Alternator Issues

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nveater

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 4, 2021
Messages
78
Vessel Name
Pathfinder
Vessel Make
Mainship Pilot 30
I have a new to me 1999 Mainship Pilot 30 with the cummins 6BT 5.9M engine. On my trip from old marina to new marina, I noticed I was getting no readings from the alternator with the engine running. Once at the new berth, I took a multi meter to batteries and indeed the alternator was not charging batteries. The meter showed 12.7 volts at field on alternator all the connections looked good i.e. no corrosion and tight. Today I went to the boat and tried the engine this time it was charging to 12.8 volts- I am confused any thoughts before I call in a mechanic. Oh by the way the previous owner replaced the alternator in 2019 ( maybe that's a clue)
 
What alternator do you have, a Delco 24SI, Leece Neville, or something else?
 
So yes great question, I don't know :( but I will find out tomorrow and post reply
 
If you were running a generator with a battery charger turned on the charging voltage may have been high enough to keep the alternator from charging.
 
Also, do you have a little charge light on the dash somewhere and does it come on with ignition on/engine off? If so check to see it stays on or goes off when engine starts. Does the tach work off the alternator? If so is it still giving you a reading when engine is running?



Just for grins, with ignition turned on and engine off see if a screwdriver will stick to the rear bearing cover on the alternator. doesn't have to stick firmly but just see if it feels like there's a magnet in there somewhere, if you have a shield in the back just use a skinny screwdriver to touch that cover.


If you have room to take it, a pic of the back and one of the data tag would be helpful.
 
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So no generator, but the battery charger was on
 
There is no charge light- I turn on power to the engine at the dc panel and then use a rocker switch on dash to start engine. When the rocker switch is energized the gauges come alive. I'll have to double check about where the tach gets its data but it does work. I'll try the magnet trick tomorrow and get data re the alternator.
 
OK, if there is normally a charge light, usually just that little red light that looks like a battery, track that down as that light absolutely needs to be lit with the key on and the engine off. How it works is that light is what the current flows through to energize the field- when the alternator isn't spinning it isn't creating any electricity so the current flows and the light goes on. When the alternator starts spinning then it creates its own voltage which then makes it stop being a ground so no current flows through the bulb and it goes out. Pretty clever and simple system, except for when that damn little bulb burns out or gets an open in the wiring somewhere then the owner goes & installs a new alternator and guess what, problem is still there! Anyway, long as you're certain that little battery light is there and not lighting up, go under the dash and first check it is getting voltage and if it is pull it out, test it with your meter and if it's bad replace it. Hopefully that will solve your problem! And if not we'll go to plan B next!
 
OK, reading that again you may mean there is no charge light equipped on the dash. (apologies it's been a long day for me!). Does your alternator have a plug or 3 (or so) terminals with nuts on them? One of those should power up with the key, but I'll wait until I can see a couple of pics so I don't look like an idiot any more than necessary. :)
 
To troubleshoot your alternator you need to disconnect your charger/shore power. Then start engine, increase engine RPM to 1000-1200, then measure starting battery voltage. It should be > 13 V eventually increasing to 14V once batteries are fully charged.
 
The alternator is a 150 amp 19 SI 3 wire unit. There is plug at the top of the unit with a white and red- the white doesn't appear to be connected to anything. There is a terminal below the plug with a red wire which I assume is connected to the battery bank(s). I have tried starting the engine and reving it up and there seems to be no charge going to bateries
 
When you look at that wire connector and you have the 3 wires- Fat red wire bolted to the back which as you correctly guess goes to the battery, then you have the plastic connector that plugs into the alternator with the red and white wires. And on yours the white wire isn't connected to anything. And apologies for asking a dumb question but you are certain the white wire on the pigtail looks like it hasn't been used and not simply broken off from another lead that might be hanging a foot or two away from the alternator at this point?


Anyway, usually both those wires on the pigtail are energized with ignition on. However some are configured as a single wire and don't use that white wire at all.



First thing to do is confirm that both wires show battery voltage with key on. (those wires probably also show voltage with key off but in case a previous owner has installed a relay somewhere check with key on). Often with an alternator replacement or upgrade that red wire on the pigtail might just have a ring terminal put on it and bolted to the output terminal with the charging wire.



Anyway, if you have 12V to both start the engine and for grins make sure you don't show a charge at the BAT terminal on the back of the alternator. NOW, here's where you can start making decisions as Captain- that little white wire? If this alternator has been converted to a "single wire" there's a couple ways that was done and without taking things apart there's not a good way to be certain which way, at least as far as I know. A common way used to be to put a tiny resistor between those 2 terminals, which go to the regulator BTW. If it were me and my boat, I'd strip a clean end on the white wire and while engine is running just give the bare end of the pigtail wire a tap against the battery terminal post and see if the alternator comes to life again and starts charging. If it doesn't, one last diagnostic test for the alternator is if you have clearance and it's safe, look on the back of the alternator and you'll see one hole that looks D shaped. If you look in that hole with a flashlight you should see a metal tab about 3/8" or so in. If you short that tab to ground by using a small screwdriver or pick against the side of the hole it should bypass the regulator and start charging if the problem is the regulator is bad. This is just for diagnostic reasons and actually unnecessary as the kits to rebuild these have the parts for pretty much everything that can go bad so identifying exactly which component has failed is kinda unnecessary.



Anyway I hope that ramble helps a little bit, main thing is to just make certain the white wire hasn't broken off from somewhere else and check the other wire is getting battery voltage and if still no-go try energizing the white wire anyway. If it is still dead then you're going to need to remove and either repair or replace the alternator. If that's the case and there is still an automotive electrical repair business nearby it should only be ~$100 to have yours rebuilt but we can burn that bridge when we get there.
 
Lot of great ideas and suggestions- I hopefully will get to the boat tomorrow and try out some things from your post. Interesting is that there is not a fat wire ( 2 or 4) on what I beleive is the battery lead but smaller like #10 or #8. I will recheck the white wire as well- I'll get some pics too
 
Lot of great ideas and suggestions- I hopefully will get to the boat tomorrow and try out some things from your post. Interesting is that there is not a fat wire ( 2 or 4) on what I beleive is the battery lead but smaller like #10 or #8. I will recheck the white wire as well- I'll get some pics too
That's sounds like a PO upgraded the alt from a low A unit to the 150A one but never considered the wiring. 150A on a #10 or even #8 not appropriate IMO.
You will want to size it for much lower V drop depending on round trip distance to battys.
I used a clamp on ammeter to check my alt output when having issues.
Clamp on and monitor while a second hand starts engine and then increases RPM.
 
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It seems to me that the best course of action based on your level of knowledge and the fact that most boat fires are electrical in origin that you get a MARINE electrician on board.

Trying to save a few $$ay not be the best approach.

BTW, I don't have any red lights either.

Good luck.
 
It seems to me that the best course of action based on your level of knowledge and the fact that most boat fires are electrical in origin that you get a MARINE electrician on board.

Trying to save a few $$ay not be the best approach.

BTW, I don't have any red lights either.

Good luck.

I strongly second what Nepidae says above. Not only to mitigate the risk of fire, but for the wealth of knowledge to be gleaned from a professional marine (ABYC-certified) electrician aboard. No telling WHAT he (or she) will find, all to your benefit. Yours is a relatively simple boat. Not much $$ in the long view of things.

Regards,

Pete
 
I appreciate all the great ideas and thoughts . I did call in a professional and he removed the alternator for bench review and repair should know soon of the problem - he was able to examine the wiring once removed and felt it was appropriate . I was looking at something else. I ll post the outcome to close out the thread
 
So follow up- the alternator was removed from the boat and sent to the shop. They pronounced it dead on arrival- a new alternator has been installed and seems to be working as advertised. The reason for the alternator's demise has not been determined. The boat wiring was checked and appears to be sized and run correctly. Thanks again for all the comments- bottom line I learned a lot more about alternators than I had
 
The reason for the alternator's demise has not been determined. The boat wiring was checked and appears to be sized and run correctly.

Heat kills alternators, and 150 amps is bigger than OEM. Do you have an external regulator that limits alternator temperature?
 
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