lake okeechobee

[Duetto]

hi all,

we just went from fl west to east thru lake o. we have a saltwater toilet. on the west side of the lake, chlosohatchee river, the intake water is a dirty brown but on the east side of the, st lucie river, it's pretty clear. the difference is dramatic.

anybody know what's making the difference?

 

[High Wire]

From Lake O to St Lucie Lock is fresh water from the lake. After St Lucie Lock to the east is tidal saltwater.

 

[Duetto]

yes but lake o feeds fw into the calusahatchee river also, so there's something else.

 

[fryedaze]

Inquiring minds want to know[emoji16]
Maybe it is related to flow rates and the particulates settling out at lower flow rates.
I just pulled that out my butt.
Graphs are Mayaka and Moore Haven dams. Moore Haven is 4X Mayaka.

 

[Duetto]

you're probably right.

i was thinking it might be that mayaca is fed right off lake whereas moorehaven is fed from marsh, etc and rim route.

 

[hoffsquared]

There is more water from Lake O released west down the Caloosahatchee than to the East through St. Lucie and to the south to the Everglades Agricultural Area.

This is an ongoing issue for those living in the Cape Coral/Ft. Myers area. The powers that be have decided that the Caloosahatchee bears the brunt of any Lake O releases and holds harmless those in the agricultural area to the south and the St. Lucie area to the east. As a result, we see too much water in the rainy season and, generally, too little water in the dry season. In the dry season, waters are released to the south to ensue perfect growing conditions for agriculture. This results in salinity levels that are too high over the winter in many areas up the Caloosahatchee. In the wet season, it can be pretty bad with lots of water released from Lake O and accompanying muddy water.

I’m glad there is clear water along the St. Lucie but wish the burden of Lake O releases would be spread around a bit.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Welcome aboard Mr./Ms. h.

 

[Duetto]

if i were on the coolshatchee side i'd be calling stuart to figure out how to clean up the water. i know purity & clarity aren't the same but i'd take the clarity with or without the purity. i see the clarity as amazing.

 

[Dougcole]

I keep my boat just downstream from St. Lucie lock, so it gets lots of water from Lake O. It's pretty clear right now, for some reason, but it is damn dirty, like dangerous dirty, most of the time.



I'm glad it is at least a little better on the east side for now, but the only long term solution is to stop the influence coming from the various lobbies, clean up the darn lake and restore some semblance of a natural southern flow. Thankfully, interests on both sides of the aisle (including our governor) are FINALLY seeing the value in this and some slow progress is being made (over the kicking and screaming of the agricultural interests).


It's a huge issue directly affecting somewhere in the nature of 20 million people, one of the biggest, if not the biggest, environmental issues in the entire country. It amazes me how few people outside of Florida know about it though.

 

[hoffsquared]

This is an excellent documentary about the Everglades, Lake O, attempts to “tame” the water, and resulting impacts.

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/films/swamp/

 

[Duetto]

between frydaze and my wife, i think we might have the answer. my wife observed that the st lucie lock has been closed for 3 months, so flow has been virtually zero. enter frydaze's theory that the low flow allows the dirt to settle and water to clear.

if that's the case the brown water will be back by the fall.

 

[psneeld]

My main question is how dirty would the water in the St Lucie River appear as opposed to the Caloosahatchee is neither was impacted by lake water?

How far and how much "ocean water" influence is there the farther you get upstream?

Hor much runoff into both is from canals not associated with the main waterway canal?

Is it more sediment related or by suspended particles unaffected by flow for the distance travelled?

Is the big difference seasonal, random, just a fluke right now, rainfall related, etc...etc...?

There are a LOT of unanswered questions that might have a significant twist in the answer....

 

[hoffsquared]

If you search on “ caloosahatchee river runoff sanibel images” in Google, you will see what happens in our area routinely in the summer when USACE releases water primarily to the west during the rainy months.

 

[hoffsquared]

There is a lot of agricultural impact below Lake O (cattle) but we see massive amounts of nutrients when excess water is released from the lake.

 

[psneeld]

I Googled "caloosahatchee river runoff sanibel images"

One of the main headlines was.....

"Once Again, Dirty Water Flows into the Caloosahatchee from Downtown Fort Myers Construction after Eta’s Soaking"

As I said, many questions to answer on not so simple a question.

Are there issues with lake discharge into both rivers? Sure...lots of info on that.

But to say without serious doubt why one river seems more brown in just a relative moment in time? One will never convince without a lot more questions answered and/or a chemical analysis fingerprinting the "browninsh" water described in the OP.

PS...not long ago I read an article that said many rivers in North America were much different in color since the ability to detect from satellite imagery. Here is an article that popped up, dont't think it is the same one I read.

https://apnews.com/article/united-states-algae-4d9b64798fd47d91e7a02c3869eeeac7

 

[hoffsquared]

There are releases to both rivers from Lake O. Historically, the Caloosahatchee receives more that the agricultural area and St. Lucie.

Lots of reasons for water quality in our area. Over-development, lack of septic regulations, agricultural run-off. Lake O water management policy is a BIG contributor to poor water quality in SWFL and the degradation of the Everglades.

Billions of federal and state dollars being spent on this issue. Long, slow, complicated, contentious, and meandering process of restoration.

 

[psneeld]

There are releases to both rivers from Lake O. Historically, the Caloosahatchee receives more that the agricultural area and St. Lucie.

Lots of reasons for water quality in our area. Over-development, lack of septic regulations, agricultural run-off. Lake O water management policy is a BIG contributor to poor water quality in SWFL and the degradation of the Everglades.

Billions of federal and state dollars being spent on this issue. Long, slow, complicated, contentious, and meandering process of restoration.

All true...I have been following (sorta) since the 70's since I was first stationed in Florida.

But all that doesn't necessarily answer the question in post #1 of why on one or several particular days the water was significantly different. The question remains, was it because a release? Or is it that way much of the time?
Where was the "toilet" water pumped aboard? How much staYed in the lines till out of both river systems?

Many, many factors......

 

[hoffsquared]

Good point.

For us…seems that the winds, tide cycles, water temps, and storms change our relative water clarity daily.

 

[Spike]

I'd like to add that what many people refer to as "dirty" looking in the Caloosahatchee is the natural result of Tannins in the water which give it a tea color. I dive in the Ft. Myers downtown area often cleaning our boat and the visibility is usually 8-10 feet without a light. We're not in the area now so I don't know if conditions are somehow different.

I'll agree that time of year, rain and lake discharge contribute to how far the brown colored water reaches into the gulf. The tides usually keep the color to about mm 0 on the ICW but heavy runoff from the east can push it much farther out.

 

[fryedaze]

My main question is how dirty would the water in the St Lucie River appear as opposed to the Caloosahatchee is neither was impacted by lake water?

How far and how much "ocean water" influence is there the farther you get upstream?

Hor much runoff into both is from canals not associated with the main waterway canal?

Is it more sediment related or by suspended particles unaffected by flow for the distance travelled?

Is the big difference seasonal, random, just a fluke right now, rainfall related, etc...etc...?

There are a LOT of unanswered questions that might have a significant twist in the answer....

The should be no ocean water impact. The interaction stops well down stream at the first lock and dam.

 

[psneeld]

The should be no ocean water impact. The interaction stops well down stream at the first lock and dam.

Which side? I may disagree about the ocean influence on the east side to withing a few miles of the St Lucie Lock. Plus it is volume of lock and overflow discharge versus totalwater turnover....and how far upstream it occurs.

 

[fryedaze]

Which side? I may disagree about the ocean influence on the east side to withing a few miles of the St Lucie Lock. Plus it is volume of lock and overflow discharge versus totalwater turnover....and how far upstream it occurs.

My point is, there is no saltwater above the St Lucie Dam on the east side and no saltwater above the Franklin dam on the west.

 

[psneeld]

My point is, there is no saltwater above the St Lucie Dam on the east side and no saltwater above the Franklin dam on the west.

True...but the OP wasn't real specific where the difference in color was noticed east and west.

And my point is because of that variable and so many others, trying to say it's one thing or another is just really a guess.

Are we talking only to those locks or beyond all the way to near the ocean? The answer to this may help a bit.

 

[rwaldrop13]

We have a saltwater toilet...

All true...I have been following (sorta) since the 70's since I was first stationed in Florida.

But all that doesn't necessarily answer the question in post #1 of why on one or several particular days the water was significantly different. The question remains, was it because a release? Or is it that way much of the time?
Where was the "toilet" water pumped aboard? How much staYed in the lines till out of both river systems?

Many, many factors......

As the liveaboard owners of a Hatteras in Ft Myers I can attest that saltwater toilets in our area are usually "cloudy brown" water. We have a saltwater head aft and a freshwater head midships. The water in the saltwater head is at best cloudy brown. We spray 2-3 squirts of white vinegar in after flushing to control odor/reduce buildup I. The hose. Other than that deal with the appearance.

 

[blackbird]

locals take

i grew up in ft. Myers, the colusahathee river has always looked dirty / Brown,
because of the tannins in the water created by the decay of organic matter/
I. E. leaves, foliage that has made its way into the water..of course that was 60 years ago,,