Under insured in Florida and it's not right!

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Boatboy0110

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Jan 16, 2024
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I just purchased a Prairie Boatworks 36 Trawler that has been on the hard for more than two years. It was for sale and don't understand why there were no takers for so long, but I got a hell of a deal on it and am thrilled with one exception. I'm under insured! The boat was surveyed in April 2022, so I had a survey less than two years old. The Survey valued the boat @ $35,000. I also had advertising showing the boat at $30K which I shared with the insurance company and requested hull coverage for $25,000. I was quoted for that, but I paid $14K for the boat and was honest (honesty is a terrible habit!) on the application where it asked, "how much did you pay for the boat" and I said $14K. The insurance company (progressive through Gallagher) refused $25K and would only insure the boat for $14K! So, I'm sitting in Florida at the start of Hurricane season and I'm underinsured! Any suggestions? I sense that insurance companies are doing this in Florida.
 
I have to think that this is the way it is with insurance companies. Face it, there are people out there that would over insure something (based on the purchase price) and then have a terrible accident/total loss and walk away with fat pockets. I'm guessing only insuring the actual purchase price covers them from excess losses and helps keep the cost "lower" for the rest of us.

I'm not a fan of insurance companies but have learned to accept them as needed. I've been watching my premiums go up and hull value go down for several years. Some day I'll get the thanks but no thanks renewal letter.
 
It does make some seance. Insurance is to protect you investment. Not to make money on a loss. You paid 14k and your covered for 14k.

If you had a loss a week after buying the boat. With a policy at 25k you just made 11k. What your looking for is replacement cost. Some Ins. Co. will do it at a extra premium. Most won't.
 
I agree, it will be really difficult to insure for more than the purchase price unless you had some kind of salvage title and the whole book of repair receipts.
 
It is my experience that the only way you can now get the boat insured for more than you paid for it is to have it surveyed.

I understand your pain. I bought a boat that was $300,000 behind in maintenance at the time. Because most of the issues were labor related, I was able to bring the boat up to standards for $25,000 and 3 years of personal intense labor. When I was done I worked with Peter at Novamar to get the Insurance raised to the proper amount. Even Peter couldn't help with this. In the end I had to create a work order detailing all my parts expensive and labor. This then had to be incorporated into a new survey detailing the affect this had on value. This actually took me 5 years to complete. I also had to use a surveyor that was approved by my insurance company.
 
Buying a boat in foreclosure or in a highly inflationary period doesn't mean that is what it's worth. It's worth what someone is willing to pay for it. If your parent transferred the title to you, because you have no investment in it, doesn't mean it's worth nothing. As mentioned above, have it surveyed.

Ted
 
Interesting, I insured through Progressive online and insured on an agreed value that was more than my purchase price. I don't believe they ever asked how much I purchased for.
 
Get a new survey. An insurance survey from a NAMS/SAMS certified surveyor. They will valuate the boat. Submit the insurance survey to your insurance company and ask them to write the policy based on that. Hull value is what it is surveyed for, not what you paid for it. That is inferring that if you inherit the boat it becomes uninsurable??

Also consider shopping for a marine policy from a marine insurance company or marine focused multi-line agency rather than (Progressive, Geico, etc)
 
Shrew hit it right. Survey value takes precedent over purchase price. Otherwise how would you insure an improved boat. Buddy had to insure boat for twice what he paid for it as the survey valued it so.
 
Pretty sure the insurance company does not have to accept a survey, but yes that is the way to try and insure a boat that is worth way more than the purchase price but the ins. co. can still walk away.
 
You people in Florida can see hurricanes coming for days. But instead of moving your boats to a safe harbor, leave them to pile up on the beach and let the insurance deal with it. That gives all of us higher rates, but those in the hurricane zone even more. Insurance is getting tighter everywhere, but there billions in unnecessary claims hurts us all.
And yes, when necessary I have moved my boats because of weather and tsunamis. Left work, etc.
 
I would check with the insurance company before the survey and confirm that they will accept that particular surveyor.
 
If you get the boat surveyed, be ready for the insurance company to want to address any safety issues raised in the survey before insuring the boat. If the boat isn't in good shape it might be better to let sleeping dogs lie and keep the insurance you have.
 
I'm also tempted to say you are lucky to have found insurance in Florida (at the start of hurricane season) that covers what you paid for the boat. I'm no expert... but I would say you live with the insurance for now and if in a year you truely feel you are way under insured... start shopping for new insurance.
 
Excluding unusual factors, one view of the value of an object is what a reasonable buyer will pay a not overly keen seller. The OP thinks he got a bargain, maybe he did, maybe not. Give it time as suggested above. Your insurer already has a Surveyor`s assessment they reject in favor of using the sale price as a realistic indicator of value, so something different has to come into the equation.
 
Insurance "compensates you for the amount of your loss" , not the value of the boat.
1) read your policy
2) read it again, especially "what we will pay in event of a loss"
3) know the difference between ACV, agreed value and stated value policies
f4) fully document any improvements as if boat is no longer available, like a theft or deep water sinking. Pics, receipts, etc
 
In Florida, I found where your dock/home port is can impact your ability to get insurance as well as what your cost will be for the policy. When I was shopping for a policy three years ago it did seem to matter that my marina was recognized as a "safe harbor". It is a protected marina due to being surrounded by condos and buildings as well as being off of the intracoastal. How the designation was known or determined by different insurance companies is beyond me, but I'll take it.
 
PhilPB said:
In Florida, I found where your dock/home port is can impact your ability to get insurance as well as what your cost will be for the policy. When I was shopping for a policy three years ago it did seem to matter that my marina was recognized as a "safe harbor". It is a protected marina due to being surrounded by condos and buildings as well as being off of the intracoastal. How the designation was known or determined by different insurance companies is beyond me, but I'll take it.
Click to expand...
Yes, insurance companies rate marinas based on wind, wave and high water risk. My slip was in a boat basin with a barrier island and floating docks. As estimated by the insurance companies before hand, we had probably the lowest loss (sunk) and damaged vessel percentages of anyone on the river during hurricane Ian. While I don't know if the insurance companies will give you the list for your area, my agent was willing to tell me it was top rated.

Ted
 
Lepke said:
You people in Florida can see hurricanes coming for days. But instead of moving your boats to a safe harbor, leave them to pile up on the beach and let the insurance deal with it. That gives all of us higher rates, but those in the hurricane zone even more. Insurance is getting tighter everywhere, but there billions in unnecessary claims hurts us all.
And yes, when necessary I have moved my boats because of weather and tsunamis. Left work, etc.
Click to expand...
You don't know he does that?
I know you didn't mean it personally.
But it looks that way.
 
Lepke said:
You people in Florida can see hurricanes coming for days. But instead of moving your boats to a safe harbor, leave them to pile up on the beach and let the insurance deal with it. That gives all of us higher rates, but those in the hurricane zone even more. Insurance is getting tighter everywhere, but there billions in unnecessary claims hurts us all.
And yes, when necessary I have moved my boats because of weather and tsunamis. Left work, etc.
Click to expand...
I tend to think it is not "us people ACTUALLY IN Florida" who are most at fault for letting boats pile up like matchsticks. I think it is mostly people who live outside of Florida who leave boats here to pile up like matchsticks who are at fault for our Florida insurance rates.
 
rgano said:
I tend to think it is not "us people ACTUALLY IN Florida" who are most at fault for letting boats pile up like matchsticks. I think it is mostly people who live outside of Florida who leave boats here to pile up like matchsticks who are at fault for our Florida insurance rates.
Click to expand...
I have a sneakin' suspicion it's more personality than domicile........but on the other hand.....

Like the Jersey shore, more people from PA and NY have summer places than I think locals do.....so I have a lot of experience to agree with you Rich...

As a salvor.... lots of semi seasonally abandoned boats get raised every year.

Guess the overlap in this case are people with 2 homes....and their boat is in Florida behind the house or in a nearby marina.
 
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Those of you who don't live in Florida, can't relate to the problems we face when a hurricane is coming. It's one thing to know that it's on its way and another to find a place to put your boat.

It's also difficult to know where a hurricane is really going to make landfall.
For example, hurricane Dorian was heading right for Stuart Florida where I keep my boat. There was no place for me to turn to. So we got our valuables off the boat and went to a hotel in Miami, which was well south of the storm path. As it turns out the storm which was supposed to make a direct hit on Stuart turned and went up north.

Then there's the issue of insurance coverage based on "named storms." Now it seems that every tropical storm is given a name and that affects the deductible on the insurance policy. Believe me, it's a real problem.
 
Was in Claims for 20 yrs. In Baltimore the hurricane joke was caravan of tow trucks w cars w blown engines heading for the beach
 
The real question to me is if you are paying insurance rate for the agreed value of the boat, or the higher surveyed value.
 
hmason said:
Those of you who don't live in Florida, can't relate to the problems we face when a hurricane is coming. It's one thing to know that it's on its way and another to find a place to put your boat.

It's also difficult to know where a hurricane is really going to make landfall.
For example, hurricane Dorian was heading right for Stuart Florida where I keep my boat. There was no place for me to turn to. So we got our valuables off the boat and went to a hotel in Miami, which was well south of the storm path. As it turns out the storm which was supposed to make a direct hit on Stuart turned and went up north.

Then there's the issue of insurance coverage based on "named storms." Now it seems that every tropical storm is given a name and that affects the deductible on the insurance policy. Believe me, it's a real problem.
Click to expand...
I put my boat in Michigan…
 
Comodave said:
I put my boat in Michigan…
Click to expand...
I provided the insurance company with a survey that was less than two years old, and the boat had been on the hard since the survey. The Survey valued the boat at $35,000. We get about a week's notice that a storm is coming in our direction. The boat yards are full this time of year. I'm on the gulf side of Florida. My escape route in a trawler that goes 10 MPH is to go out into the gulf? The survey shows $35K. I asked for $25K. The hull has since received two coats of paint and the bottom also. I did the work myself (at 74!). I'll have $25K in the boat by the time I have finished with the upgrades. I don't think my request was unreasonable.
 
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Hurricanes/named storms are a reality in that region. It is the role of the insurance company to protect their shareholders from the actuarial risk of insuring the boat against those storms. Hence they have requirements for how that vessel is to be safeguarded from those storms as a condition of insurance, regardless of how difficult, inconvenient, or expensive it may be for the owner.

Out west, we have the situation where insurers are not going to insure for wildfires unless the property owner meets certain requirements for prepping and fireproofing their property. Even then, many insurance companies have simply left the market, making insurance rates much higher as there are fewer carriers left in the market.

As others have mentioned, the only way to convince an insurance company of the value of a boat is to get a current survey from a surveyor acceptable to the insurance company.
 
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