Mandatory Boat Safety Course for Boating in NY - Including Transients

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Thanks for the heads up.









Note to self, bypass NY on my way north and allow for plenty of shoreline clearance.
 
Another way to get more money.
If the state insists, I think it should apply EVERYONE afloat be it a powered water craft, sailboat, paddle board and canoes and anyone using a flotation device.
 
Nice to see an N37 on the cover!!!
:D:D:D
 
Wonder what the effect will be on half of the population having less than average intelligence. Lots of people do not do well passing written tests, but are intelligent otherwise.
 
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Benthic2 said:
There's no such thing as a sailboat under power....that's a power boat with a mast.
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Wonder how the law is drawn. If the legislature had any intelligence, any vessel with an engine would be subject, including auxiliary sailboats, those with
often having outboard engines like skiffs and dinghys, and so on.
 
In WA, the boater education requirement applies for anyone operating a boat with a 15hp motor or more. That, of course, includes sailboats with at least a 15hp motor.
 
catalinajack said:
Oh, I didn't know that New Jersey requires out-of-staters to pass a test. Ignorance is bliss, I guess. Still, when the time comes for me in 2025, if I am still on the water, I will be a scofflaw.
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NJ honors other states certificates as long as it is a NASBLA member state. They rarely even look and if so you need to be in state >60 days. Not a big deal for cruisers.
How many are cruising without sitting through an 8+ hour boating safety course of almost any type? Practically zero.
 
dhays said:
In WA, the boater education requirement applies for anyone operating a boat with a 15hp motor or more. That, of course, includes sailboats with at least a 15hp motor.
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IDK what the east coast laws are now (moved west 15 years ago), but I have to say the WA law seemed fair. Free course/test on-line, $10 for a lifetime license, grandfathered if born ~'55 or earlier.

The WA law, like you said, covered motor vessels w/o regard to length, mast, etc. and seemed reasonable.
 
markpierce said:
Wonder what the effect will be on half of the population having less than average intelligence. Lots of people do not do well passing written tests, but are intelligent otherwise.
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If they have instructors like me (I did it for 15 years or so)...they pass...unless they are also clueless about boating.


And no... I never GAVE a certificate out...they all passed the required exam....some maybe they took a little longer than the allowed hour...but I gave some them some slack as I thought the questions were worded poorly. :D
 
High Wire said:
.
How many are cruising without sitting through an 8+ hour boating safety course of almost any type? Practically zero.
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Based on the responses, quite a few.

My feeling is that if preventing you from endangering others with your boat is “intrusive and onerous”, oh well, suck it up. You don’t get to run around endangering me and others. If you want to operate a boat, it comes with a set of obligations that you need to live up to, and these laws are requiring you to do that in the most minimal way. They are long over due, in my opinion. And if you already know everything about being a safe boated, demonstrate it by taking any one of the tests and getting the card.
 
Ct has had a lisence requirement for many years.
Not sure it has done much good from my observations.
 
Would a Captains license exempt you from having to take this course? Does a license exempt a captain in NJ. Or other states requiring training?
I do believe training is long over due especially with the new fade of trying to fit as many high horsepower outboard engines as they can on to a center console boat or pontoon boats. We have seen overload pontoon boats with 800 hp and lots of beer being consumed.

As I'm sure we all have , I have seen to many close calls.
 
psneeld said:
Yes, in NJ a USCG license counts, but you have to have the document handy...would suspect all states would accept it.


https://www.njsp.org/marine-services/boating-safety-certificate.shtml
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On our trip we did not know NJ required anything but I did have my license on board. Of course we still have not recieved our Documentation from the CG, so we were dreading the thought of a boarding anywhere. Luckily we had no such event, not even on the Chesapeake.
The new licenses resemble a passport in size, so they are much easier to take along.
 
In Wa (yes, I know, this thread is about NJ) a license counts. If avoiding state licensing / training requirements were all I wanted a USCG license for I'd go for the six pack.

Do keep in mind that the holder of a USCG credential will be held to a higher standard in the event of collision / casualty etc than a non licensed recreational boater. Even if you are not at the time of the incident operating under your credential. Yes, that's in the CFRs. No I can't cite it, I came across it some time ago when researching the CFRs on another matter.
 
Portage_Bay said:
Do keep in mind that the holder of a USCG credential will be held to a higher standard in the event of collision / casualty etc than a non licensed recreational boater. Even if you are not at the time of the incident operating under your credential. Yes, that's in the CFRs. No I can't cite it, I came across it some time ago when researching the CFRs on another matter.
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And rightfully so. The best rule of boating is your first priority is to avoid a collision, whether you are the stand on vessel or not.

So stay as far away from them other boaters as you can. [emoji16]
 
I have been through the CFRs quite a bit researching for teaching licensing courses.


I have NEVER seen a reference to whether a captain is held to any standard except which our legal or USCG administrative system normally follows.


Loosely interpreted.... any court or administrative body can sanction you for something you did or didn't do. But I know of no specifics against a captain not actively needing his/her license to be held to any exceptional standard.


You are responsible for the rules of the road whether licensed or not and will be judged accordingly. There are all sorts of stories where the license either helped or hurt...but I have not read any transcripts of actual cases where a captains license or status was canges when on a recreational vessel whether as owner/captain or passenger. Possible?... sure I guess...but I would like to see some hard facts eventually.


I truly would like hard evidence or links as I often am asked about this very topic.
 
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So I am completely legal operating my documented boat in my home state of NC. No requirement here for me to take some boating safety course of any type.

Say I go up to Maine next summer. Going through the NE states now I am illegal?

Is there not some sort of reciprocity like there is for auto driver's licenses?
 
psneeld said:
I have been through the CFRs quite a bit researching for teaching licensing courses.


I have NEVER seen a reference to whether a captain is held to any standard except which our legal or USCG administrative system normally follows.


Loosely interpreted.... any court or administrative body can sanction you for something you did or didn't do. But I know of no specifics against a captain not actively needing his/her license to be held to any exceptional standard.


You are responsible for the rules of the road whether licensed or not and will be judged accordingly. There are all sorts of stories where the license either helped or hurt...but I have not read any transcripts of actual cases where a captains license or status was canges when on a recreational vessel whether as owner/captain or passenger. Possible?... sure I guess...but I would like to see some hard facts eventually.


I truly would like hard evidence or links as I often am asked about this very topic.
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Yes, my gut says it’s BS. How can ignorance and inability be rewarded where knowledge and skills are demanded? I have heard people use this argument for why they should not get a license. How backwards things have become, if that’s actually a sound strategy.
 
Ski in NC said:
So I am completely legal operating my documented boat in my home state of NC. No requirement here for me to take some boating safety course of any type.

Say I go up to Maine next summer. Going through the NE states now I am illegal?

Is there not some sort of reciprocity like there is for auto driver's licenses?
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Not in NJ...you HAVE to have a NASBLA approved certified course from somewhere, a safety course from your home state or a captains license.....
 
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twistedtree said:
Yes, my gut says it’s BS. How can ignorance and inability be rewarded where knowledge and skills are demanded? I have heard people use this argument for why they should not get a license. How backwards things have become, if that’s actually a sound strategy.
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the trouble is it is often compared to a CDL where the actual license is your ONLY license.


So from what people who have CDLs say...when they produce that license in a stop or accident...that is what they are held to.


I don't have one and don't really care what they have to endure...past that I think it's also BS and unfair...but it usually comes up in the USCG license discussions.


So until I see evidence surrounding the USCG controversy...I am cautious...but not convinced....then again I know the USCG can get some funny ideas about administering safety.
 
I don't see this as something new or shocking as many states are now requiring a similar course and certificate, mostly done online. All I'm aware of also accept certificates from other states and accept Captain's licenses. We require driver's licenses for cars and this is very similar. I don't understand any objection to it.
 
So here is just one of the rubs with Boating Safety Certificates. NJ requires a PROCTORED exam to get an NJ issued certificate but will accept NASBLA certificates from other states that don’t require proctored exams, mainly Pennsylvania. You can take an online course and exam through PA and that’s good enough for those passing through. NJs stance has been anyone can be on the keyboard taking the exam for you in other states but they got pushed to accept other NASBLA states.
When the law first came out the only NJ exception was owners of Sailboats over 26 feet. That shows how much the general boating public and the marine enforcement was involved before the law was jammed through.
 
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Laws always have work arounds and imperfections. But it’s better to address 80% of a problem with an imperfect law, than do nothing and perpetuate 100% of the problem.
 
twistedtree said:
Yes, my gut says it’s BS. How can ignorance and inability be rewarded where knowledge and skills are demanded? I have heard people use this argument for why they should not get a license. How backwards things have become, if that’s actually a sound strategy.
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It's not BS. As I said in my post # 18
....No I can't cite it, I came across it some time ago when researching the CFRs on another matter.
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.
Nor am I suggesting ignorance and inability be rewarded. And I would never suggest anyone qualified not get a license, far from it, the training and knowledge gained in preparing for the exam is well worth the time and effort. I am cautioning those seeking to become licensed to be prepared to accept the full responsibility of holding that license.


psneeld said:
I have been through the CFRs quite a bit researching for teaching licensing courses.

.....................

I truly would like hard evidence or links as I often am asked about this very topic.
Click to expand...

If I could provide hard evidence or links with a reasonable amount of effort I would. But as we all know digging through the CFRs can be a mind numbing chore. My employer was paying me to bury myself in the CFRs at the time.

Now, for the sake of argument, let's say the CFRs don't hold credentialed mariners to a higher standard while not sailing under their credential. I as a licensed mariner of 45 yrs and retired professional hold MYSELF to a higher standard than the non credentialed recreational boat operator when I am operating a recreational vessel. Nuff said.
 
twistedtree said:
Based on the responses, quite a few.

My feeling is that if preventing you from endangering others with your boat is “intrusive and onerous”, oh well, suck it up. You don’t get to run around endangering me and others. If you want to operate a boat, it comes with a set of obligations that you need to live up to, and these laws are requiring you to do that in the most minimal way. They are long over due, in my opinion. And if you already know everything about being a safe boated, demonstrate it by taking any one of the tests and getting the card.
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Good response I say,
But the problem is too many people.
But the reduction of people is not palatable to most people .. especially religious people. But the reduction will take place whether by man’s engineering or by more traditional functions of nature. Buck up guys. You want nature to make the decisions or us? Nature will almost certainly make better choices for the planet but we MAY make better choices for us.
Too many people
 
Portage_Bay said:
It's not BS. As I said in my post # 18 .
Nor am I suggesting ignorance and inability be rewarded. And I would never suggest anyone qualified not get a license, far from it, the training and knowledge gained in preparing for the exam is well worth the time and effort. I am cautioning those seeking to become licensed to be prepared to accept the full responsibility of holding that license.




If I could provide hard evidence or links with a reasonable amount of effort I would. But as we all know digging through the CFRs can be a mind numbing chore. My employer was paying me to bury myself in the CFRs at the time.

Now, for the sake of argument, let's say the CFRs don't hold credentialed mariners to a higher standard while not sailing under their credential. I as a licensed mariner of 45 yrs and retired professional hold MYSELF to a higher standard than the non credentialed recreational boat operator when I am operating a recreational vessel. Nuff said.
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In my humble opinion, any argument against getting a license for fear of greater liability is totally bogus. You don't get to end it with "nuff said" either as you keep pushing this argument. Now, common sense says you hold people with greater experience and greater training to a higher expectation than a person out for their first day of boating. However, the law, the rules of the water, doesn't change. I do personally hold myself to a very high standard, but not because of the license I hold, because I have had the training and experience to know the right thing to do and to take captaining seriously.

Now, a licensed individual has one additional factor and that is the risk of suspension or loss of license. Even that is no reason to not get a license, in my opinion. Cost and time of education is probably the number one reason people choose not to get a license. It's expensive, although not when looking at the total expenses of boating. It also requires time, both sea time and classroom time.
 
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