Northill

[jimisbell]

Anyone ever used a 35 pound Northill? Folding stainless steel Fisherman. They were used on the PBY flying boat. A "boat" with a hell of a windage profile....LOL. Must have worked well for the military.

 

[bshanafelt]

great anchor.

I have one aboard as a spare.

If I could find a 45lb one, I would make it my primary.

 

[FF]

If you are not in love with it a fellow was looking for the SS anchor for his Catalina aircraft restoration.


Was wanted on this sites for sale list , try searching Catalina .

 

[Nomad Willy]

Jimisbell,
Pics of my steel aviation Northill style are on thread “Anchor Depth/Performance Reversals” on page 6 post 116.
I have a very similar Northill. Thought it was heavier but it’s only 14lbs. Never tried it. I’d like to see the details of your SS anchor.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Here’s a picture I took an hour ago.

 

[FF]

The SS was used for aircraft so stowing the anchor would not mess the compass system.

 

[MurrayM]

I've read that when winds shift 180 degrees (happens here quite often in the winter) or when currents reverse the anchor chain can foul on the fluke facing up, resulting in the anchor tumbling along the bottom...plausible?

 

[Lepke]

I used the large ss folding one on my commercial fishing boat. Held in any bottom, used with all chain.
Sure wish someone would make them again.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Lepke,
Many thousands of them in BC. Almost all are locally made in weld shops ect. And the’re made of plate mild steel. They love them.

 

[Shrew]

I've read that when winds shift 180 degrees (happens here quite often in the winter) or when currents reverse the anchor chain can foul on the fluke facing up, resulting in the anchor tumbling along the bottom...plausible?

Absolutely. It happened to my on my Fluke-style Anchor (Fortress). chain fouled on a little it of the exposed bar and mud tab. That is the first thing I thought of when I saw the Northill. I'm not comfortable with an anchor design that can get fouled on its own chain.

 

[Nomad Willy]

But almost never does the chain come back right over the top of the set anchor. Almost always the rode swings around as in a circle. Wind and water current don’t change suddenly. It can happen though.

As a feature I’d much prefer the bullet proof setting abilities.

 

[Nomad Willy]

On the aircraft anchors there’s a hollow V shaped depression in the center of the fluke that may give mud packing problems. It’s there for strength I’m sure but it’s not a feature of the Canadian home (or small shop) Nothills. They are heavy. Not something fishermen would be concerned about. Speaking of Canadians I wish a few would comment here about how well they work. How often the rode snags the non-working fluke would be nice to know about. Most of the comments to that end are theory only. I suspect it’s a fairly rare occurance judging by the very large number using these anchors. Most Candaian fish boats have one on the bow.
If I was to use my aircraft Northill a lot (probably not) I’d drill some holes in the V shaped depression to sluce out the mud. Would make a good experiment.

 

[jimisbell]

If I was to use my aircraft Northill a lot (probably not) I’d drill some holes in the V shaped depression to sluce out the mud. Would make a good experiment.

I will be picking up my 31 pound Northill in Oklahoma on Tuesday (according to charts, this size will hold a boat twice my size) . I will send pictures of it with some size reference in the picture. (All the pictures I have seen up till now had nothing in the picture for size reference.) I will wait on drilling holes till I have some experience with it in mud. Down here on the Gulf I see a lot of those "Homemade" Northills on the Shrimp Boats. The flukes are just a flat piece of 3/8" steel plate cut in a heart shape, Those guys are always getting "caught out" as their living is dependent on going out in ALL weather. I dont think they would use a homemade anchor if it didnt work.

The Northill will be my primary anchor because I want something that ALWAYS sets.

 

[Nomad Willy]

“Always sets”

Can’t think of anything that would prevent the AC Northill from setting. Short of mechanical failure.
Charts? What charts?

Best anchor for that in a commercial product would be the Super Sarca ....... IMO.

 

[jimisbell]

“Always sets”

Can’t think of anything that would prevent the AC Northill from setting. Short of mechanical failure.
Charts? What charts?

Best anchor for that in a commercial product would be the Super Sarca ....... IMO.

I have some tables published by Northill that show the size, weight, maximum pull, size of boat, etc.

 

[QB]

I have two folding Northills. I've used them as a stern anchor, but I wouldn't use them as a main anchor unless there there was no other option. They are made of stamped thin stainless plate, and the parts that make them foldable are another weak point. And they share the same poor design as the welded, cast, or forged steel versions: Only one of the relatively small flukes is going to be buried when the anchor is set, and they can easily foul. Any of the "new generation" designs makes for a better anchor.

Roger C. Taylor, in Elements of Seamanship: "Don't use lightweight seaplane anchors on boats; they make as much sense as lead keels on airplanes."

 

[Nomad Willy]

jinisbell,
Thanks.

QB,
HaHa everybody’s got an opinion. I’ve got lots.
The structural question is a good point though. But the home grown variety look quite strong mostly but most (almost all I’m sure) are made of mild steel. Rocna tried that. The Northill stocks are definitely weak despite the very clever engineering employed.
Folks have been telling me to buy a new car most all my life. It’s easy to say “buy a new anchor”. Dosn’t make the best interesting conversation though. But if you wanted to make a bullet proof statement saying buy a new one is about as good as it gets. Not bullet proof though.

Again I’d like to hear from the Canadians that use Northills regulary.

 

[healhustler]

Local guy has had this 34 lb. SS Northill on Craigslist for quite a while now. $200

https://sarasota.craigslist.org/bpo/d/boat-anchors-cqr-northill/6682009298.html

 

[HiDHo]

My storm anchor is a Northill that was a gift. The 45 CQR that was my main anchor till the Rocna Vulcan replaced it pull this Northill up from our anchorage on the loop in Ontario. It had a short length of three strand that had parted from who ever lost it. Not sure of the weight, feels like 50 lbs or so, maybe some one can id it from the R20 casting. The folding steel cross piece folds nicely with the shank for stowage as in the photos and has a clip midway to center it when deployed.

 

[jimisbell]

I got my new "Storm" anchor for the trawler yesterday. Dropped by and picked it up in Norman OK. after buying n on EBay. Its a 31 pound Northill SS folding anchor that was made for a PBY flying boat. Its about twice the size needed to hold "Waltz Across Texas" in almost any blow, maybe even a hurricane.
We stopped by and visited for a while with the last owners of the anchor, Ib and Tessy in Norman OK. They are good people that are thinking about retiring and doing some serious cruising. I hope we will get a chance to visit wit them again soon.


Pictures tomorrow. I am too tired to do them today after a 500 mile drive.

 

[markpierce]

Been told herring fishermen in San Francisco Bay were moving from Northills to Bruces for securing their nets.

 

[FF]

"Been told herring fishermen in San Francisco Bay were moving from Northills to Bruces for securing their nets."


Makes sense the Bruce was designed to anchor oil rigs on short scope , seem to be OK with a 1000% reduction in size.

 

[psneeld]

Northhill a storm anchor?

Not sure I would consider it a storm anchor with hinged parts and easily fouled design. Non folding ones only slightly better.

Plus.....

https://youtu.be/fNnRi-ROohg

 

[jimisbell]

Northhill a storm anchor?

Not sure I would consider it a storm anchor with hinged parts and easily fouled design. Non folding ones only slightly better.

Plus.....

https://youtu.be/fNnRi-ROohg

That U Tube vidieo is Bull S**T He is using a 12 pound Northill anchor and comparing it to a batch of 35 pound anchors to hold his 34 foot 7 ton sailboat. A 14 pound Northill was NOT made for that size boat and of course it wont compare to a 35 pound Claw/CQR/Fortress. Looks like he is setting it up for failure!!!! My anchor is a30 pound anchor which is one of the heaviest of the PBY anchors which ranged from 4 to 60 pounds. (8 sizes)



As to fouling,I have never seen any creditable report of such. I have done several theoretical scenarios of the suspected fouling and found that it is highly unlikely. Fouling would require that the rode become slack for the entire wrap because as soon as it becomes taught it resets the anchor. This would be unlikely in a wind reversal and in a tide reversal it would likely go straight over the top and reset. So unless someone can point me to a report that is creditable not just speculation, I totally reject that scenario.


The US Government during WWII was very particular about their purchases. That anchor was tested by the military thoroughly before it was purchased. Show me ANOTHER anchor that went through the government purchase gauntlet. It had to hold a huge twin engine airplane with a huge wing above it against wind. I think it was well suited for that.

 

[dhays]

The US Government during WWII was very particular about their purchases. That anchor was tested by the military thoroughly before it was purchased. Show me ANOTHER anchor that went through the government purchase gauntlet. It had to hold a huge twin engine airplane with a huge wing above it against wind. I think it was well suited for that.

The US government bought a lot of stuff during WWII. Some turned out pretty good. Others, not so much.

Anyway, you are saying that an anchor that may, or may not, have been state of the art at the time, was built for a specific purpose and was bought partly because they could be made quickly and cheaply, should be used 75 years later by us for an entirely different purpose?

 

[psneeld]

I flew aircraft that carried anchors... and while in the USCG, I read the reports and talked to guys who were in on the USCG and Navy initial purchase of the Fortress.......then to the skippers of the boats who actually used them. So using them as an example is as bad as using commercial fishermen as great, knoledgeable seamen......you know, the industry that sinks more than its fair share of boats every year from shear carelessness.

I will say it again....I would never chose a Norththill as a primary or storm anchor. I don't think the Navy ever intended to anchor PBYs in storms. I will bet money the Northhill was intended as a temporary anchor like both the hard and sea anchors we carried.

Not saing someone else shouldn't use a Northill.....just putting out what I know and think. Without calling someone elses efforts or thoughts BS.

 

[psneeld]

The US government bought a lot of stuff during WWII. Some turned out pretty good. Others, not so much.

Anyway, you are saying that an anchor that may, or may not, have been state of the art at the time, was built for a specific purpose and was bought partly because they could be made quickly and cheaply, should be used 75 years later by us for an entirely different purpose?

Like duck boats as many have vigorously posted about?

 

[Nomad Willy]

Jim,
I’ve got to say I think Steve’s deployment of the old 12lb steel Northill Anchor isn’t BS. I know Steve wouldn’t have told any untruth unless it was just an untrue opinion. We all have them.
And the big (34’ 7 ton boat) really wasn’t a factor. His engine and prop were though. Where he had the mismatch was testing 35lb anchors w a small engine of only 40hp. I have the same power and have backed down on my 13lb Danforth S many times. It holds well. Only time it didn’t there was a big clam and other bottom debris jamed between the flukes. Also he was testing in a rather loose bottom that probably needed more penetration than he got w the little Northill.

Also I think the Northill isn’t a hhp anchor. You would be at least slightly misled to consider it a “storm” anchor. A good working anchor or primary but not a storm anchor. A 31lb high performance Danforth would be better in a storm. The fluke area submerged is only half of the total. Unlike the Danforth, whereas both flukes are submerged and engaged in holding the boat. By the way the old Northill in HidHo’s post #19 is almost certainly made by Danforth. Danforth had enough confidence in the holding power to market the Northill. Also there’s so many Canadians using them today (mostly home or weld shop made) that they obviously have plenty of holding power. But I must say that a high percentage of the Canadian Northills in use are on fishboats. And fishermen almost always go big and heavy often to an extreme. Fishermen usually use heavy to very heavy anchors and almost never use a high holding power anchor.
But the thing that puts the Northill in a higher performance category re the aircraft anchors is that they were “lightweight” compared to the old steel Northill anchors. This means there was/is considerably more fluke area submerged than the old cast steel Northills. I would use my 14lb steel aircraft anchor as a primary. But if it’s gonna blow 40knots or more I’ll be getting out my XYZ.

 

[Mako]

I see lots of Northill-type anchors all over the Asian fishing fleet. Almost exclusively in many areas. But these are all solid (not folding). Most look rather crude or homemade, which says good things that they are of simple design. The shipyard I am working with now uses them almost exclusively, but I won't be going with one myself. Just personal preference.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Mako that’s interesting.
I think they are probably a bit like the Claws. Small fluke area and low ultimate holding power. They probably set much like the Super Sarca, Northill and Claw .. so very dependable. Most boats (especially pleasureboats) almost always anchor in Beningn conditions so holding power is rarely put to the test. That’s why anchor testing is so valuable. But other bad things happen too like one specific anchor does a small bit better than others and most rush out to buy it. So many pass up better anchors. Rocna comes to mind. But then over time the shortcommings are revealed. My sister usta tell me about the girls I dated “you’ve got to look for the inner beauty”. I often fell short. But she was right. Re anchors holding power is not the most important feature of anchor performance. I’m guessing setting is. And if it is the Northill, Claw and Super Sarca are very good anchors. That said you benefit if Anchor Right Austrailia makes a Super Sarca big enough. Wouldn’t be all that gracefull hang’in under a chainpipe though.