL hulls/decks/superstructures (“Kasko”) in Europe.

 

[David Ess]

Hippocampus....so if that Kia SUV costs less per pound than the race car, would it make sense for a race entrant to use one? No....doesnt make sense. The whole notion is nonsense.

 

[David Ess]

Woolf..if its 'common', send us an ad that advertises their boats thus.

 

[Art]

Any way of size/dimension/speed etc for calculating a boat's cost [per lb., per foot, per sq. ft. interior, per mph...] is simply a fun-game of what-if BS!!

IMO - The only way [within reason] to calculate a boat's worth is how much that boat attracts YOU! I.e. what its features are and future use is worth To YOU!

 

[David Ess]

Any way of size/dimension/speed etc for calculating a boat's cost [per lb., per foot, per sq. ft. interior, per mph...] is simply a fun-game of what-if BS!!

IMO - The only way [within reason] to calculate a boat's worth is how much that boat attracts YOU! I.e. what its features are and future use is worth To YOU!

Yes, value is subjective. The beautiful Alva 60 is worth about 2million to me, but to my wife.....nothing. Its weight is irrelevant to all of us.

 

[woolf]

Woolf..if its 'common', send us an ad that advertises their boats thus.

There is any number of metal builders working along this line in Europe: in Germany you might find Yachtwerft Benjamins in Emden or Yachtbau Matzerath in Düren of interest, or Aluship in Poland, if you want to seriously evaluate this option.
You need to send a general construction plan and specify the material to get a quote per kg from a metal hull builder, as quotes are always for a specific design. A box barge structure is obviously much less work to build per kg, than a sailing yacht hull. At delivery, the scale provides the final price.
What to do with the finished metal structure, like DIY or contract to finish elsewhere, is up to the buyer.
For our last sailing yacht design, I got “kasko” quotes from metal builders in Poland, Germany, Holland and France, all per kg of finished metal structure, plus lead at market price for the keel.
For certain popular boat models you may be able to get list prices for hulls/kaskos, but I have never seen that advertised and it is not a market I would be familiar with.
I hope that helps.

 

[David Ess]

Woolf, yes it helps in corroborating what I said....that they dont advertise boats by price per pound. The european builders Ive contacted(the ones that even answer), usually say the basic price is X, plus whatever options you want.

 

[DDW]

Price per pound doesnt even make sense. A new really light, carbon fibre Hinckley costs way more per pound than that old steel garbage scow.

Sure, when you mix in a bunch of independent variables. Remove them and it's pretty accurate. For example, 30 year old production boat in decent condition might be around $2/lb. New carbon production from high end builder might be $50/lb. It is common for yacht designers to estimate costs this way, both for production and custom builds.

 

[David Ess]

"Independant variables"? Those are what make the difference. But i shouldnt have made the comparison to an old scow. Lets compare to a brand new scow. So a new hinckly talaria 55, to some other new boat of the same weight.

 

[FWT]

The cost of electronics is high but it will be about the same whether the boat is 30-35 ft LOA or 50-60. The davit system may not differ. In the east, AC with generator adds a material amount to the cost. Throw in any stabilizers and its not long before "options" take things from the low end to high end.

The price / pound makes some sense, stripped to the "boat". Your choices beyond that have a big impact.

 

[woolf]

Woolf, yes it helps in corroborating what I said....that they dont advertise boats by price per pound. The european builders Ive contacted(the ones that even answer), usually say the basic price is X, plus whatever options you want.

How could they possibly advertise or sell their finished vessels "per pound"? Series built is always priced as list plus extras, be it boats, cars, planes ...

Here I am talking €/kg of finished metal structure, all hot work completed, which is typically 10-15% of of a later final price, before any fitting out starts.

 

[David Ess]

Woolf...they cant...and dont. An empty bare hull, worth only 10 or 15 % of the final price, is NOT selling , or even comparing ...boats by the pound. The notion was ridiculous.

 

[David Ess]

The cost of electronics is high but it will be about the same whether the boat is 30-35 ft LOA or 50-60. The davit system may not differ. In the east, AC with generator adds a material amount to the cost. Throw in any stabilizers and its not long before "options" take things from the low end to high end.

The price / pound makes some sense, stripped to the "boat". Your choices beyond that have a big impact.

Yes, and because of all these variables/options, price per pound means nothing. Its the same with cars and bicycles.