What to do when someone anchors too close

[RickyD]

So we spent most of a week at anchor at Catalina's White's cove. We got in on Thursday morning so plenty of room. Dropped the hook in 63' and put out 190' of chain. This is a very calm area, only light winds predicted. Later others started coming in. One 60'er dropped a bit too close to us by my estimation just to the NW. Then another 65'er dropped a bit too close to us so my SE. I kept a close nervous eye on them and as we swung around back and forth with the changes in wind and current we got close but that was all. Next morning the NW boat was maybe 15' right behind us. Way too close. So I took off in the dinghy to chat with both owners. SE boat, no one home. I told NW owner I was leaving for most of the day and was concerned about our position. He said he was in 50' with 150' of chain out. He was going to stay near for the day so I left it at that. Upon our return in the afternoon we watched both boats would swing close then much further depending on the winds shifting from Calm, to E, to NW, then S. Sunday morning I woke up to NW boat being maybe 10' behind me. Owner said he had let out 50' last night. No way. I pulled in about 10 feet which helped. SW boat owner could see my concern as they drifted close but never budged even when there was plenty of room for him to move to a safer location. (I should have said something then). Then NW boat left. Whew, one down. Monday morning SW boat was close with calm winds we were drifting in opposite directions. They were in the cockpit when we started swinging towards them and they us. I ran to the bow and pulled in some chain but we were straight over the top and I wasn't moving. Then I ran back just as my crew was able to prevent them from hitting me. SW owner was just a little slow to start is engines and slip away, but he didn't pull up chain and move further away. There was a quick "sorry" from the wife. We were leaving soon so I let it go. I know I should have told them to move to a safer location. We could have hit while we slept. Would they have moved? If not, what next?

 

[twistedtree]

I think most people are just oblivious. I think first step would be to say they clearly have anchored too close and would they please relocate. At that point you will know whether you are dealing with reasonable people, or dick heads.


And a side question.... Are you certain you didn't drag during any of this?

 

[DavidM]

After asking the too close boats to move, if they don’t your only real option is to move yourself. Fuggitabout calling the USCG. They have better things to do.

I was on the receiving end of a couple of too close complaints. One was in Annapolis and once the wind shifted I was within a boat length of the boat behind me. I shortened my scope 30’ or so and he was ok with that. In reality my shorter scope put me in more risk of dragging into him, but I had 6:1 out and 5:1 after shortening also with a well set Rocna so I wasn’t worried.

Another case at Deltaville, I was anchored 100’ in front of another boat with an elderly couple on board. They complained and I told them I was well anchored with a good Rocna, so dragging was unlikely and if the wind shifted we would be even farther apart. After some less than pleasant words back and forth, they pulled up anchor and moved.

David

 

[RickyD]

I think most people are just oblivious. I think first step would be to say they clearly have anchored too close and would they please relocate. At that point you will know whether you are dealing with reasonable people, or dick heads.


And a side question.... Are you certain you didn't drag during any of this?

Good question. I'm quite sure I didn't budge. I kept looking at the mooring balls further in and they seemed to be the same distance or further out depending on the swing. When I set the anchor I got a good tug. When I finally pulled the anchor, the windlass was starting to stall as the anchor pulled out. I always let it rest as the anchor works its way out. It is a Mantus. Love it. I have seen the NW boat in Whites Cove many times over the years and I'm thinking that he had his favored spot and he wanted it even if it was a bit close. When I spoke with him, he was very nice but did not offer to move.

 

[sunchaser]

And a side question.... Are you certain you didn't drag during any of this?

This is a fair question. I see a 2 1/2 : 1 scope, lazy offshore swells and drifting boat. Oh oh, what size and type of anchor?

 

[Bacchus]

I dont anchor overnight often but did when we cruised Georgian Bay in 2019.
If anyone was even remotely close to us I'd stop by in the dingy and make sure they were OK with where we were.
One instance a sailboats was on a bow anchor only and could swing 360°. We deployed a stern anchor near shore. As I approached their boat he was in their dingy and approaching me. When we met in the middle I was anticipating the worst when he said HI you must be Don!
After I asked whether we had met and some discussion it turned out he was a friend of a friend and we had swapped emails months before as he shared some local knowledge for the area I knew next to nothing about. It turns out our boat name was the connection.
I also try to check with neighbors re generator running. We ate early AM people and make our coffee early. I try to do this after dinner while the gen is still running purposely. Usually they ask how loud the gen is? When I inform them it's presently running I receive a gracious go ahead.

I have found that a little boater courtesy goes a long way and you never know when you connect with a friend or make a new one.

 

[kthoennes]

...If anyone was even remotely close to us I'd stop by in the dingy and make sure they were OK with where we were...

Unfortunately that's a courtesy that almost never occurs.

 

[RickyD]

This is a fair question. I see a 2 1/2 : 1 scope, lazy offshore swells and drifting boat. Oh oh, what size and type of anchor?

It is an 85lb Mantus and heavy chain road. Sorry I don't know what size it is. I typically anchor here in 100' and put out 300. The Mantus is well tested at 2-1/2 and any pulling in the morning East wind would drag in inshore to shallower waters. These are very calm waters at least last weekend. I started dropping it at 66 ft drifting back. Yes I have a chain counter also. When I pulled up, the windlass stalled at 63 ft. Like I said, putting it down I got a good tug when set. When I'm out 300 I don't get a tug, I think so much chain softens it. No offshore swell. At night it seems as though I'm home in bed for the most part till hit with a passing wake. We did get some morning east winds that kicked up some 1/2 to 1 footers for a few hours and to be sure that was when the NW boat was right behind me and the SE boat well away. As said, NW boat said they dropped in 50', put out 150' and then said they put out another 50'. No way, they would have been told to move by Harbor Patrol for being too close to the morings.

 

[psneeld]

With out more info....

1. How close is too close? Some anchorages just pack them in.

2. Some boats are the outliers and swing not in unison.... is it your boat or the other?

3. Is it an anchorage that you frequent? Is there a "customary" scope/swing?

4. 190 feet of light chain may be equal to 150 feet of heavy chain in terms of swing.... so a customary swing radius may be determined by other factors than chain out length... especially in light wind conditions.

5. Last time I was T-boned hard at 0300, I asked what the other couple whose boat was sailing a giant triangle instead of just hanging in unison with others what they would do.... they wouldn't move because they thought it too dangerous in the dark. But they did stay up and man the motor all night not to hit me. They blew out at dawn without even a sorry, but they didn't hit me again....maybe something about my saying the first hit was free, the second would result in a very bad visit from the local USCG. I know most times the USCG won't respond till after damage...but I know how to play that game better than most.....and the old couple knew I was serious and didn't like being awake at 0300.

6. Popular anchorages are tough...sorta like busy roads and parking lots.... not everyone has the same courtesies and limits as others and without enforceable rules...not much you can do but have a nice chat explaining your concerns and all the physics of anchoring as you understand them and I just barely touched on.

 

[RickyD]

Unfortunately that's a courtesy that almost never occurs.

I always visit my neighbors when they seem close or if I'm worried that they will think I ended up too close to them. I need to be tougher on those too close to me.

 

[O C Diver]

If you think someone is to close, communicate that point to them. Don't assume they know how much scope you have out, or they have out. That's right, a surprising number of people don't know what they have out. The point is to be nice, but indicate your concern. It shows your concern; that they anchored after you; that you expressed concern and asked them to move before the accident.

Sadly, if they choose not to move and you don't, you're partly neglected for choosing not to avoid a potential accident.

Ted

 

[RedRascal]

Good question on what to do, it sucks when you want to go have fun rather than think about an insurance claim. After having the scope conversation and confirming both boats are at equal or similar then I'd see if the wheels are turning for them that they realize the boats could hit. If they get it then I'd ask if they were going to maintain some type of watch to fend off if their boat swung within collision distance. If they didn't get it then try to educate them and maybe they will clue into the fact that they created a problem and will move. With the NW boat I am not sure I would have pulled in scope but would have communicated they were too close to force the issue. If you guys were that close it seems you were in boat to boat chatting range which can be friendly chat.

Last week I was the boat that crowded another boat after a tide change in a tight anchorage. I went over in the dinghy to chat about scope with the other boat, adjusted our scope but I still didn't like it so we moved. I have had people that will happily pull in scope if they thought they had an extra amount out. However I never ask them to adjust or want them to reduce scope to an unsafe level. Once I even suggested someone add scope because of current and didn't want them to drag.

 

[guy with a boat]

White’s cove is a tough place to anchor for several reasons. The primary reason is that there are lots of boats and lots of casual boaters without much experience. The bottom gets deep pretty quickly and there is quite a bit of kelp in areas.

People will come in and drop anchor, often unaware of scope, they feel the boat stop and they are satisfied that they are anchored. In reality, the anchor is only stuck in the kelp and not buried. Wind comes up and who knows how far they drag.

Aside from kelp issues, the anchorage area is pretty limited between the moorings and the depth dropping off. Boaters come in for the weekend and put the anchor wherever it seems like there is available space. Many don’t have much knowledge about good anchoring practices. Unfortunately there are few alternative anchorages and so they stuff the boat in where they can.

As long as the wind stays steady, it all works out. Often in the summer, the wind drops to zero at night and the boats all sort of drift around in different directions based on weight, windage etc.

Bottom line is that it can be a tough place to sleep on a busy night. I’ve had to move in the night twice due to the above issues with boats that came in after us. Another time I was on a friends boat and got bumped in the night by another latecomer that was also asleep. The boats were pushed apart and everyone went back to bed.

You probably did everything right and close quarters is just part of the program. You sometimes have to grin and bear it or avoid the place on a busy weekend.

 

[sunchaser]

It is an 85lb Mantus and heavy chain road. Sorry I don't know what size it is. I typically anchor here in 100' and put out 300. The Mantus is well tested at 2-1/2 and any pulling in the morning East wind would drag in inshore to shallower waters. These are very calm waters at least last weekend. .

RD
Good anchor, good set and you did it right. As mentioned by others, too many other boaters that were overly careless.

 

[soin2la]

RD
Good anchor, good set and you did it right. As mentioned by others, too many other boaters that were overly careless.

Or clueless.
Or arrogant.
Or don't care.

https://slowboat.com/2022/08/airship-south-from-sitka/

 

[Hippocampus]

Don’t like confrontation. Like to keep a low profile so other than saying hello avoid interactions unless people are friendly.
So my protocol is when they are anchoring get the dinghy ready if it isn’t already. If they are too close (use a golfing range finder for this to get an accurate measurement) jump in the dingy and using the cell phone start taking a lot of pictures as I circle them. . If they ask tell them I’m taking pictures for the insurance claim to come. That usually starts a polite conversation rather than a yelling match. Explain my pictures show
I was here first and they not me anchored too close.
Identifies them so no chance for hit and run.
Is done at a time when it’s easier for them to relocate.

Unfortunately when we’re off the boat it doesn’t work as well but I still do that protocol. It’s rare they don’t listen. If they don’t and I can I relocate rather than get into a confrontation. Surprisingly the same kind of thing happens in mooring fields. Folks putting a 60’ boat on a mooring made for the swing of a 40’er. Then call the harbormaster and tell them tell the offending boat to move.

Recent years it seems all too many don’t know how to anchor and you see people with ridiculously short scope or using what you would consider a lunch hook when squalls predicted. Then will engage in a chat politely explaining the problem. If not receptive do the pictures and place my fenders out where I think they may hit me. This problem has gotten so bad in some places I just avoid them. Block island is a leading example.

 

[DDW]

One useful tool is a laser rangefinder, commonly used in golf. This tells you exactly how far you are away. It is often not easy to judge with accuracy. Another useful tool is bagpipes. If someone comes milling around close looking like they they are going to drop closer than you want, get out the bagpipes and start piping on the foredeck. Most people will find someone else to bother.

 

[guy with a boat]

Don’t like confrontation. Like to keep a low profile so other than saying hello avoid interactions unless people are friendly.
So my protocol is when they are anchoring get the dinghy ready if it isn’t already. If they are too close (use a golfing range finder for this to get an accurate measurement) jump in the dingy and using the cell phone start taking a lot of pictures as I circle them. . If they ask tell them I’m taking pictures for the insurance claim to come.

You must have an impressively smooth delivery if this works for you. I can tell you if someone did this to me, our relationship would not go in a positive direction.

I don’t know block island, but trying to teach or enforce good anchoring practices in White’s would be an exercise in frustration. Much better to avoid it at busy times if the chaos is too much. Pull out your rangefinder, camera, and insurance company threats there and you won’t like how it goes.

 

[O C Diver]

Don’t like confrontation. Like to keep a low profile so other than saying hello avoid interactions unless people are friendly.
So my protocol is when they are anchoring get the dinghy ready if it isn’t already. If they are too close (use a golfing range finder for this to get an accurate measurement) jump in the dingy and using the cell phone start taking a lot of pictures as I circle them. . If they ask tell them I’m taking pictures for the insurance claim to come. That usually starts a polite conversation rather than a yelling match. Explain my pictures show
I was here first and they not me anchored too close.
Identifies them so no chance for hit and run.
Is done at a time when it’s easier for them to relocate.

The problem with this scenario is that one of your first obligations as a mariner is to use all means available to avoid a collision. It's a federal law. If you think a collision is eminent, and you choose not to avoid it (move your boat), you may be as liable as the person who anchored to close to you.

Ted

 

[Blissboat]

After asking the too close boats to move, if they don’t your only real option is to move yourself.

Annoying as hell, but true and increasingly common. Anchoring seems to be another of the boating skills on the "endangered" list.

 

[soin2la]

Annoying as hell, but true and increasingly common. Anchoring seems to be another of the boating skills on the "endangered" list.

There are probably some who do this intentionally. You move, they win.

 

[hollywood8118]

I would thing a insurance claim while anchored would be hard to prove fault..you might be there first but your boat t-bones a boat that came in 2nd .. and its the other boats fault?. yes it sucks . I take the approach of giving them the stink eye if the start to anchor too close and if the don't move I do.
Hollywood

 

[BruceK]

Earl R Hinz, author of The Complete Book of Anchoring and Mooring, says on p275 dealing with "Etiquette of Anchoring" "no one has the right to infringe on the... boat already at anchor". He spells it out in various ways but unfortunately there are those who don`t read books like his,lack commonsense and courtesy and for whom "etiquette" is a foreign French word.
Reluctant as I am to let them get away with it, it`s better to move if you have to, than share the OP`s experience.
Sometimes appearing on the foredeck and observing intently a "too close" anchoring leads to them adjusting position.

 

[Simi 60]

I usually avoid busy anchorages like COVID and am up anchored and off somewhere off the tourist strip by Friday afternoon
but if we do get caught out or have someone drop in I step out on the Portugese bridge with a camera and tell them I am taking photographic evidence for insurance purposes for when our 65 tonne swings through them on change of tide or wind shift.

And then there's Rammstein. (-;

 

[CaptTom]

I've been known to put out fenders. Especially if it's a tight mooring field and neither boat really has a choice. But it works for anchorages, too.

There's always the universal hand-on-hips "bit*h stare."

 

[jleonard]

I've been known to put out fenders. Especially if it's a tight mooring field and neither boat really has a choice. But it works for anchorages, too.

There's always the universal hand-on-hips "bit*h stare."

I also would put out fenders if I thought someone had the potential.
I also never minded if someone anchored close off my stern. But don’t anchor too close in front of me because I put out more scope than most.


Block Island was always the worst for tight anchorage’s. And the wind and current inside was so unpredictable, everybody often swung in different directions. More than once I would knock on someone’s hull (we were that close) and ask them to pull in some code so we could swing past.
Never got hit other than on fenders and very lightly.

Oh and I had a boating buddy that carried a sling shot and has been known to loft ice cubes onto invasive boats. We’ve also started our Smokey diesels at times to discourage a boat who attempted to anchor too close. It usually worked.
But that was in my waaay younger years lol

 

[Blissboat]

There's always the universal hand-on-hips "bit*h stare."

Yeah, I have employed that technique from the foredeck more than a few times, with mixed results. Maybe I haven't perfected the "stare," but then also a lot of 21st century boaters seem immune from shame, embarrassment or any self-doubt about themselves as brilliant, capable and manly sailors from manly sailing ports.

 

[Gdavid]

I've been known to put out fenders. Especially if it's a tight mooring field and neither boat really has a choice. But it works for anchorages, too.

There's always the universal hand-on-hips "bit*h stare."

I enjoy the moniker "b!tch wings"

 

[Hippocampus]

I usually avoid busy anchorages like COVID and am up anchored and off somewhere off the tourist strip by Friday afternoon
but if we do get caught out or have someone drop in I step out on the Portugese bridge with a camera and tell them I am taking photographic evidence for insurance purposes for when our 65 tonne swings through them on change of tide or wind shift.

And then there's Rammstein. (-;

It’s a way to start the conversation. Have found folks don’t want their boat struck as well. Folks don’t want to involve insurance nor lawyers. Yes if you go in with hey you have to move you’re not going to get far. If you go in with I’m doing this because I think you’re too close. Lets look at this and you can see your swing circle with intersect with where I’ll be you get a different response. I’ve used this as a start to the conversation. Often people just don’t know they’re placing themselves at jeopardy. My understanding is at the time of anchoring there’s no collision. Fortunately I’ve yet to have to move but likely would if they were intransigent and risk justified. Like Simi have found this a viable technique and offer it as such. Yes your mileage may vary.
Like Simi I try to avoid this ever occurring. Except when being far away carries a high risk of theft anchor at the outside perimeter of the anchorage. Like the quiet and don’t mind a longer dinghy ride. Although charts show designated anchorages depending upon weather it’s unusual there isn’t a host of other places to anchor. Like Simi will avoid popular anchorages. Particularly on weekends and holidays. Enjoy when school is in session. Less people on the water. Enjoy the shoulder seasons best.
The other hassle is finding your anchor is under someone’s else boat. Very annoying when they aren’t on the boat. Depending upon how many crew I have and time constraints will admit to launching the dinghy and using it to move the offending boat to be able to leave. I haven’t done this in decades as I’ve figured out if you talk to them the day before you want to leave you can work something out. Usually either they will leave first or they will shorten scope briefly and let you leave before they’re gone for the day.
Also found it’s worthwhile watching nearby boats anchor. Wife is good at estimating amount put out and identifying the anchor. Again worth a conversation but here is a reason to move. Found people with inadequate anchors or rode are more likely to be arrogant jerks.

 

[ksanders]

Solving the too close boat problem is easy...

Go take a shower.

Dry off on the foredeck.

Problem solved.