Side window mod Mainship 30 Pilot II

I have never fully appreciated my hardtop 30 Pilot's side window shape or function which has the optional canvas and isinglass "windows"- other option was solid glass. One of my Piloteer friends sent me this photo of a modified Pilot with a nice sliding glass panel window mod. Zooming in on this photo, it appears that only two straight cuts in the thin bulkhead were made to fit this window system. My current setup is at bottom, and I am starting to look around for a window supplier. We have not yet found contact information for this Carolina boat's owner.

The antenna is hiding another vertical brace.

I would think you could do better than that with a glue in window and track. Might see what Hinckley does. I know some are powered to go down into the wall. You could hinge it to swing inside and clip to ceiling.

Personally I think aluminum windows look like crap. Making it out of wood then Awlgripped would be much easier and match the lines and gelcoat.

I almost used the wood frames on my GB to go to glue in windows. Wife likes to open them on pretty days, so....

Choices said:

The antenna is hiding another vertical brace.

I would think you could do better than that with a glue in window and track. Might see what Hinckley does. I know some are powered to go down into the wall. You could hinge it to swing inside and clip to ceiling.

Personally I think aluminum windows look like crap. Making it out of wood then Awlgripped would be much easier and match the lines and gelcoat.

I almost used the wood frames on my GB to go to glue in windows. Wife likes to open them on pretty days, so....

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Looking through to the stbd side, I cannot see another vertical brace. In fact, I do not see any vertical braces in the window setup, just the sealing channels between window panels. The existing cutout would not be lengthened - just widened a bit on the top side. No additional bracing would likely be needed. My wooden Grand Banks had window openings longer that this with significantly taller glass windows in the main cabin, and when 15 people decided to go up to the flying bridge to watch a whale, I was unable to open the cabin door and ended up going out the aft cabin exit to tell half of them to come down. Had I tried to open a main cabin slider window, I am sure I could not have done so, but no glass broke. It probably functioned as a long brace to the vertical stresses.

While it may appear the window frame is aluminum, I cannot tell by blowing up the photo whether it is or not. I do not like the fact that the frame is a different color than the side of the house - I would not do that because I do not like the look of unpainted aluminum on a boat window frame.

I had my fill of wooden framed sliders with the attendant stainless steel channels on my Grand Banks 42 and would NEVER go back to that. One reason I bought this boat was to get away from all wood.

I can see how there is going to have to be some sort of trim/flange to hide the small gap on both sides of the window insert. That may be a flange on the outside and a separately attached interior covering piece. Still hoping to find this boat and get some more info.

Rich, That was my boat Bonnie. I sold her last year and she was trucked to Boston by the new owners. My wife and I went back to a Grand Banks as the kids are older and leaving the house now. The Windows were changed by the previous owner. They were an aluminum frame. They were obviously done by a local window shop and the quality was just OK. When I purchased Bonnie the windows had some corrosion already but they functioned well, and looked ok from the dock. The sliding windows allow a breeze through the pilot house at dock or anchor which is a big deal if your in the heat of the summer.

TOM ROLLINS said:

Rich, That was my boat Bonnie. I sold her last year and she was trucked to Boston by the new owners. My wife and I went back to a Grand Banks as the kids are older and leaving the house now. The Windows were changed by the previous owner. They were an aluminum frame. They were obviously done by a local window shop and the quality was just OK. When I purchased Bonnie the windows had some corrosion already but they functioned well, and looked ok from the dock. The sliding windows allow a breeze through the pilot house at dock or anchor which is a big deal if your in the heat of the summer.

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Thank you, Tom. Do you have any photos which might show the windows? Maybe the new owner is available. I would want a good quality built with snug-fitting window panels.

Rich, see the attached PDF photo from the inside of the Pilot house.

Perfect, sir! That looks soooo much better that what I have and looks to greatly increase the over all visibility.

You can have custom windows made in pretty much any configuration you need. I was looking at having some made for a previous boat but sold the boat before I got to the windows.

Rich, your Frolic keeps getting better and better. (Like Calypso before her).

Comodave said:

You can have custom windows made in pretty much any configuration you need. I was looking at having some made for a previous boat but sold the boat before I got to the windows.

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The first thing I am going to do is check in with the boat yard around the corner from me to see what they can offer in the way of experience with local marine quality window makers.

Someday, when I get a manufacturer lined up, I'll go out to the boat and make the two cuts necessary to open up the teardrop shaped opening and make a butcher paper tracing to hand off to them.

Blissboat said:

Rich, your Frolic keeps getting better and better. (Like Calypso before her).

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haha. There's nothing like stealing ideas from others.....

Rich: The 30 Pilot II with the hard top is a truly beautiful boat. The 3 or 4 year's I owned her I always felt the aluminum framed windows did not truly do her justice. I totally understand and recommend you pursue this improvement. I suggest you talk with the window suppliers. If I had done the modification myself and today, with the money I have today vice the money I had then, I would look at 5/16" poly carbonate maybe with a bit of tint in the original tear drop shape your canvas covers over the window opening. With some sort of sliding window on the interior to allow for the ventilation desired.

Enjoy the day. Most importantly get out and enjoy the water.

TOM ROLLINS said:

Rich: The 30 Pilot II with the hard top is a truly beautiful boat. The 3 or 4 year's I owned her I always felt the aluminum framed windows did not truly do her justice. I totally understand and recommend you pursue this improvement. I suggest you talk with the window suppliers. If I had done the modification myself and today, with the money I have today vice the money I had then, I would look at 5/16" poly carbonate maybe with a bit of tint in the original tear drop shape your canvas covers over the window opening. With some sort of sliding window on the interior to allow for the ventilation desired.

Enjoy the day. Most importantly get out and enjoy the water.

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Thanks, Tom. I have given thought about how to avoid a fixed pane as well as getting rid of the bothersome canvas and clear vinyl, and simply tacking on an interior frame over existing "blob curved" opening is entirely doable in about a day's labor. Unfortunately it would look like a tacked on modification over a "blob curved" opening no matter how artfully constructed. And worse still, the blob-shaped curve opening, which I have never approved of and think restricts visibility, remains. You interior photo looked like a very shipshape installation to me, and there is probably a way to avoid the "flange" look on the exterior side of the installation.

When I said brace, I meant a window break for sliders.

Make your frame out of extruded fiberglass. It can be cut and shaped like wood, and painted to match the boat. The frame can be glued to the exterior very cleanly, and the window channels can be made out of same fiberglass with Teflon slides for the glass.

I almost did this to my GB windows. But once incapsulated in penetrating epoxy and Awlgrip, they are done forever.

If the window glass is angle cut you would just need two pieces versus three of your idea boat, and I think both could slide and be much cleaner.

Choices said:

When I said brace, I meant a window break for sliders.

Make your frame out of extruded fiberglass. It can be cut and shaped like wood, and painted to match the boat. The frame can be glued to the exterior very cleanly, and the window channels can be made out of same fiberglass with Teflon slides for the glass.

I almost did this to my GB windows. But once incapsulated in penetrating epoxy and Awlgrip, they are done forever.

If the window glass is angle cut you would just need two pieces versus three of your idea boat, and I think both could slide and be much cleaner.

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Thank you for the ideas. I will certainly be looking at them all as I SLOWLY move forward.

The original canvas and vinyl closures in the side openings had the clear vinyl replaced and the opening zippers reversed from frowns to smiles for what I considered a huge sum after I bought the boat, and that job did not include renewing canvas. Eight years on I am seeing the need need to replace them, and I just can't stomach the idea of replacing something I always considered a PITA in a vision-limiting cutout. I'm gonna open this boat up like I should have back then and for probably a lot less cost because while I cannot do canvas work, I can cut straight lines with a saw and build simple structures and place glass in them. I had a LOT of experience doing that on my Grand Banks as wood frames grew old, panes cracked, and channels gave way to age.

As I begin to forge ahead in earnest with the project of updating my hardtop side windows, I had encountered several questions which I am going to pose here and on TF. After consultation with the boatyard where I received the recommendation to use Wynne Industries in Alabama where I could actually drive up to receive the finished product. Their website shows that this sort of thing is what they are about, and I have just sent them an email with photos of what I have and what I want.

Going through their order formand its options gave rise to these questions:

Glazing? Laminated safety, tempered safety, acrylic, polycarbonate

I had laminated safety on the Grand Banks and don’t want something with can be damaged by the sun or scratched easily. Laminated might be a bit heavy. Tempered? I dunno.

Tinting? Clear, solar grey, solar bronze, tinted green

I long ago found that tinted windows gave rise to a lot of interior reflected light at night plus the reduced visibility from the tint. However, if I go with a clear glass option I could experiment with films maybe even applying the metalized clear film I have on the car which provides protection from UV.

Mounting? clamp ring or flange

I dunno…..

Coating of the aluminum frame? Clear anodizing, flex white painted, flex black painted, or custom powder coated

I am not too attracted to an aluminum color which may well some day show saltwater corrosion, but I also don’t want a contrasting color of paint (white or black) on the exterior (interior does not matter to me). I had some aluminum on my trawler powder coated and know the cost of that and also saw the disappointing bubbles of corrosion after a few years. My center opening windshield has painted aluminum framing, and I have color match repair paint whenever corrosion appeared; so, I am thinking of letting them flex white paint it and then scratch it a bit with some sandpaper before applying a coat or two before installing the window.

I will be watching this project closely Rich, and let you make all the mistakes along the way, so when I decide to do it, the process will be perfected!

Mainship Pilot said:

I will be watching this project closely Rich, and let you make all the mistakes along the way, so when I decide to do it, the process will be perfected!

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Ok, Bill, but just know that my reportage of the incorrect things I did along the way to individuals may be directly related to the amount of their input.

Before you commit, I'd suggest you look at high end RVs. No, not Winnebago, look for shops online that do movie star Prevost conversions for ideas.

Thanks for the advice.

rgano said:

Ok, Bill, but just know that my reportage of the incorrect things I did along the way to individuals may be directly related to the amount of their input.

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:lol:

I have been off the air on this topic for a while as I conducted my research for this project. I finally settled on Wynne Marine in Tuscumbia, AL for the manufacture of my aluminum framed, three slinging panes windows for both price (about a third the cost of the Florida-based company that built the windows for the Bonnie pictured in the original post of this thread. The general manager there committed to the project after I described what I wanted telling me his goal was for me to be happy with the result, and he spent a lot of time with me during several phone calls to make that happen.

The glass is untinted, laminated, 1/4 inch weighing a total of 52 pounds for both windows. Each frame and clamp ring could be easily lifted with one hand, so maybe ten pounds each. I cut out probably ten pounds of fiberglass preparing for the installation.

I think the most impressive pair of photos are these two before and after shots. Look how with the canvas and vinyl closure I had to bend my head down to see out and how poor the view was in the aft quarter.

I had eight window pulls made from 1/4" glass measuring 2.5 inches by 1/2 inch which I glued onto the windows today using rear view mirror glue from O'Reilly's auto parts. I like them because they are unobtrusive and allow the windows to be slid over each other. (see third photo)

I received the window metal as anodized aluminum which I lightly sanded and sprayed (after removing the glass panels) with AL prep followed by an exact paint match from National Coating Systems in Nason Full-thane.

We moved the frames to the bow of the boat (hanging in its lift cradle in the boat shed) where butyl rubber tape was applied to mating surfaces of the exterior portions of the frames, after which the the three glass panels were reinserted into their individual tracks by slightly bowing the top track. The frames were then simply inserted into the cut outs, and the clamp rings were screwed into place from inside the bridge deck to firmly secure the windows in place.

Total cost of this project was right around $2,200, and I think it gives the boat a whole new lease on life.

Here are some more photos of the job. You can see where I gained a lot of visibilty as I hold up the old closure over the new window in the first photo.

Rich, Did you have that helm canvas cover made, or did you acquire it online or.......?

I had it made by a local upholsterer whose shop was near the house. He was willing to do the odd canvas job over the years on both my boats. I helped him measure for it, and it was really simple. I bet you have the in-house talent to handle it.

Rich looks good, well done.