How do I Dispute additional AliExpress Charges

[GoneDiving]

Guys, I have purchased a set of anular cutters on AliExpress. Their status is Paid but unshipped. This morning I received SMS and AliExpress messages saying that the seller thought I was in Indonesia not Australia and included shipping will be another $35.

To be honest the $35 isn't a deal breaker and I would have still bought them at the new price. However, the last minute change for seemingly BS reasons doesn't sit right. Should I canel the purchase, I haven't found any other suppliers selling this particular size cutters.

I have tried to dispute the transaction but get this message:

"After checking, we found the order is finished, so you cannot open dispute for this order.

Please click here for detail information."

Is anyone aware of a process to dispute additional charges before the items are delivered?

 

[BandB]

Guys, I have purchased a set of anular cutters on AliExpress. Their status is Paid but unshipped. This morning I received SMS and AliExpress messages saying that the seller thought I was in Indonesia not Australia and included shipping will be another $35.

To be honest the $35 isn't a deal breaker and I would have still bought them at the new price. However, the last minute change for seemingly BS reasons doesn't sit right. Should I canel the purchase, I haven't found any other suppliers selling this particular size cutters.

I have tried to dispute the transaction but get this message:

"After checking, we found the order is finished, so you cannot open dispute for this order.

Please click here for detail information."

Is anyone aware of a process to dispute additional charges before the items are delivered?

I had a dispute on an item recently through Paypal, which I hate. The item was nothing as described but returning would have been far too much cost and trouble. Finally had to just accept my mistake. Ultimately it was how much is the agony of the fight worth and I decided it wasn't worth it for the dollars involved. I hate surrendering when it's a matter of principle, but a smarter memory of the family said, "it's not worth it."

 

[catalinajack]

I had a dispute on an item recently through Paypal, which I hate. The item was nothing as described but returning would have been far too much cost and trouble. Finally had to just accept my mistake. Ultimately it was how much is the agony of the fight worth and I decided it wasn't worth it for the dollars involved. I hate surrendering when it's a matter of principle, but a smarter memory of the family said, "it's not worth it."

I was just cheated in the same manner. No delivery plus an unauthorized upcharge. PayPal was of no help. The item weighed over 60 pounds. The vendor provided "proof of delivery" via first-class mail, USPS. First-class mail is limited to 13 ounces. I pointed this out, twice, in my dispute but PayPal accepted the vendor's "proof" that delivery was made, that is, a confirmation of delivery of a piece of paper. My advice is to never use PayPal for ANYTHING. They do not stand behind their guarantee.

 

[Peter B]

Frankly, I doubt it is worth getting a raised BP about. Just pay it, and put it down to experience.

 

[mvweebles]

In the last 2-3 years, I've gotten much pickier about who I order from as I've had a couple 'learning experiences' with commensurate "tuition" paid. There is a lot of stolen merchandise online, even Amazon. Prices seem very good......until a return or something is desired.

Only future-tip I can offer (and may be exclusive to US vs Oz) is I use "Fakespot," a plugin on my browser that analyzes reviews. I assume it's helpful - certainly assists me in making a purchase decision.

Peter

 

[O C Diver]

While I do use PayPal for transferring money to an individual such as buying something from someone on this forum, I have a $25 limit on Ebay with it. Given a choice, I always use my credit card and have never had an issue with the credit card company standing up for me.

So far I haven't had an issue with PayPal, but you hear of many who have. I may be mistaken, but feel most people trying to commit fraud aren't looking to do it on small cost items (kind of like counterfeiting $1 bills).

Also, I don't let PayPal have access to an active checking account. Everything goes through my credit card. I never transfer money out of my PayPal account, only eventually spend it out of the account.

Ted

 

[CaptTom]

Had the exact same thing happen on AliExpress. The seller tacked on a shipping charge after accepting payment.

I opened a dispute immediately. There was a box for something like "price not as advertised." The seller asked me to change it and lie about the reason for the dispute (so it would look like my fault.) I refused and asked to cancel the order. At that point I had no faith in the seller. They pulled a couple of shipping numbers which were not in the country the product was supposed to ship from, and were never received by the shipping company according to their own tracking site. Evidence of this was enough to get Ali to reverse the charges. It did take a lot of time and effort. And of course the clock is ticking, because Ali (like PayPal) has a limit on when you can dispute a charge.

Another option is to dispute the charge with your credit card company. I didn't have to in that case, but it may be easier to prove the fraud to them than to a company like Ali, which seems to be biased toward the seller.

Personally, I'd fight tooth and nail for any amount of fraud, no matter how small. Just on principle. I don't want cheats and liars to win.

 

[FWT]

There are two issues. One is the honesty of the vendor. The second is the payment method.

I ALWAYS use a credit card. NEVER a debit card. I found PayPal to be very poor from the start and have not used them in at least 15 years.

Credit cards have a couple of things in their favor. First, the rules make it much easier to dispute a charge, and the companies I use have been very good about doing it. Second, rewards programs. The amount of money I get back in rewards is pretty sweet, and that's just with normal spending. Put fuel, parts, Marina fees, and upgrade expenses on it and it can do wonders.

 

[Seevee]

I just don't do business with cheats. Aliexpress and pay pal are not good. Do a google search on pay pal lawsuits... there's 1000s of them. They cheated me once. Got a refund on a product I bought, went thru paypal and I never got it. They had every excuse in the book. I don't even use a credit card if the vendor runs it thru his pay pal account.



I like Amazon and even Walmart at times. Easy to buy, easy to return... no questions asked. However, not always the best prices. For boating supplies, there's lots of good vendors out there.

 

[slowgoesit]

If the vendor has already shown a propensity toward deceit, I wouldn't assume just paying the latest ransom (increased shipping charge) will ensure you get your item. What it WILL do is drag out the purchase process longer, hopefully (for the seller) bumping you over the time limit for when you can file a dispute with your CC company.
Twice now I have had problems with a purchase paid for via Paypal. The first time, the item received was DOA. The vendor stated that since I had received the item, but it was broken, I needed to go though the manufacturer of the item, not the seller. Paypal agreed with the seller. I disputed with my CC company, stated reason "I had not received the item I ordered", NOT that the item was received broken . . . . CC immediately issued a conditional credit, then made it final within 14 days. Paypal was absolutely no help.

2nd item was today when I received my InSinkerator water dispenser. Bought new, received a item that had been "returned" for whatever reason, "inspected", then sold again as new. Even though it has had water through it, and STILL has water in it. I e-mailed the seller, asking for RMA, and return shipping label. If they don't respond within 24 hours, I will dispute thru Paypal, and then escalate to CC dispute if Paypal doesn't solve the problem.

I agree with CaptTom who said he refused to let scammers/frauds get away with it regardless of the cost, or my time involved. If more people did that, it would no longer be profitable to try and conduct the fraud. If more people acquiesce, rationalizing it that it's not worth the time to fight it, we will continue to have the same problem,

 

[firehoser75]

Just an additional comment about "extra, hidden charges" from Courier companies if cross border shopping.
When ordering anything from a US or even European based company, I try to ensure they ship via the postal service. Especially from the US, if a Courier company is used, and even though you have already paid much higher shipping costs due to it being "international", with a Courier there is always additional fees to pay upon delivery. To me, by definition, international means crossing a border and the higher shipping fees involved should cover all "extra costs" (possible exceptions are Duty and taxes that may be due)?? This is especially true as most sellers have already had to fill out all "paperwork" involved to internationally ship their product. But no, the Courier charges "extra", unknown until delivery (these fees usually a percentage of the declared value). Again a ripoff as their work to clear the parcel is not more for the same size, weight, type of item simply because the value is higher.
I try hard not to support businesses (Couriers) that operate in that manner. To me, they are like the Highwaymen of old: "STAND AND DELIVER".

 

[Lepke]

I guess the reason for buying annular cutters from China was cost. But there's many for sale on Amazon and probably ebay.

 

[Mako]

Not sure who you are referring to as “courier companies” but I just received today a plotter sounder directly from the manufacturer in Hong Kong, shipped via DHL. 100% great support. Once it cleared China customs it was here 3 days later.

So is DHL a courier company?

 

[BruceK]

Where is "the other Cairns" located in Indonesia? I`d really need to understand the deal on shipping to be sure but it smells scammy. You are probably going to have trouble getting a refund if you cancel, if you can on a "finished" order, whatever that is. Do you trust them enough to flush another $35 down the head?

 

[CaptTom]

Just an additional comment about "extra, hidden charges" from Courier companies if cross border shopping.

I've ordered from Canada, China, Russia and probably others. Never had any extra charges (except that one attempt at extortion on Ali which I immediately cancelled, see above.)

In the old days shipping terms included things like "FOB" but I haven't seen anything like that in ages. Maybe if you're shipping a vehicle or large piece of machinery.

But for ordinary consumer goods, I wouldn't (knowingly) buy anything from a seller who doesn't disclose all the charges and fees up front.

 

[firehoser75]

Let me be more clear in what I am saying. Courier companies include Fedex, DHL, Purolator, etc.

This might be (another) case where only Canadians are treated to this "special" treatment. But I can tell you from personal experience (several times) where I pay international shipping (from the US (seller) to my home) prices that are already far higher than the cost to ship an equivalent distance within the continental US (my assumption used to be that this was because of the procedures involved in importation, etc.). Then when the item arrives (and the seller has no knowledge of or control over this aspect of shipping their product to Canada) I receive a further bill for "services" rendered which are purported to be "acting as my custom's broker, paperwork, and then duties and taxes". In a few instances, these fees have added up to the value of the item purchased.
So any actual Government imposed duties and taxes (which by the way are often not charged on items of relatively low value if shipped via the Postal Service and no "broker fee" either) are one thing, but the other "hidden" fees charged by these couriers (when operating in Canada) are unacceptable and are levied at a point where you really don't have much of a choice (your front door).
So I have 3 choices, don't ever buy anything that requires international shipping, use the Postal service, or just suck it up and "get extorted" by the greedy couriers!
I have contacted several of the companies where I had made the purchases in question, and they stated to me that they filled out ALL of the required paperwork for international shipping prior to the courier pickup, and that they had no idea that I would be charged additional fees by said courier (shipping company).
Canadians on at least some items do "get" gouged by various companies. One example I can use is that I bought a Honda 2000i generator a few years ago. It was for sale at a Honda equipment dealer here in Canada for over $2000 Can. I bought it at Camping World (in person so no shipping) in Washington state for $980 US which at the time was about $1150 Can. When declared at the border coming home, the Customs Agent did not charge any duty and only collected taxes on a portion of the amount as I had a "personal deduction" or allowance. I saved just over $1000 Can. all said and done.

When I asked at the Canadian dealer, I was told that their wholesale cost was slightly higher than the price I paid in the US. Sometimes we Canadian's are "taken advantage of" and this courier issue could just be another example (based on some of the experiences related by other TF (US) members when they shipped internationally to the US)??

 

[Mako]

Firehose, I think it’s because Canadians are some of the nicest, most civilized people on Earth. So someone has to try to screw you in one way or another, just to make the rest of us jealous buggers feel better

 

[firehoser75]

Firehose, I think it’s because Canadians are some of the nicest, most civilized people on Earth. So someone has to try to screw you in one way or another, just to make the rest of us jealous buggers feel better

Thanks for that Mako,.......... I think?????

 

[Simi 60]

I just don't do business with cheats. Aliexpress and pay pal are not good.

.

I think that's a bit unfair to label everyone as cheats.

I have been using both as well as Alibaba, tao bao and eBay for decades with thousands of transactions and have only ever had one issue and about $20 lost but tens of thousands of $$ saved over the years

That $20 was when I was asked to send a pump back to China, I got a refund but due to freight cost was left $20 out of pocket.
Every other time I have made a claim and there's been a few, I get a refund very quickly and keep the product.
We have a $200 plastic sunlounge on the top deck, bought 2 ($400) and 1 had a crack.
Full refund on both, don't send them back.

. Do a google search on pay pal lawsuits... there's 1000s of them

1000's out of probably billions of transactions
Statistical noise.

 

[BandB]

I think that's a bit unfair to label everyone as cheats.

I have been using both as well as Alibaba, tao bao and eBay for decades with thousands of transactions and have only ever had one issue and about $20 lost but tens of thousands of $$ saved over the years

That $20 was when I was asked to send a pump back to China, I got a refund but due to freight cost was left $20 out of pocket.
Every other time I have made a claim and there's been a few, I get a refund very quickly and keep the product.
We have a $200 plastic sunlounge on the top deck, bought 2 ($400) and 1 had a crack.
Full refund on both, don't send them back.

1000's out of probably billions of transactions
Statistical noise.

I will add a bit to this. I spoke against Paypal and don't use them. My reason is that you don't have the leverage you have with a credit card company direct sale. Understand the reason many small vendors use Paypal is that they can't get regular merchant accounts for some reason, so selection of the worst. However, is Paypal worse than what we've seen from other banks? What about Wells Fargo?

Have I know people to lose on Paypal and Ebay and Alibaba? Yes. But I've known people to feel they got screwed by the local merchant they went to. I personally have done quite a bit through Ebay and never had a problem. We have a business that uses Ebay as a well and they work hard to maintain a perfect or near perfect rating.

I also don't find merchants from one country any worse than others as there are good and bad in all countries. China to the US is complicated by freight and both cost and time, but that's part of it to offset any savings.

My problem with Paypal really was I should have read reviews of the article before I purchased it and then I wouldn't have had to rely on them to help me. I tried to cancel the order one hour after placing it and the vendor refused and nothing got better from that point. However, the original mistake was mine, then complicated by a bad vendor and no assistance from Paypal.

 

[SteveK]

I have had two occasions in the past year where an extra charge was added but in both cases I was told in advance to expect it.
I have nothing bad to say against Ebay, PayPal or Amazon as all three had my best interest in mind with the few issues I had with product.
AliExpress, never heard of it.

 

[C lectric]

My limited experience . I have had good results with Ebay, Paypal and Amazon.

Amazon refunded an order before I even knew something was wrong. THe vendor could not fulfill the order. I got what I wanted from a different vendor still through Amazon.

I am not a high use purchaser so my limited experience won't tell all but so far it has been good.

 

[Trawler_traveler]

Just had UPS cheat me

Ordered two cut Lexan rounds from TAP plastic as spares for our seachest. It was time critical as we would only be at a land address for a week, so we asked for 2-day or similar shipping. TAP obliged and sent it with 3-day select guaranteed shipping from UPS.

UPS ... scheduled for Friday with $60 guaranteed 3-day delivery
Then ...
No ... scheduled for Thursday
No ... scheduled for Friday
No ... scheduled for Monday
We change our travel plans to stay through Monday
No ... scheduled for Friday
No ... we don't know when, we sorted wrong
No ... you can't ask for your money back, only the shipper
We pay an additional 17.60 to redirect the order to a marina

The guaranteed 3-day shipping for $60 ended up taking a week and costing us $77.60.

I have no desire to make TAP jump through hoops as it is not their fault that UPS has the 'only the shipper can request the refund' racket, so I spread the word.

 

[Bduffey]

Ditch PayPal

Afternoon

I have had issues with PayPal supporting the shipper when it was clear I was scammed. The scam is the shipper sends a letter (not the package) to the proper name and zip code, but a different address within the correct zip code. They use that proof of delivery. since UPS (and other shippers) will not show the street address, only the name and zip code. The proof is the weight is wrong, way too light.

I went to my bank and had the payment returned to me, even though I went through the complete waste of time, dispute of the payment with PayPal and lost. They don’t seem to understand a 25 pound item cannot ship as 3 ounces. The bank got my funds back in a day or two by claiming bank fraud, as that is exactly what had happened.

So don’t worry, just go to the bank where the funds were transferred to PayPal and tell them you were scammed. PayPal will not fight a bank fraud claim that is real and you will have your funds returned to your account. If it was paid by Credit card you just dispute the charge with them.

Then close your PayPal account, even EBay has left them, so don’t feel bad they don’t deserve it.

Good luck

 

[john-o]

I had similar experiences with FedEX, three times. The on line orders were dropped off a couple of blocks over, noted by the driver - "customer not home." FedEx has vendors as drivers, and these driver are pushed. Maybe not a problem in your area, but here, it is a problem. Any way, I have a closed circuit TV system that showed no delivery. So, based on my experiences as a commercial driver, here is what I did.
I sent a letter of my experience with FedEx to my neighborhood association, Carbon Copy to my Better Business Bureau , my Secretary of State Consumer Affairs Office, the Attorney General for my state, and finally to FedEx Corporate Office, and the vendor who I purchased from. One of my letters - to my state's Secretary of State, really got the ball rolling and it triggered a host of "please expand on your letter" from all those that I mentioned heretofore. So, if your serious enough of making things right, and tacking these people that take advantage of you, do what I did and let others who are in the business of protecting you.... do their job.

 

[Trawler_traveler]

I had similar experiences with FedEX, three times. The on line orders were dropped off a couple of blocks over, noted by the driver - "customer not home."

Funny you should mention that. We also had a 48-roll box of marine-ply dropped off two streets from the address on Monday when that delivery wasn't scheduled until that Friday. The tracking kept saying that the package was on its way for a Friday delivery and on Friday through the day the tracking was updated as if the delivery was taking place and it finally said the package was left on the front door - it wasn't. I can't imagine what would cause that kind of ghost tracking but we got our delivery thanks to an honest neighbor.

 

[BandB]

Ordered two cut Lexan rounds from TAP plastic as spares for our seachest. It was time critical as we would only be at a land address for a week, so we asked for 2-day or similar shipping. TAP obliged and sent it with 3-day select guaranteed shipping from UPS.

UPS ... scheduled for Friday with $60 guaranteed 3-day delivery
Then ...
No ... scheduled for Thursday
No ... scheduled for Friday
No ... scheduled for Monday
We change our travel plans to stay through Monday
No ... scheduled for Friday
No ... we don't know when, we sorted wrong
No ... you can't ask for your money back, only the shipper
We pay an additional 17.60 to redirect the order to a marina

The guaranteed 3-day shipping for $60 ended up taking a week and costing us $77.60.

I have no desire to make TAP jump through hoops as it is not their fault that UPS has the 'only the shipper can request the refund' racket, so I spread the word.

That is a common problem and no one is coming close to meeting delivery dates today. Also, the shipper would have no luck because they have had to agree to current terms that clearly state the deliveries are not currently guaranteed, only estimates.

We've had horrific problems with water deliveries. They are like airlines it seems in just feeding the bad news in small increments. For a Wednesday delivery, they'll email you on Tuesday night telling you it will be Thursday and on Thursday night telling you it will be Friday and on Friday night telling you it will be Monday and on and on. We are no longer using them. For half the price we can just have our own people pick it up at the grocery.

Of Fedex, UPS and USPS, we have found Fedex to be least bad of the three right now.

 

[BandB]

Funny you should mention that. We also had a 48-roll box of marine-ply dropped off two streets from the address on Monday when that delivery wasn't scheduled until that Friday. The tracking kept saying that the package was on its way for a Friday delivery and on Friday through the day the tracking was updated as if the delivery was taking place and it finally said the package was left on the front door - it wasn't. I can't imagine what would cause that kind of ghost tracking but we got our delivery thanks to an honest neighbor.

We've had the same. A Fedex delivery that wasn't for us, but couldn't get them to return and get it. Amazon is the worst. They will send a nice photo which clearly shows it's not been delivered to your home, but somewhere else. Then their only solution is to report it and you can order again. They would rather just write the goods off as a loss than make any effort to recover them.

 

[Flatswing]

Dump the vendor - find a new one u trust.
Personally I routinely use PayPal & find them a useful intermediary. I prefer not to give my cc info to an unknown company.
I have had to make 2 claims to PayPal for product not shipped or not as advertised. In both cases, my refund was received within 48 hrs. On one occasion- 2 hrs. Ymmv

 

[GoneDiving]

I think that's a bit unfair to label everyone as cheats...

Just an update on the purchase that promoted the originally post.

I paid the additional $50 as it was still cheaper and a more comprehensive set of cutters than other suppliers.

Domestic China shipping took a few days which the supplier informed me of citing the resent Corona induced freight SNAFUs. I was a little concerned, thinking that this was just a delaying exercise and that my order may indeed be lost. However, I've received a DHL tracking number showing that the set is now transmitting through Singapore so things are looking positive again. ?

Not an ideal situation, but I'm now a lot more confident that I'll receive everything as ordered.

The $50 may have been a BS add on or it may be a remnant of me opening my AliExpress account when I lived in Indonesia and this may have shown up as my current address somewhere

Like Simi, if I look at the proportion of my internet purchases that have gone bad, it's very very small. I don't want to take a $500 hit on this order but when amortised over all the good ones the results would be no worse than face to face or bricks and mortar purchases