Sailing days are over, Which Trawler now?

[bigthaw]

love this forum,...
Spent 5 years sailing the Bahamas, Dom. Rep. P.R. V.I.'s and the entire Windward Leeward Isles in my 1971 Morgan keel c/b sloop.'78-'84 distant past charter captain, yacht broker, rigger, sailboat builder, much more....recently sold my beautiful 36 sloop...now, very seriously thinking about full time cruiser liveaboard on a Trawler/Diesel cruiser.
here are my detailed parameters (thanks for your patience in reading this)
questions at the end....
Will anchor out/ cruise Florida, Keys and Bahamas 7 months a year then marina liveaboard, plugged in for the summers.
which boat to buy?... 35-38 ft max length..love the aft cabins with centerline queen, don't like the climb up and down so much on the sundeck models...will paint most exterior wood if any white.
prefer single diesel, for less fuel and maint./upkeep costs.
only me and her, no dogs, a few guests, retiring,... all the time in the world...7 knots underway is fine! don't have to be anywhere...only fair weather traveling...
purchase 40k ish, so '80's boat, no project boats, but doesn't have to be sterling either..I am a pragmatic realist..can, will spend several months or more, cleaning, polishing, painting, redoing, fixing, prepping, updating for our living aboard.
I can't possibly anchor out on every boat I am interested in..So...
without getting into heavy, technical full, semi displacement, hard chine discussion...
*** which hulls/boats will roll the least, or be most comfortable, while anchored or moored...out, ???
so many boats look nice...I know what to look for when making decisions.. except this question above...
Carvers, Mainships, CHB's, Marine traders, Island gypsy, Prarie, Senator, President, heck I am even considering twin diesel aft cabin power boats that can cruise at 7-8 knots...Sea rays, old hats, chris crafts...on and on....experienced, informed opinions from cruisers that anchor out appreciated... I am assuming certainly, some of you do anchor out?...

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Welcome aboard.

 

[FF]

Start here,

Boat Reviews by David Pascoe, Marine Surveyor - Index

Boat Reviews by David Pascoe, Marine Surveyor - Index


Nov 7, 2015 - Boat reviews - These are reviews, not surveys, and bear no resemblance to our survey reports. We do not publish the results of the surveys that ...‎TIARA 3100 Open

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Boat Reviews by David Pascoe Boat Review by David Pascoe - A Few Favorite Boats and Yachts





A rare find if you can find one, not many were made because there are few who would want to pay so much for a new outboard boat. A real gem of an outboard ..

 

[O C Diver]

Welcome to the forum! At that price point, a very complete survey will be critical. You will find lots of boats with hidden ticking time bombs waiting to destroy your budget.

Ted

 

[diver dave]

I think you only asked one question, and that answer has to be;

catamaran

 

[bigthaw]

thanks guys, dave, cats are out, OC, I am more than well aware of the pitfalls found in lots of older boats...and am well aquainted with what needs to be inspected...there are good older boats out there....I just sold one..sailboat,...but you have to find them, I am prepared to look and inspect more than a few...
FF thanks for the dave Pascoe review site....didn't realize the carv's were that bad...yikes!!!

 

[bayview]

Had a 38000# Carver with V Hull, keel and flat shelf chines. Did Not roll much but then again in FL You don't anchor in trade winds and open roadsteads much. Nothing will be like a sail boat however. Even though it does not weigh much that mast provides grear rolling resistance.

 

[bayview]

After decades of sailboats the Admiral steered us away from boats that were "too sailboaty" it was a great decision. Wound up with a ACMY, no ladders, 15' beam.

For long term liveaboard and cruising I recommend looking at something longer. Power boats will look large to you at first but all boats shrink within a few months of ownership.

 

[DavidM]

At your budget, I think that you will only find hard chine, semi-displacement boats and all will handle about the same, get the same fuel economy and will or will not roll at anchor about the same. Your list of makes sounds good.

The most significant consideration will be condition, condition, condition. You sound quite capable of dealing with systems issues, but probably don't want to deal with rotten core, leaky tanks, a tired and smoky engine, etc. So look for a boat with good bones, a solid engine and maybe a genset but not essential.

David

 

[cappy208]

My criteria was NON cored hull, and NO, Not ever, Never, teak decks. Everything past that is fairly easy to maintain. I LIKE the paint idea! I have 4 pieces of teak trim on my boat. Sometimes that's too much.

The first boat I recall having a non cored hull was a Bounty ll sailboat (early 60's vintage) They built these things like tanks. They thought Glass had to be as thick as a traditional wooden plank hull. So to find a trawler built the same way takes time.

Unfortunately the Carver comments exemplify the other end of the spectrum.

 

[diver dave]

I'm between boats too, and am going through a similar decision making process. Only been out as far as the Turks, but I do recall many anchorages pretty much filled with sailboats that were just an awful place to anchor. I'll give a couple of examples.
Honeymoon harbour: in settled conditions, like all anchoranges, its fine. But when its not fine, its very bad. Grassy bottom, banks and rocks all around. Yet I find many sailboats there, simply because they can't get into Dollar Harbor, right around the corner. Twice now, I have awakened to a sailboat on the bank at first light, rolled over.
Chub Cay; another example of sails crowded together just outside the marina, and rocking and rolling, halyards banging, where 1/4 mile away is piece and quiet in a primitive channel. Again, draft limited.
North end of San Sal. Not a sailboat to be found, yet a really nice place to be.
Many, many examples of 4 to 7 ft draft causing the selection of rolly, crowded, noisy anchorages. I'm sure you know of others.
So, the selection of draft, in my mind is primary for "anchorability". not the chine, pounds of lead, or weight aloft. AND, given the option of privacy, I'll take that too.

 

[Pgitug]

Here you go.......
Your Welcome.

http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2007/Mirage-Great-Harbour-N-37-3099399/New-Bern/NC/United-States

 

[Pgitug]

here you go.......
Your welcome.

http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2007/mirage-great-harbour-n-37-3099399/new-bern/nc/united-states

 

[bigthaw]

My criteria was NON cored hull, and NO, Not ever, Never, teak decks. Everything past that is fairly easy to maintain. I LIKE the paint idea! I have 4 pieces of teak trim on my boat. Sometimes that's too much.

The first boat I recall having a non cored hull was a Bounty ll sailboat (early 60's vintage) They built these things like tanks. They thought Glass had to be as thick as a traditional wooden plank hull. So to find a trawler built the same way takes time.

Unfortunately the Carver comments exemplify the other end of the spectrum.

Yes Cappy, all agreed.....thanx

 

[bigthaw]

View attachment 66056

no end of good tugs in that price range....love it...

 

[bigthaw]

At your budget, I think that you will only find hard chine, semi-displacement boats and all will handle about the same, get the same fuel economy and will or will not roll at anchor about the same. Your list of makes sounds good.

The most significant consideration will be condition, condition, condition. You sound quite capable of dealing with systems issues, but probably don't want to deal with rotten core, leaky tanks, a tired and smoky engine, etc. So look for a boat with good bones, a solid engine and maybe a genset but not essential.

David

thanks Dave, again 7-8 knots cruising is just fine...and yes good bones without rot, delam, serious engine/drive issues, and or tank leaks is key....!!!

 

[bigthaw]

Welcome to the forum! At that price point, a very complete survey will be critical. You will find lots of boats with hidden ticking time bombs waiting to destroy your budget.

Ted

yes Ted, I am VERY familiar on exactly what to look for and what questions to ask....the most knowledgable surveyor in the state who I worked with at CSY yachts back in the '70's is a nearby friend...my knowledge of all the pitfalls is extensive...but not nearly as much as his...

 

[FF]

"The first boat I recall having a non cored hull was a Bounty ll sailboat (early 60's vintage) They built these things like tanks. They thought Glass had to be as thick as a traditional wooden plank hull. So to find a trawler built the same way takes time."

In those days resin was 19c a pound , and few trawlers were built of GRP as steel was also cheap.

Cores are not to be feared , DEPENDING on what the core actually is.

Proper cores like Airex are used in military vessels and pilot boats , but is expensive.

Balsa is avoidable with a core sample.

Plywood deck houses is hard to avoid, the newer the boat.

Chinese composite , a layer of GRP slathered over house grade ply for a deck or house is eventually a disaster.

Look at the Gulf Tubs , US made and mostly solid glass.

 

[Keysdisease]

A friend had a Marine Trader, seems to fit the bill for many of your requirements. He really enjoyed the boat and had a little to complain about. Single engine boats are the exception in the range you are looking for, so these are worth looking at


1979 Marine Trader 36 DOUBLE CABIN Power Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com


This is just a random example from a quick search, I do not know this boat or the owner

 

[bayview]

Again not all models and years are built the same regardless of brand.

All I can tell you for certain is that my Carver 440 had a solid glass bottom with core only above the water line. seemed a sensible solution to me.

It also had non wood stringers and frames, with aluminum cabin floor support frames, these were indications to me of reasonable attention to long lasting structural issues.

 

[bayview]

Iam not a fan of cored bottoms but many friends had them seemingly without issues.

I once saw a boat in the yard having its entire bottom core replaced. What a job. I think it was a KK but not sure.

 

[cappy208]

Not to bash the concept of a cored hull.... It's not that core is bad persé. But on a boat in the price range the OP wants to spend over that many years can you guarantee that one of the PO (or an incompetent yard person) didn't incorrectly penetrate and install a through hull wrong? In my experience as a yacht yard employee; It's not the initial installation. It's the SLOW creep of a water dribble through a poorly modified through hull that gives the poor reputation.

The older the boat both the more chances of poor installation, and the more chance of water migration damage.

 

[AusCan]

Not to bash the concept of a cored hull.... It's not that core is bad persé. But on a boat in the price range the OP wants to spend over that many years can you guarantee that one of the PO (or an incompetent yard person) didn't incorrectly penetrate and install a through hull wrong? In my experience as a yacht yard employee; It's not the initial installation. It's the SLOW creep of a water dribble through a poorly modified through hull that gives the poor reputation.

The older the boat both the more chances of poor installation, and the more chance of water migration damage.

Exactly! Non cored hulls are not necessarily better when new, but they are more idiot-proof. One little entry point for water can do a lot of damage when it goes undetected for years.

 

[FF]

"The older the boat both the more chances of poor installation, and the more chance of water migration damage."

Perhaps true with balsa , but a genuine marine core never has this problem.

The most difficult problem for unskilled yard workers is a high load item like davits or a deck crane .

These require a professional approach , even with a good core material to be successful.

 

[eyschulman]

Considering the OP's situation if it were me I would look for an older FG lobster work boat in the 34-36 foot range clean it up and add some simple amenities. You will not need a powerful motor if you can live with a max of 12K but this kind of boat is also happy at 6k or anywhere between, depending on how much fuel you want to burn. Put a small riding sail on the stern and she will come to attention on the hook. With its protected prop and shallow keel groundings will be less disastrous than with boats with exposed stern gear. If you don't want to truck if from New England with a reliable engine it would be plenty of boat to run down the coast.

 

[FF]

There are quality US made hulls , if you are willing to make some compromises.

We chose a US Navy Utility,,

Fantastic only military could afford construction , FR resin and it FLOATS ! even full of water, with a 15 ft long cockpit for the nice days .

6 ft of the bow with a collision bulkhead and a 15 ft cockpit leaves a modest interior, but the under 12 ft air height makes most bridges no hassle.

Shallow draft and low price .

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s9/50-uniflite-lobster-boat-conversion-29841.html

Not for everyone , especially the roomaran folks , but one idea.

 

[bigthaw]

not to bash the concept of a cored hull.... It's not that core is bad persé. But on a boat in the price range the op wants to spend over that many years can you guarantee that one of the po (or an incompetent yard person) didn't incorrectly penetrate and install a through hull wrong? In my experience as a yacht yard employee; it's not the initial installation. It's the slow creep of a water dribble through a poorly modified through hull that gives the poor reputation.

The older the boat both the more chances of poor installation, and the more chance of water migration damage.

exactly....