Helmsman 38 sleeping area privacy curtain

[Doug_Snider]

One of the attractive features on the Helmsman 38 is the ability to use three separate sleeping areas. We have heard that privacy for the salon can be achieved by hanging a curtain from a high tension wire running fore and aft the length of the salon. We haven’t seen a photo of that. Adding a wire to the salon doesn’t appeal to me and it would take a pretty big curtain.

The opening between the pilot house and salon seems like an easier opening to close. A privacy closure at that location would separate the pilot house from the salon / galley. It would be pretty easy to temporarily place a spring-loaded shower curtain rod across the opening in the recess above the steps and hang a curtain from it. The opening above the refrigerator would also need a closure, either a curtain or rigid panel.

I’d love to hear from other H38 owners how they have separated the sleeping areas. Photos would be helpful.

 

[FWT]

Doug: I obviously don't have the experience you are looking for. But since no one with experience has jumped in, I'll just relate what I think I know.

The idea of a curtain across the steps to the pilothouse area was an idea that I came across somewhere in my research before my contract. Perhaps it was shown in some sales brokerage YouTube? I can't recall. I mentioned this to Scott as we were going through the details leading to the contract. He gave me what I thought at the time was a good reason to not go in that direction, and instead revert to the standard idea to split the salon fore to aft. For the life of me, I can't recall exactly the reasons. I think one had to do with the fact the owners would be shut out of the kitchen area for morning coffee and the like. But another had to do with the fact it gets complicated by needing curtains of two heights, one full length at the steps and a half size behind the pilot seat. Seems to me there was some issue of not having a good place to anchor lines on the starboard side, but not sure of that.

You are way ahead of me on this. But I just came away reverting back to the standard way. Eye hooks fore and aft. Rig a line easily removed, and very light weight curtains due to sag. I figured I'd have to get up close and personal with the plans once I have the boat to figure out things like whether there is any clean way to get support for it in the middle if needed.

You might want to chat with Scott.

So that's not the experience you seek, but just a few thoughts.

I will be interested in what you come up with.

 

[Doug_Snider]

We also had that conversation with Scott. I don’t remember why he favored the fore and aft curtain. I think it’s a personal decision depending on what guests will be aboard and what level of privacy is needed. I personally don’t see myself getting up and making coffee while guests are still sleeping. Our espresso machine is going to occupy the centerline cabinet, so coffee isn’t served until all hands are on deck.

We have pretty much settled on a curtain that closes the pilot house off from the salon/galley. We plan to use 7/16” spring tension curtain rods at two locations, in the recess above the steps and at the ceiling above the refrigerator. There’s a piece of trim that protrudes far enough below the ceiling to anchor one end of the rod and the other end butts up against the wood shape projecting from the bulkhead above and starboard of the refrigerator (rod location shown in white in the photo). There will be a long curtain above the steps and a short one above the refrigerator. The curtain rods require no screws and no holes. They curtains will roll up on the rods for storage when they are not needed.

We’re looking at heavy privacy curtains with weighted bottoms. The weight won’t be an issue for the short spans and it’s a lot less material than would be required to run the length of the salon. The two curtains will have Velcro at the edges where they meet. When I get further into it, I’ll post a drawing.

 

[FWT]

That should work well.

And, if morning coffee becomes a barrier I'd just temporarily put the pot on cabinet top behind the helm seat for the evening / morning.

 

[Doug_Snider]

Here’s what the curtains would look like. I made them transparent and two different colors for clarity. The curtains will be off the shelf items with the short panel modified. No holes in the beautiful teak and everything disappears when not in use. This would also work on a Helmsman 43.

 

[FWT]

I like it.

 

[Helmsman]

I think we will go with a curtain down the center line. Since you guys brought Scott up, I think I remember him telling me he ran a line down the middle of his 38 to close off the sleeping space, I asked him about it some time around the time I signed the contract. I agree about putting holes in the teak. One option would be shower curtain poles like you suggest Doug, if some long enough could be found. I believe for us, we will put eye hooks up or perhaps a stainless steel line that runs the length, and anchored on the center beam that crosses the ceiling.

Another thought was to put a rail up the full length of the cabin. Could be used as a hand hold in rough seas, too. Something I will think through after using the boat a little, I think.

I like the idea of the running it across the pilot house access. But, I’d do think being able to access the galley and the cockpit would be something I would want. Mainly family and very close friends on the boat for us. At least that has been the case in the last boat.

 

[PattiS]

Our reason for wanting to separate the salon from the pilot house is to allow Doug’s son and wife a little privacy in the salon and their teenage sons can sleep in the pilot house.

 

[FWT]

Another thought was to put a rail up the full length of the cabin. Could be used as a hand hold in rough seas, too. Something I will think through after using the boat a little, I think.

One thing that has been done, seen in some brokerage video, is to install a ceiling handhold (like those in the pilothouse) in the salon that runs fore and aft that run much of the way. This could be done attractively and then used to thread a line through it mid way for additional support.

 

[Doug_Snider]

The 38E is a very versatile boat and there is no right or wrong solution. I started this thread hoping to see some photographs showing how owners have separated the sleeping areas. At about 11:20in this video from Helmsman’s Canadian outlet, the narrator suggests that a dividing curtain between the pilot house and the salon/galley is a factory option. https://youtu.be/P6HcTT1f0TM
I don’t think we’ll know what works best until we get the boat and try some things out. At least our first solution is cheap and will leave no marks.

 

[Helmsman]

The 38E is a very versatile boat and there is no right or wrong solution. I started this thread hoping to see some photographs showing how owners have separated the sleeping areas. At about 11:20in this video from Helmsman’s Canadian outlet, the narrator suggests that a dividing curtain between the pilot house and the salon/galley is a factory option. https://youtu.be/P6HcTT1f0TM
I don’t think we’ll know what works best until we get the boat and try some things out. At least our first solution is cheap and will leave no marks.

The boat in that video has the same color scheme on the exterior, with the Kingston gray and the white bimini, as ours.

 

[Doug_Snider]

It looks nice, especially with the radar arch. We show friends and family that video to give them a better idea of what we're getting.

 

[Phyrcooler]

It looks nice, especially with the radar arch. We show friends and family that video to give them a better idea of what we're getting.

Are you going with the straight galley, or the “L” galley?
I’ve been eyeing this boat for a future retirement/Loop boat.

 

[Doug_Snider]

Are you going with the straight galley, or the “L” galley?
I’ve been eyeing this boat for a future retirement/Loop boat.

We’re going with the standard “L” galley. We ordered a Stressless recliner for the recess aft of the galley. It will have upholstery matching the settees and helm chair.

 

[FWT]

Are you going with the straight galley, or the “L” galley?
I’ve been eyeing this boat for a future retirement/Loop boat.

L for us too

 

[Helmsman]

And for us

 

[Phyrcooler]

We’re going with the standard “L” galley. We ordered a Stressless recliner for the recess aft of the galley. It will have upholstery matching the settees and helm chair.

L for us too

And for us

My preference as well. I was showing a video tour of the boat to wife a week or 3 ago. I had to pause it and show her the L galley on their website. She concurs! I also must have a forward facing first mate seat on the bridge so that person isn’t sitting sideways. Maybe best done by a sliding backrest for first mate, that swings to allow that person to sit facing forwards whilst underway, and facing aft while seating with others around the table.

 

[Helmsman]

My preference as well. I was showing a video tour of the boat to wife a week or 3 ago. I had to pause it and show her the L galley on their website. She concurs! I also must have a forward facing first mate seat on the bridge so that person isn’t sitting sideways. Maybe best done by a sliding backrest for first mate, that swings to allow that person to sit facing forwards whilst underway, and facing aft while seating with others around the table.

I will have two helm seats up top. The captains seat will be in the middle with the other seat to starboard. I would talk with Scott on the idea of having the pilot’s seat to starboard. That could very well be a viable option.

 

[FWT]

My preference as well. I was showing a video tour of the boat to wife a week or 3 ago. I had to pause it and show her the L galley on their website. She concurs! I also must have a forward facing first mate seat on the bridge so that person isn’t sitting sideways. Maybe best done by a sliding backrest for first mate, that swings to allow that person to sit facing forwards whilst underway, and facing aft while seating with others around the table.

Your interest seems serious. If you have not done so already, I would urge you to contact Scott Helker at Helmsman. The links and numbers are on the website. Doing so early in your thought process will open you up to additional ideas, and you can get a bead fast on what is and isn't do-able. These boats are semi-custom, and each has been customized in some fashion for each boater.

Having said that, maybe it would be helpful to make a short list of the items and issues that buyers commonly will want to address.

1) Flybridge layout, that you already touched on. The common two selections are visible in various different videos and web pages. A single helm seat to starboard, with a U shaped settee and table are one. The second is two helm seats, the wheel centered, and an L shaped settee. I toyed with something different yet, but came back to the two helm seat arrangement. That decision was left up to my wife, and that's where she ended up.

2) Dingy. Carried on top, or on davits at the stern. Which leads to, do you want / need a crane?

3) Galley layout. You have already been there. The island, or L arrangement as you call it was what everyone seemed to go with until a few recent alternatives popped up. We are going with the island / L, because we didn't want to give up the space for the extra chair. The other way opens it up, but we didn't need a ballroom open floor in valuable space.

3) Galley equipment. Gas, or electric?

4) Generator? Air conditioning? If neither, a larger battery bank? I am east coast, and AC is a requirement. Period. Which means generator. Which leads to electric in the galley. You are in the PNW and it appears to me folks there go the other way on this for good reasons with the different climate and needs.

5) Provision to turn the pilothouse settee into an extra single or double berth? We did, with a single.

6) Main stateroom cabinets. Different layouts for the side cabinets have been done over the years. We liked the one in the recent videos and saw no need to go further than to say "we want that."

7) Obvious choices in countertops and leather color.

8) No electronics are included, because everyone wants something different. Pick it.

9) Arch or mast up top? We went arch.

10) Engine. 250HP is standard, and for the basic 7 knot cruising more than enough. We went a notch up for a bit extra if needed. Some have gone for a lot more, with trim tabs to accommodate it.

11) Doors. Recently the option opened up to have side doors amidships. Side doors on the cockpit are an option. And then double doors on the transom recently became an option.

No doubt I've missed something obvious and others can chime in.

I just have to repeat and emphasize that if you have something more in mind do not hesitate to ask. One chap doing a 43 has a very different head layout below being built. This isn't a pressure sales situation. Initiating a converation is quickly about what do you want, and possible ways to get there. Options. Problem solving more than sales. Try it, you'll like it.

Hope this helps.

 

[Barrie]

Hi All: We have few guests as we bought the boat for just us but when we do, we make sure there is a hotel close by. My son and wife stayed over one week and before reading this thread question the naturel solution was to run a line fore and aft down the middle of the salon. A simple, small, eye hook installed at each end with a rope to hold up a bed sheet worked fine. Low tech. And very neat. Gave privacy but did nothing for holding back sounds. Allowed me to use the galley early morning.
Now another improvement we made was to have snaps installed on the two temporary cushions that make up the bed as they kept sliding off when people rolled around. This holds them tight from moving. A strip of fabric was sewn on two sides of these cushions and two snaps installed. The male part of the snap was installed on the inside of the wood trim unseen. Solved the problem. Sorry no pictures but you won't have any problem recognizing the problem of the cushions slipping off once you sleep on it and find yourself waking up lying on the wood table top with a back ache. (tucking sheets in tight doesn't work Mom)

 

[Helmsman]

Hi All: We have few guests as we bought the boat for just us but when we do, we make sure there is a hotel close by. My son and wife stayed over one week and before reading this thread question the naturel solution was to run a line fore and aft down the middle of the salon. A simple, small, eye hook installed at each end with a rope to hold up a bed sheet worked fine. Low tech. And very neat. Gave privacy but did nothing for holding back sounds. Allowed me to use the galley early morning.
Now another improvement we made was to have snaps installed on the two temporary cushions that make up the bed as they kept sliding off when people rolled around. This holds them tight from moving. A strip of fabric was sewn on two sides of these cushions and two snaps installed. The male part of the snap was installed on the inside of the wood trim unseen. Solved the problem. Sorry no pictures but you won't have any problem recognizing the problem of the cushions slipping off once you sleep on it and find yourself waking up lying on the wood table top with a back ache. (tucking sheets in tight doesn't work Mom)

Thanks Barrie. Snaps make sense. Thanks for passing that along.

Our idea on the “curtain” for the settee would be a heavier material used for privacy. I was thinking a length of metal line such as what is used on see through fencing that wouldn’t bow in the middle.

Another thought was room dividers. Would have to be some that are foldable vertically.

And Doug’s solution listed above would provide the most privacy but has the disadvantage of not being able to access the galley until everyone is up and about.

The Pilothouse convertible settee would be used for the grandchildren. Not sure we would do anything there.

Other than buddies who came up for a football game, we never had anyone else stay on our boat other than family.

Having owned the boat for awhile, would you rather have a second bedroom, or do you like the way the boat is set up now?

 

[OldDan1943]

I have AT34 (one stateroom, one head)
When my sweetie's folks visited, from Vietnam, for a month or 2, I being the perfect host, gave up the stateroom. There are 2 doors to the head, one in the SR and the other in the stairwell. First we tried the expandable saloon seat. While it was 'serviceable', it was not that comfortable. The next time we have company, I bought a rather large air mattress. Absorbs a bit more than 1/2 of the saloon floor I use the wet/dry vacuum to blow it up.
It is far more comfortable than the saloon convertible seat. It the only way to go. If there are more guests, I will show them the swim platform and to prevent them from rolling off, hand them a roll of duct tape.
For some reason, since I retired, I cannot sleep late but, I am usually asleep before 10pm. I get up early to start breakfast etc... Even though I try to be quiet, I do rattle the pans and that encourages the guest to get up.

A side note: her father is the only person I know who knows how to play dominoes.
In my case, I can comfortable sleep 4 people, providing privacy for both couples.

 

[Doug_Snider]

I showed my solution (curtain at the pilot house) to my wife’s brother. He has a Hatteras 48 LRC and has a heavy blackout curtain separating the pilot house from the salon. He said it works great for night cruising to maintain night vision at the helm while other crew are in the salon and galley.

 

[FWT]

The next time we have company, I bought a rather large air mattress. Absorbs a bit more than 1/2 of the saloon floor I use the wet/dry vacuum to blow it up.

Tip: I have an air mattress in the dirt home, bought some years back when kids in college would bring home carloads of friends for a weekend. More than guest bedrooms could manage. It was easy to find models with electric air pumps built into the mattress, to blow it up, and then suck air out. Inexpensive, easy, rolls into a bag it came with. Has held up well, though it does see only rare use.

 

[Barrie]

Hello Helmsman: One bedroom or two is a whole different discussion. As I said in my opening line, we made it known to all we bought this boat for two people. If friends or family want to stay over we will make them as comfortable as possible but i am not giving up my bed. We do have an air mattress which has been used on the upper deck where grand kids can sleep under the stars. They love it.
Back to the screw eyes for the curtain support rope: one screw eye was installed inside, at the back of the cupboard and the other was installed under the valance by the aft sliding door. I test you to find them.
If company sleeping over is a big issue, a two stateroom style is probably best. The Helmsman 38 calls it a "day head" and not a "night head" for a reason I guess.
Cheers

 

[PattiS]

Doug and I used the 90% rule when we were choosing the 38E. Basically, 90% of the time, we will be cruising alone. However, for the 10% when we are not alone, we would like our guests to be reasonably comfortable. We ordered with the option to be able to convert the pilot house settee to a double bed for grandsons while their parents will sleep in the salon. When we showed our plans to my brother he mentioned that if he was driving at night and someone turned on a light in the salon, his night vision got messed up. The curtain he did fixed that problem and also helps keep heat in the salon instead of having it rise to the pilot house. They’ve cruised all up and down the west coast and spent a year cruising in Mexico.

 

[Helmsman]

Doug and I used the 90% rule when we were choosing the 38E. Basically, 90% of the time, we will be cruising alone. However, for the 10% when we are not alone, we would like our guests to be reasonably comfortable. We ordered with the option to be able to convert the pilot house settee to a double bed for grandsons while their parents will sleep in the salon. When we showed our plans to my brother he mentioned that if he was driving at night and someone turned on a light in the salon, his night vision got messed up. The curtain he did fixed that problem and also helps keep heat in the salon instead of having it rise to the pilot house. They’ve cruised all up and down the west coast and spent a year cruising in Mexico.

Patti, that curtain set up makes a lot of sense to me. I hadn’t thought of the light from the salon affecting night vision.