Documenting sea time for OUPV

[Bkay]

Morning. I have a question regarding documenting my sea time for OUPV. I've got good records for my current boat and prior boat, but I don't have any records for my first boat (which I owned from around 2003 to 2008).

I know the number of hours I put on the engine, but I don't have the log books or any proof of ownership (other than I did the original documentation on the boat, so I know I may be able to capture the original documentation date somehow). Without being able to prove those years, I will come up short on my 360 days sea time. I can certainly get to 360 days by the end of this year, but I'd rather not come in just under the wire when I've got 800 hours on that first boat that I'm not capturing.

Any tips from the Captains out there that might help me figure out how to get old proof of ownership and estimate time on a vessel I sold 14 years ago?

Thanks.

 

[psneeld]

Try the state for that boat's registration.

Engine hours are OK, but technically you have to log days on the water. How you assign those engine hours is ctitical if the USCG spot checks tour sea service forms.

 

[Jetwag03]

Morning. I have a question regarding documenting my sea time for OUPV. I've got good records for my current boat and prior boat, but I don't have any records for my first boat (which I owned from around 2003 to 2008).

I know the number of hours I put on the engine, but I don't have the log books or any proof of ownership (other than I did the original documentation on the boat, so I know I may be able to capture the original documentation date somehow). Without being able to prove those years, I will come up short on my 360 days sea time. I can certainly get to 360 days by the end of this year, but I'd rather not come in just under the wire when I've got 800 hours on that first boat that I'm not capturing.

Any tips from the Captains out there that might help me figure out how to get old proof of ownership and estimate time on a vessel I sold 14 years ago?

Thanks.

Bkay, Just an FYI, if this is a renewal and you are short on days at sea the CG will allow you to do an open book exam and skip the hours sea service requiment.

 

[Bkay]

Bkay, Just an FYI, if this is a renewal and you are short on days at sea the CG will allow you to do an open book exam and skip the hours sea service requiment.

No, not a renewal. Since the boat was documented, I think I can get an abstract of title that will show me as the owner. Of course, that doesn't help with documenting the actual time. And I hate wasting $75 on an abstract (I think that's what it cost).

 

[twistedtree]

The abstract of title, and old documentation certificate, a bill of sale, a tax bill, or such would probably suffice to show you owned the boat. For the days at sea, I’d put together a good faith estimate, making sure it’s consistent the hours put on the boat, etc.

 

[Spinner]

Do you have any old calendars that show when you were out on the boat? If you do, maybe you can work backward from that…

 

[alormaria]

Boat registration and/or title - purchase agreement - bill of sale.

 

[Bkay]

I see abstract of title is only $25 directly from NVDC. I'd think that in itself would be adequate proof of ownership.

Unfortunately, I have absolutely 0 paperwork/calendars/insurance statements/bills of sale/etc from that timeframe. Virtually all my boat related documentation from when I was on active duty is gone. Although TwistedTree is on to something with the tax forms - for some reason I still have tax returns back to when I was a teenager.

 

[Benthic2]

Does ownership of the boat matter ? If you went out on someone else's boat I think it still counts as hours towards the license requirement.

 

[rslifkin]

Does ownership of the boat matter ? If you went out on someone else's boat I think it still counts as hours towards the license requirement.

If I remember correctly, it's just a difference in how you document the time. If you owned the boat, you can self-certify the time. If it's someone else's boat, they have to sign off on your sea time aboard that boat.

 

[Bkay]

If I remember correctly, it's just a difference in how you document the time. If you owned the boat, you can self-certify the time. If it's someone else's boat, they have to sign off on your sea time aboard that boat.

This is exactly right. And if you own the boat and self-certify, you must provide some proof of ownership.

 

[BandB]

Two parts and relatively easy.

1-Get proof of ownership for the years in question.

2-Estimate usage by month using their forms. Make sure your hours put on the boat and your general schedule supports your numbers.

Also use any emails or diaries you have that may help, any service records.

Here are some examples of what we did.

Year 2002
Hours for the year from copies of marina charges-700. These were invaluable.

I knew that any nice weekend in January through March we used the boat and for at least 4 hours, likely many more on each day. Same at the end of the year for October through November but add days of Thanksgiving week and Christmas and New Years. I came up with 3 days in January, 4 in February, 5 in March, 7 in October, 4 in November, 3 in December. Then I looked at warmer weather. It was a beautiful April and May so 6 and 8 days. Now the previous year was only 3 and 2. September 9 days which included Labor day. Then summer to deal with. We knew we took vacation in June as soon as school let out and another week in July. So 14 days each month and 10 days in August as we would boat many afternoons during the summer. Most wouldn't be 4 hours but some would be. Fortunately, wife is younger and better memory on some of this.

When done I had 87 days. That would be an average of 8 hours per day. So certainly a number I could justify.

Ultimately, the CG looks for reasonableness. If you're not working on a boat, they aren't going to buy 200 days. But you can show your pattern of boating. If you traveled, maybe you have receipts or emails.

When I was young, I had to reconstruct records for one of my father's former clients who had a bookkeeper who was totally lost until she left in early December. My father did the couple's return and they were audited, of all things a training audit so every line, much like a fraud audit. I couldn't prove anything was in the right expense account, but I could show the total income was right, the total expenses were reasonable and nothing personal was charged to the company. Accepted, no changes.

CG is similar. If you do something egregious to make them think you're cheating, you'll be in trouble, but make it reasonable based on what you know and it will be fine. They know you don't have precise records from 15 years ago.

We did have 8 days one summer on someone else's boat but didn't go to the trouble of getting them to attest to it, just let it go. I had 1719 days so wasn't concerned. My wife had 1129 days.