For Sale: Grand Banks 42 Classic

[FF]

A neighbor hit 80 and wants to pass on his 1969 Grand Banks Classic woodie to good hands.

With the usual GB above average construction , hardware and building skills this GB is in good condition and ready for more years running the AICW ,the Bahamas , the loop or being a comfortable home for a live a board.

Boats for sale ABLBoats ablboats.com

Now located in fresh water here at Floridas best Hurricane hole , Ortona FL

Call ALL 828-429-2692

Twin Lehman 120's and all the goodies usually found on a GB ,

Price reduced to $35K US.

Come on down and drive it home , ready to go, NOT a "fixer upper".

 

[Shoalwaters]

Fred, to quote the linked advert "......1969 GB Woodie, fiberglass bottom..". does this mean the hull is GRP and the deck house is wooden?

 

[Marin]

No GBs were made with fiberglass hulls and wood topsides. My guess I'd this is a stock 1969 woody that has had its hull-- or part of it-- glassed over for some reason. I think this is a very bad idea but anyone interested in this boat should ask Bob Lowe on the GB owners forum what he thinks of it..

American Marine did not start building in fiberglass until mid-1973 with GB36-360 and the entire boat was fiberglass, not just the hull.

 

[capt jerry]

ther is nothing wrong with glassing over wooden hulls,most of the custom boats are cold mold such as a ji,m smith or a buddy davis and many more are wood glassed over?????

 

[Marin]

As with everything else, it all depends on how the job is done. The original planked hulls of GB woodies "work" a bit and if this opens up minute cracks in the fiberglass overlay and creates spaces between the planks and the fiberglass covering on the hull and moisture gets in to become trapped between the fiberglass and the wood the door is then opened to rot problems.

 

[Moonstruck]

ther is nothing wrong with glassing over wooden hulls,most of the custom boats are cold mold such as a ji,m smith or a buddy davis and many more are wood glassed over?????

I think you can add Jarret Bay to that list. Many use epoxy resins that have great adhesion and strength. It is an accepted method building high end custom sports fishermen because of the lightness and speed.

Build Process | Jarrett Bay Boatworks

 

[Marin]

Don--- Are these manufacturers building conventional, fully-framed, wood-planked hulls and then glassing it over or are they building cold-molded hulls or using some other "modern" hull-layup method?

Because the question is not if fiberglass-over-wood hulls are viable, but if fiber-glassing over a somewhat flexible, timber-framed, conventionally planked wood hull built in 1969 is a reliable process.

 

[Moonstruck]

Don--- Are these manufacturers building conventional, fully-framed, wood-planked hulls and then glassing it over or are they building cold-molded hulls or using some other "modern" hull-layup method?

Because the question is not if fiberglass-over-wood hulls are viable, but if fiber-glassing over a somewhat flexible, timber-framed, conventionally planked wood hull built in 1969 is a reliable process.

Marin, most are not conventionally planked, but use something like the West System of diagonally laid plywood sheets in layers. Some of the Downeast Carolina built boats are what they call strip planked. That is about 1 1/2' x 1 1/2" long strips of cypress edge glued and glued to the frames with epoxy. Then they are fastened with Monel screws or ring shank nails. Then they are covered with fiberglass. They are very strong and take a beating. The heavily pronounced Carolina flair is to turn the big seas away. Until you experience the ride, it's hard to imagine.

The lightest ones use the cold molded plywood with kevlar reinforced epoxy resins. Un believably fast. Above 40 knots in some cases.

Here's video of Jarret Bay glassing a hull.

http://www.jarrettbay.com/why-jarrett-bay/videos/

 

[FF]

As with any modification the experience , skill and materials used in the mod are far more important than some armchair "theory" .

This was done by pros , in a pro yard , who have over 2 decades at the process.

For shallow water , like the Bahamas , it is good insurance as touching bottom at some time is common , as are WORMS .

 

[roguewave]

I looked at some of the older "Huckins" awhile back, I was taken by the lines these beautiful boats had. Up untill the early 70's many of the older models were glass over wood (double diagonal hull) from the factory. Interesting

 

[Moonstruck]

With the newer CAD programs and computer controlled 5 axle routers it is much easier to build the mold plugs for complex one piece molds. This has revolutionized composite boat construction.

By the way, juniper strip planked boats were usually made of cypress. I sold cypress lumber to some of the shrimp boat builders in St. Augustine and along the St. Johns River back in the 1960s.

 

[Pau Hana]

Jerry (and others)- there is nothing wrong with a glass over wood construction method IF the method is a part of the original layup method, such as cold molding.

Marin is correct in that glass over wood can be a very bad idea IF the glass was added post build. I see many surveys where a woodie (Chris Craft, Fairliner and the like) has been hauled and glassed over the original planking. This creates a "bath-tub" that traps moisture left in the wood.

I don't know of an marine insuring market that will take on this type of risk.

 

[FF]

I don't know of an marine insuring market that will take on this type of risk.

The boat IS currently insured.

 

[Pau Hana]

The questions that beg to be asked- by who and what type of policy? Not that there need be an answer. As the details aren't mine (or anyone else's) business.

 

[JohnP]

This boat looks very Nice. The glassed over bottom is a big issue. Most wooden boat buyers want to be able to inspect the bottom planking for rot.

Generally a good bottom paint job keeps the worms at bay. The keel could have a wormshoe installed for protection after grounding.

This is a tough call but I think the price has to adjusted lower, or the glass removed to sell this yacht.

JohnP

 

[Pau Hana]

This boat looks very Nice. The glassed over bottom is a big issue. Most wooden boat buyers want to be able to inspect the bottom planking for rot.

Generally a good bottom paint job keeps the worms at bay. The keel could have a wormshoe installed for protection after grounding.

This is a tough call but I think the price has to adjusted lower, or the glass removed to sell this yacht.

JohnP

The 'glass layer will also prevent fasteners from being removed for inspection as part of a survey (a requirement for wood boats).

 

[sunchaser]

If the vessel is in good shape, doesn't leak in a rainstorm and needs little front end money - $30-35K is a very fair price. Use the vessel until the worms get it and throw it away. It sounds like a good entry level vessel to me. Excepting the glass over, I did it this way once and had a lot of fun for 5 years and ended up selling the boat for what I paid.

But, if the boat smells bad, run.

 

[FF]

"But, if the boat smells bad, run."

The "Best" quick inspection technique .

Come on down , bring your nose along!

 

[Sailor of Fortune]

Check Alan Vaitses method of covering wood boats with FG. Many were discounted back in the 70's as "definitely would not hold up" and are still in service today.
Several were USCG inspected passenger boats that had their documentation changed from wood construction to FRP.
Incidentally, Owens Corning did not approve of this use of (their) FG covering.
For those that are not familiar with AV, he was a very talented Wood boat builder, repairer and marina operator. Later in life he became a surveyor and author. His methods were not politically correct for the times.

 

[OFB]

If the FRP is laid over the wood like paint a thin skim coat, the end results will probably be poor over the long haul.

If the FRP was laid over the wood to increase the vessel strength making it more "stiff" the results can be long lasting.

Lots of variables to the above statements cause there realy is no black or white answer.

My take from what I have seen here in the PNW over the years.

I prefer to just maintain original.

You do not have to pull fasteners to check integrity. You go down into the bilge with a hammer and tap ( or hit ) the frames on there sides. The sound or lack of is a very easy tell tale as to there condition. Fasteners ready to part will part.

Tap and drill , what comes out with the drill bit is what it is. Then inject the hole with thickened epoxy for repair of drilled hole.

I find it sad that insurance brokers are tasked with the valuation of hard working folks property based on what seems to be inernet hearsay in many many cases. Instead of the actual vessel condition.

My 2 cents

 

[FF]

I can understand how reluctant an insurance co would be on a wooden boat .

I see the problem as a lack of skills and expertise.

A piling bangs a 2ft square hole in a GRP cookie and the hardest part is getting to the repair area , the fix is easy.

A 2 ft hole in a wooden boat would be a bunch of long planks , a far larger repair, requiring materials , tools and skills hardly at the local yard.

With the price of the boat 5% or 10% of a new GB , I would assume thew new owners would be live a boards (to easily take care of the boat) that would purchase liability insurance , and simply self insure for any future self inflicted crash damage.

 

[FF]

Try Heritage. They insure a lot of classic wooden boats. So, I ca't see why they wouldn't insure yours. Heritage Marine Insurance
__________________

 

[Pau Hana]

If the FRP is laid over the wood like paint a thin skim coat, the end results will probably be poor over the long haul.

If the FRP was laid over the wood to increase the vessel strength making it more "stiff" the results can be long lasting.

Lots of variables to the above statements cause there realy is no black or white answer.

My take from what I have seen here in the PNW over the years.

I prefer to just maintain original.

You do not have to pull fasteners to check integrity. You go down into the bilge with a hammer and tap ( or hit ) the frames on there sides. The sound or lack of is a very easy tell tale as to there condition. Fasteners ready to part will part.

Tap and drill , what comes out with the drill bit is what it is. Then inject the hole with thickened epoxy for repair of drilled hole.

I find it sad that insurance brokers are tasked with the valuation of hard working folks property based on what seems to be inernet hearsay in many many cases. Instead of the actual vessel condition.

My 2 cents

Pulling fasteners isn't just Internet hearsay, nor is it voodoo magic- and tapping on a wood hull can't tell you the whole story. Silica bronze turns pink as a byproduct of continuous water immersion in the plank- a 4" long fastener that is showing pink along half it's length is indicative of that plank being saturated. (As learned from Lynne Reister of Lodestar Marine- she teaches wood boat surveying and is recognized as a subject matter expert on wood boats.)

Wood boats are insurable- but there are few skilled craftsmen to repair damages, and the salvage value is minuscule when compared to a glass boat. So, underwriting is much more cautious when approving that type of risk.

 

[OFB]

Peter- Marine Insurance Guru & tuna fishing addict!

Peter you kinda twisted my words around.

I suggested a different, a valid or additional way to "check" fasteners no where did I suggest pulling fasteners was "internet hearsay".

When checking a wood boat I suggested a hammer , tapping and a drill ! Just how do you believe a surveryor can determin the what and where to check a wood boat if signs of distress are hidden.

My old wood boat hull is not fastened from the outside. It would be sad to watch a recognized surveyor destroy a boat looking for fasteners to pull when there are non.

My internet hearsay remark is directed to the insurance brokers that would make a remark to a guy that walk's into his office looking at insuring an old wood boat.

To be told

The boat has FRP over the wood and could not be insurable as the fasteners can not be inspected. Even if the boat is currently insured under a current survey.

Thats is sad.

There is no black and white answer when it comes to condition of boats, it comes down to each individual vessel. Be that wood FRP metal or rock !

Again my 2 cents

 

[Portuguese]

Guys

I am building my 3rd wood/epoxy boat from scratch and I can tell you:
There is no way to encapsulate wood properly with long lasting adherence, with any other resin, but epoxy. Yet, we need to choose the different epoxy resins applicable to different purposes. To impregnate it is used one type different from the one that glues wood or any other material

If we encapsulate wood with polyester resin and FG, for example, assuming the job was well done, the water will not get in easily, but, the FG will not be glued to the wood at all because there's no adherence between both materials. In time, the wood will shrink a little bit and it will be loosed trapped inside of the encapsulation

Jim Smith and all the other fishing machines are wood epoxy at its best.
In the early 90’s, I rebuilt an American traditional Sportfishing machine in FG, built originaly in the early 70's. The project was to strip out all the wood structure pieces and replace them by PVC foam/FG beams. The story is that all wood beams were loosed inside of their FG “boxes”.

P.

 

[FF]

The boat is probably sold , two buyers , but no bidding war yet.