Accepted offer, Mainship 390. Have questions!

[mncruiser]

Howdy! My wife and I have an accepted offer on a 2001 Mainship 390. We are super excited, and got to actually see her on Friday for about 4 hours. Yes, we put together an offer on the boat without seeing it....also using a buyer's broker. If you really want an "in demand" boat right now, you should consider doing the same!

The survey is scheduled for about 3 weeks from now, and sea trial hopefully shortly after. I'm looking for help/opinions on a few big items. The basics of the boat:

2001 Mainship 390
- Yanmar 6LP-STE 300HP, 15xx hours. NOT affected by the Yanmar valve issue.
- Kohler 8KW gen, 114 hours
- Freshwater only. 2nd owner. 300 hours 1st owner. 15xx hours now.
(there's obviously more but this is all for now)
- The boat has been on the hard since Fall 2019. Inside, heated storage the entire time.

Like every boat, there is a story. I believe this is a good one, but have some questions and looking for guidance. The former owner is unavailable, but I have a ton of service records and more on the way. Trying to organize this in a "important stuff first" and will add pictures if I have them. Thanks in advance for your help!

Grounding event, August 2018
Insurance repair. Trying to get more details and pictures, but here is what I know:
- 100 hours of fiberglass repair and woodworking
- 1/2 gallon west system hardner
- 32oz 105 resin
- Qty. "4" fiberglass - biaxial cloth/ per ft.
- 1.5 gal seahawk AF33 bottom paint
- Rudder, prop and shaft removed. Prop and shaft sent out for repair.
- Shaft replaced..maybe? Is $1000 enough to replace a shaft?

Hoping I can get more details, but based on the data above, how big of a deal was this? Obviously this will be a focus of the survey.

Monster bilge pump, maybe installed after the above event?
- Johnson Pump 4000. Were these stock, or is this added? I've never seen a pump so big, the picture does not do it justice. It's HUGE!

The swim platform
- Has one access panel. Opened and it was sealed well. Like opening a can of peanuts...you know, that sealed sound? It's been out of the water since Fall 2019. It was very moist, and the bilge pump was trying to run. Check valve holding water, bilge pump trying to pump every few mins.
- Listed as "Reinforced swim platform and resealed in 2014"

The access - Is this stock? I thought there were supposed to be 3? (Mainship issue, used to be foam filled, removed foam and did something back in 2002?)

The inside - So, it was wet, after a whole season of being out of the water, inside heated storage? So it's sealed really well? Or it does leak, and the water can't get out? Also, note the cruddy wiring job to the bilge pump using what I'm assuming is solid core household wiring. Yep, on the list to fix.

I've read so much on these platforms. Some are supposed to drain into the main bilge. Some are not, that's what the pump is for. Not sure how to feel about this one.

Port sliding windows frozen shut
- These windows...circled in yellow -

- Frozen means they move a little, but it seems to me the sliding tracks, the felt-like soft window sealing stuff? It's hard, and the windows don't open. I didn't try too hard, but almost feel if I had been able to get it wet, they would move. The windows on the other side move fine. Maybe this was the side open to the weather in the slip?

Autopilot "thingy"
This -

Look at the attachment point to the rudder post. This HAS to be just an indicator device for the AP, right? 2 hose clamps and a weak looking piece of aluminum can't be the autopilot steering. Am I correct this is the indicator?

Hoses from Kohler Generator up through step to AC/Heat?
These hoses run from the gen up to under the step, which I believe houses the salon AC/Heat unit. Yes, I see the hoses are cracked a bit. I should replace, right? The black hoses with green stripes:

Is this the heat? Or to assist the heat?

Those are the main items I have for now. I've got lots of documentation to go through, this owner was on top of it and did a lot to keep this boat in great shape. Once we are "final final" I'll tell the larger story...and yes with tons more pics. Thank you all for your advice!

If you think of any other problem areas I should dig into, I'd love your thoughts!

MNCruiser

 

[Solly]

What little I can help you with.
The wiring to the platform pump looks to be OK. Red and black are for marine use. Red is + and black -.
No worriers on the AP. That's a rudder position indicator. Not the best setup but as long as it doesn't slip on the rudder shaft it should work.
FWIW somebody installed a huge bilge pump on our 85 Mk III too. It's back in the lazarette.

 

[jungpeter]

Hi Mncruiser,

I'm assuming the pictures you provided were taken by your buyer's broker, and if I understand it correctly, you've never set foot aboard?

I suggest you attach yourself to your surveyor's hip, and follow him 100% of the time throughout the boat during your survey process. Forward whatever pictures you have to him ahead of time, and alert him to your issues/questions/concerns in advance. MAKE SURE he answers these issues to your satisfaction. In addition, I would insist your buyer's broker accompany you on your survey. And alert him, as well, to your issues, and elicit his support in their resolution.

And rest assured, a competent surveyor will turn up a BUNCH of issues you haven't even thought about, or tumbled to on whatever remote inspection of the boat you've accomplished to date. Neither broker is necessarily your friend in any remote sale such as this, but your surveyor IS.

Nor can a bunch of unknowns on a forum such as this provide much in the way of actual assistance. While there is a lot of collective knowledge on this forum, none of us has skin in your game, nor our boots and eyeballs aboard, so our ability to actually provide substantive help is negligible.

And pay attention to what your surveyor conveys to you. You're paying for his time and expertise-USE IT! He may be the only unbiased party in this dance!

In my opinion, it's impossible to adequately assess a boat remotely, as your own personal MK 1 eyeballs are really the only ground truth you have in this purchase. And, your other senses as well. How does the boat smell? What is the fit and finish? How does it fit you and your family's expectations of size and function? All those intangibles that cannot be answered without "boots on the ground". YOUR boots!

Best of luck in this boat-buying "process". Hopefully you won't be swayed by any pressures to buy immediately, due to some perception (or sales pitch) of a seller's market. There's LOTS of boats out there, one of which has your name on it. It may not be THIS one, so don't fall in love just yet.

Regards,

Pete

 

[mncruiser]

Hi Mncruiser,

I'm assuming the pictures you provided were taken by your buyer's broker, and if I understand it correctly, you've never set foot aboard?

Thanks for the reply. That's incorrect, the pictures are mine, we spent about 4 hours on the boat Friday.

All great points on the survey, and that is my plan, I'll be following him around a lot.

I'll have to disagree with you a little bit....I've found the opinions of the members here to be extremely valuable....even when I disagree and don't listen to them, I value the thoughts of many who have been through this many, many times before me. Don't discount yourself and your experience here not being able to help people. I've received MUCH here for years, and when I can, try to return the favor!

In no way am I making a decision to purchase based on a few questions answered here. In fact, there are about 100 (or more) other questions that will be answered by another trip by me the day before the survey, during the survey, the report of the survey, and the following sea trial. These were just a few big items I'd like to get some thoughts on.

There is a ton of data and background I'm leaving out here....I would not have done this deal if I didn't believe the upside was not significant. At this point I don't feel it's appropriate to share those details out of respect for the seller and their agent.

Thanks again!

 

[PM]

I don't see anything in the photos or your explanation that makes me think "Run". In fact, quite the opposite. Everything looks very clean and shipshape. Every boat needs some small repairs and fine tuning.

I wish you would have mentioned the price. Is it high, medium or low? could make a difference.

pete

 

[SoWhat]

The grounding event would be a concern but apparently it was professionally repaired so probably better than original. Sounds like the grounding pushed the strut through. That would account for the high labor amount and the low fiberglass material amount. You could replace a shaft for $1000 in 2018 but might be 3X that today.

If it was the strut a lot of water entered the boat and it probably sank in place. Any owner seeing the water fountain would probably install 2 Johnson 4000's.

I would be extra thorough checking the tabbing around stringers and around rudder shaft supports. A hard grounding can flex the whole hull and separate the tabbing. A borescope and bright led flashlight will be very helpful.

 

[Benthic2]

I wish you would have mentioned the price. Is it high, medium or low? could make a difference.

pete

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2001/mainship-390-trawler-3820804/

 

[mncruiser]

I don't see anything in the photos or your explanation that makes me think "Run". In fact, quite the opposite. Everything looks very clean and shipshape. Every boat needs some small repairs and fine tuning.

I wish you would have mentioned the price. Is it high, medium or low? could make a difference.

pete

Pete, I’d say based on the full details and current comps., price is medium. But in general the market is high. Maybe it’s high compared to 2 years ago.

But since l’ll be boating near you (Bayfield) the right boat in the right place meant even if it is high, I’m ok with it. Freshwater only boat, 2-3 days voyage from Bayfield was a positive. The alternative being saltwater, writing a large check to get it on a truck was not attractive.

A month voyage up rivers or through lakes from east coast isn’t an option for me right now.

This was one of the target boats I had wanted. When I described it to many brokers, they laughed at me with a “never” tone.

I feel like extremely lucky. The survey will tell me if that’s correct or not!

 

[mncruiser]

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2001/mainship-390-trawler-3820804/

That’s the boat!

 

[mncruiser]

The grounding event would be a concern but apparently it was professionally repaired so probably better than original. Sounds like the grounding pushed the strut through. That would account for the high labor amount and the low fiberglass material amount. You could replace a shaft for $1000 in 2018 but might be 3X that today.

If it was the strut a lot of water entered the boat and it probably sank in place. Any owner seeing the water fountain would probably install 2 Johnson 4000's.

I would be extra thorough checking the tabbing around stringers and around rudder shaft supports. A hard grounding can flex the whole hull and separate the tabbing. A borescope and bright led flashlight will be very helpful.

Agreed, and thank you for the tips. The surveyor is well aware and it is a major focus.

We will also be trying to get specifics about the grounding event. It doesn’t appear it was sunk.

Thanks!

 

[Jeff F]

Looks like a nice boat. It's hard to beat great lakes with indoor heated storage.

I'm sure your surveyor will sound out the flybridge floor and the decks. These boats are getting to the age where soft spots start showing up. Not the end of the world, generally.

I'm curious about the coolant lines running from the genset. No idea where they would go...

Hope it all works out.

 

[Scrivma1]

We followed a very similar path with our 2006 34 T, close to home, 250 hours, one owner, fresh water, and jumped on it as very rare in Minnesota. No regrets, had a good surveyor who found some minor mechanical issues which we addressed. Does have one soft spot on flybridge behind aft seat, so check carefully, surveyor missed it. Into year 2 now based out of Prescott, love the range and fuel economy, and sparks coversation as Marinas are full of gas hog cruisers dime a dozen.

 

[mncruiser]

We followed a very similar path with our 2006 34 T, close to home, 250 hours, one owner, fresh water, and jumped on it as very rare in Minnesota. No regrets, had a good surveyor who found some minor mechanical issues which we addressed. Does have one soft spot on flybridge behind aft seat, so check carefully, surveyor missed it. Into year 2 now based out of Prescott, love the range and fuel economy, and sparks coversation as Marinas are full of gas hog cruisers dime a dozen.

I know your boat! I used to be in Miss Croix, I was in the small harbor near Mark’s office. We sold last year.

I admired your boat often, I’m the “wifi guy” and I’m either loved or hated depending on your signal! We put up an AP nearly right in front of your boat!

I’ll stop by next time I’m down checking on things!

 

[bgillroy]

Join and post questions to M owners group. Be sure surveyor is SAMS or NAMS qualified. May get M specific comments on owners group.

 

[mncruiser]

Join and post questions to M owners group. Be sure surveyor is SAMS or NAMS qualified. May get M specific comments on owners group.

The Mainship Owners group here or on Facebook? Or somewhere else?

Thanks

 

[Bacchus]

Lots of current & previous owners here on TF.
Also scan through the Marlow Mainship section as it essentially all MS.

 

[Capt Ray]

Mainship 390

Where have I seen curtains like that before?! LOL Love the teak and holly sole. We missed out on that feature in ours.

Looks clean... lots of good advice responses to your post, which I agree with.

All I can add:
We closed on a 2000 last July. Loving it. So long as the foam is out of the swim platform, you should be good to go on that part of this. We are the third owner, and oddly both of the previous owners did NOT have the foam removed. All one did was put a gabbard plug to drain the thing every fall?!?! So anyway, fixing that was the first thing I had done immediately after closing. (Found a fellow who had done this before on 2 or 3 other MS390s! So, he knew exactly what to do.) I installed a Seaflo Dry Bilge System pickup in ours when he was done.

Thanks to Bacchus and MNCruiser for tip on the Marlow Mainship Forum; somehow I have been missing out on that.

Best of Luck to you in the process!

 

[Dreamersjohnlinda]

Monster Bilge Pump

Hi there;

We have a 2003 Mainship 390. In case someone hasn't already answered the "Monster Bilge Pump" is the high water bilge pump and I believe it is stock.

 

[ljk]

Monster bilge pump

Hi there;

We have a 2003 Mainship 390. In case someone hasn't already answered the "Monster Bilge Pump" is the high water bilge pump and I believe it is stock.

Same comment as above. My 34 Mainship Pilot had the same setup, plus there was a high water bilge alarm at the helm that would sound and flash when the monster pump went on.

 

[IntoTheBlue]

We had a 2002 Mainship 390, single Yanmar 315. Really enjoyed that vessel. There were some issues with the swim platform (not with ours) filling up with water. That may be a reason for the hatch. Beyond that I do not remember having any issues with the design or manufacture.

Enjoy your new Mainship 390, I know that we did!

 

[Phyrcooler]

I had a 2001 390, so just wanted to add my confirmation to what others have said. You’re already aware of previous “issue”. You’re fortunate that they have been forthcoming already. Many sellers will paint over and never disclose. Many won’t even disclose service/maintenance records. Hopefully someone can relay a bit more fully what happened, as a surveyor can only see so far.

In regards to “Monster” pump - they were standard - though that one looks like a newer replacement, which is ok. As previously noted, there is a light and alarm for “High Water” if this pump kicks on. Something Mainship got right!

Water in the swim platform is common. Usually due to poor sealing around the “lid” or the added access ports. Additionally, the top wasn’t tilted or convex, so a bit of water would sit on top. Being a big mostly sealed box, mine would heat up during the day, probably venting some air out, then as it cooled in the evening, suck water from the top of the lid around my access ports. In hindsight, I could have reduced or stoped this by cracking open the through-hull I had between the box and lazarette of the boat, so it wouldn’t build pressure/vacuum in the box.

In regards to number of access ports, I’ve seen all shapes and sizes. While Mainship sent out instructions, most were done at yards around the country and reimbursement sought from Mainship. Others weren’t done until much later, and were done without guidance or reimbursement.

The windows were aluminum and suffered some corrosion issues, which could be part of the problem. However, I believe this was more with saltwater boats. Reguardless, you should be able to clean and lightly sand the tracks to get things moving again. You’ll want to properly prime or corrosion treat prior to use or repainting. There is plenty of advice in both the marine and aviation forums regarding corrosion cleanup and treating of aluminum. Overall, definitely not a deal killer.

In regards to the generator coolant hoses, I have heard of some folks running them to their water heater instead of from a primary engine. The theory is that it can make your hot water while recharging your batteries. Other than that, I have no clue why it would run UP by the AC unit, but the theory that it was being used as a hydronic type heater holds merit. I’m in too temperate of a climate to see fancy stuff like that!

Although I am one of the unknowns on here apparently providing dubious advice, I hope I’ve helped. While there ARE a lot of varied opinions in this forum, hopefully you can gain some benefit as you noted.

Best of luck on your sea trial and inspection.
Edit: also... there is a Mainship group on Facebook.

 

[MacPhid]

The hoses from the generator appear to be raw water from the cooler up to a vacuum breaker and out to the exhaust elbow. Can’t be sure from the picture but that’s what it appears to be.

James

 

[Art]

That’s the boat!

Nice Boat!

Substantial price... You might want to work on the owner a bit for some reduction.

Bet she gets good nmpg at just below hull speed. Low hrs on gen set!

Plenty room in engine compartment. Those two beams for hatch support fairly easy removal if wide open access is needed... bet they are! If so, that's great...

Happy Boat-Purchase Daze! - Art

 

[Mortensi]

Luke Brown is a quality Brokerage. I doubt they would even accept a listing on a boat that wouldn’t pass a survey. The fact that they are handling such a inexpensive boat (compared to their normal fare) is a nice bonus for you, as you can learn a LOT from their experience.
Have a good time during the process. Record the surveyors on your phone, so you don’t forget it all, as there’s lots of switches, valves, to remember.

 

[mncruiser]

Thanks all for the responses! Will update after my Survey on May 7th!

 

[henryj2]

Amen to all that. And remember, 2001? you will still find a lot of expensive items very soon that require updating, repair or replacement. When we made our purchase about 10 years ago our trawler was rated as in "excellent condition" and after two months in the boatyard and $35K it probably was. Still, no regrets. Best of luck.