Big enough for Great Loop?

[AdkChris]

Wow, had to search online for him.
Was it Matt Mattson? Will have to look at his youtube videos
That is 10' shorter then even I was considering.

 

[BandB]

How does a v berth compare to a double bunk berth? If the v berth is longer and has the middle cushion would it be better?
I really do like the centerline queen, it would be plenty for me! Why aren’t they more common?
How hard would it be to replace a bunk on each side of an aft cabin with a centerline bed? Seems like the side bunks have something hard to move built in under them. I want a break from projects!

Wifey B: Centerline beds are quite common. For sleeping on every night, V berths leave a lot to be desired. Bunks, I'd find unacceptable as my hubby and I like to be together in bed and like space to enjoy. You want minimalist, go for it, but not my idea of the way I'd want to spend a year. You asked and I provided examples of boats that would work.

 

[High Wire]

A test run sounds like a great idea.
First time I looked all I saw was charters that seem to be pushing a couple hour boat ride at hundreds of dollars per hour.
1 week at 24 hour/day x 7 day/week x $150/hour = $25,200 / week. I might as well buy the boat to see if I like it.

Don't remember what words I searched for but found more promising hits this time.

A week long charter in Florida for a 36 Grand Banks costs about $3000-5000 depending on what you need. Concider it an expense or investment.

 

[O C Diver]

CO Diver, why do you need to retrofit a boat? As you said there are so many sailboats out there for little money. What do you want that you can't find already done?

Can you tow a trailer behind a Hertz or Ryder rental truck?
Get your boat and your trailer and go baby go.

I've got my mother ship, see avatar. Will confine cruising with my boat to the East coast and Great Lakes.

The planned charter boat retrofit included gutting the berthing area for an Island queen bed, closet and clothing storage, full galley, and new head with shower. The truckable part was an 18 wheeler.

The small sailboat idea is fine for the Great Loop, but I tend to wonder away from civilization for up to 3 weeks at a time. A 40 gallon freshwater tank, 3 cubic foot refrigerator, no heat or air conditioning, and a 30 gallon fuel tank won't satisfy the mission parameters. That and I'm too old for nautical camping.

Ted

 

[OldDan1943]

You limit yourself by saying, "trailerable".
Look at a SeaPiper, if you can find one. Narrow beam, shallow draft, "trailerable".
I am only 5'7" and I still sleep with my feet over the end of the bed. Something I learned in the navy, to keep from rolling out the bed.
Headroom has yet to be fully defined. Does it allow for hair? Does it allow for deck shoes? Must you shuffle as you walk?
Shower? Need hand holds and a bench seat would be perfect.
Look at the available space for stores and clothing. Look at the galley.
I too am too old to 'camp on a boat'. I like A/C and heat and hot food.

 

[Marco Flamingo]

My wife and I have done quite a bit of cruising in our C-Dory 16 (which is actually 15' 11"). 10 day trips in remote areas. Once you've gone 10 days, an additional month, especially if there are marinas, isn't much different. I can hear the whining already about not having pressure hot water and 30 minute showers. Well, that's not why we cruise.

The smaller the boat, the more planning is required. Mostly on what to leave behind. But going small has incredible advantages. I also have a trawler and at 30' it has everything I could possibly need and then some. Because of it's size, it is not likely that I will revisit some of the best cruising grounds, like Kyuquot Sound, that we enjoyed in the little C-Dory. No need for a dinghy when the mother ship is 16 foot.

The question isn't really what it too small, it is what can you go without? I'm planning a week-long C-Dory trip right now, so my 30' megayacht hasn't corrupted me yet.

 

[djl]

If the OP is interested in the Nimble Nomad (as opposed to the Wanderer) as stated in the first post, it is possible to rent them for a reasonable price on the Erie Canal, eg: $1,600 a week.

Check out https://www.getmyboat.com/trips/qa4PpXaW/

 

[BandB]

A week long charter in Florida for a 36 Grand Banks costs about $3000-5000 depending on what you need. Concider it an expense or investment.

Wifey B: Or a wonderful vacation.

 

[bowball]

And what is too big? I’ve watched a video of Tony Fleming in his F65 going up to Canada and exiting in Nova Scotia… all his videos look amazing. What a life he leads. Wonderful aspirational videos of seeing scenery at a measured pace.

 

[Bill V]

Up until the border closure wife and I lived on our bout from early June till late August. At a hull length of 28ft and 11ft beam we were comfortable. There were times we stayed anchored 3 or 4 days, ran our generator couple hours per day, carry 85 gals of water and enough food without having to replenish for a month although most marinas in BC waters carry good assortments of food. Our boating costs every year are very reasonable. Much of our food comes from the waters we boat in as we love seafood. We love exploring, found many times an abandoned apple tree and black berries galore. As we drop crab and shrimp pots, fish regularly and shop at many farmer´s markets we eat very well. Yes a bigger boat would be nice, mine is paid for, I am retired, carry no debt and live comfortable enough to put money into savings every month. Am I happy with my boat, yes it is all I really want and can take care of. Comes out of the water in October and on my trailer to store in my heated shop all winter until early May. Yes bigger boats can be like bigger houses, more room to expand and enjoy creature comforts. More costs too.

 

[rsn48]

Paddle boarder paddles solo from Port Townsend Washington to Alaska, can't get much more basic and smaller than that:

https://www.nwnewsnetwork.org/lifes...ound-to-alaska-alone-on-a-standup-paddleboard

 

[kthoennes]

... Aging has gotten in the way. I don't have another major refit in me. My current boat will be my last cruise boat (I do single hand it).

Ted

I'm 59 so not ancient yet, but I'm already starting to think that way. I maybe have the years and physical ability to buy another boat (or two?) and get them up to my standard, but I don't want to. Time is racing, I'm going to wake up tomorrow and I'll be 80, and my kids will be gone. I wish our boat were bigger, I wish we had a third cabin or berth for guests, I wish we had a bigger dining area and seating for six or eight for dinner on the the aft deck, I wish - - but I don't have the time in life to chase all that.

 

[DavidM]

Sorry for missing the intervening thread stuff, but I finally saw this post and wanted to put in my two cents:

The main factor affecting a boat's suitability for long distance, Great Loop cruising is refrigeration. This of course assumes you are not just bouncing from marina to marina and enjoying their restaurants but are actually anchoring out most of the time.

A 4 cu ft dorm type fridge is just too small. My Pilot 34 had one like that and it worked for 3-4 days but not a week. A 6 cu ft can handle a week but a 10 cu ft is best. Admittedly much of our fridge/freezer space is filled with soft and hard drink mixers. If you did without these then a 6 cu ft world work out fine.

Also think about how you are going to reprovision. When I cruised full time, moving every day or two, I would look for a nearby grocery store every two weeks or less, sometimes every week but it was tough to find any closer than that. You had to have enough fridge storage to accommodate 1-2 weeks of cold food.

David

 

[kthoennes]

I'd agree refrigeration is big - we had Norcolds that barely worked on our last two boats. Dragged ice chests around, etc. Then about three months ago with lots of helpful advice on this forum we replaced it with a 110v, household LG high efficiency 7.0 cubic foot fridge on an inverter. Draws 25 watts when it's running, even less of course overall, and freezes the ice cubes solid in 20 minutes. Made a huge difference in the general comfort and convenience level. We really didn't appreciate the value until we finally had a decent sized, well working fridge.

 

[OldDan1943]

e replaced it with a 110v, household LG high efficiency 7.0 cubic foot fridge on an inverter. Draws 25 watts when it's running,

Do you know if it has a 12dc compressor?

 

[Landfall]

My biggest concern would be storage. Clothes for 3 or 4 seasons, dinghy, bikes, food. Once we hit town or dropped the hook we were normally off the boat most of the time, so living space would not be a big issue for me, to a degree. We liked the luxury of a couple weeks or more of food and water without eating out of cans.

 

[OldDan1943]

My biggest concern would be storage. Clothes for 3 or 4 seasons, dinghy, bikes, food. Once we hit town or dropped the hook we were normally off the boat most of the time, so living space would not be a big issue for me, to a degree. We liked the luxury of a couple weeks or more of food and water without eating out of cans.

YOU can live out of a duffle bag and a hanger, whereas you lady, not gonna happen. This is based upon my personal experience.
You will need your 43 foot boat 2 staterooms, 3 closets LOL

 

[kthoennes]

Do you know if it has a 12dc compressor?

Yes. That LG single door 7.0 (6.9) has an inverter/compressor, what LG calls a Smart Linear Inverter Compressor. No way I was going to try to mess with that configuration though, so yeah, on the hook I'm going from 12v to 110v to 12v... Not efficient I know but I'm no electrician, and the fridge is an energy sipper, and I wired the inverter to also provide an USB charging center for everybody's gadgets so I killed two birds with one stone.

I can't find a US spec page on it, but here's one from India that talks about the compressor.

https://www.lg.com/in/refrigerators/lg-GL-D201APZY

 

[catalinajack]

Yes. That LG single door 7.0 (6.9) has an inverter/compressor, what LG calls a Smart Linear Inverter Compressor. No way I was going to try to mess with that configuration though, so yeah, on the hook I'm going from 12v to 110v to 12v... Not efficient I know but I'm no electrician, and the fridge is an energy sipper, and I wired the inverter to also provide an USB charging center for everybody's gadgets so I killed two birds with one stone.

I can't find a US spec page on it, but here's one from India that talks about the compressor.

https://www.lg.com/in/refrigerators/lg-GL-D201APZY

Your LG works the same way as many models of boat/RV reefers, that is, the compressor is 12 volts which, when on battery power, requires 12 volts to be converted to 120 VAC which is then inverted back to 12 VDC. I never could understand why anyone would purchase a combination 120 VAC/12 VDC reefer and suffer the double conversion energy losses. Simply buy a 12 VDC only unit. Plus, the 12-volt only models do not have the inverter module which can fail and are not inexpensive to replace and never mind having to remove the reefer from its enclosure to replace it. I suppose some boats only have 120 VAC handy so it makes sense for some folks. When we replaced our two reefers, we had both AC and DC lines avaible at the back of the enclosure.

 

[Scooby5959]

It would take me a long time to answer this question properly, The boat I sold a year ago was a 38 foot aft cabin,with a walk-around bed ,separate head ,Separate shower the boat I have now ,26 Nordic it has everything that other boat had except walk around bed ,And a separate shower ,walk around bed, I don’t need ,but I had storage on both sides of the bed ,was i more comfortable than my 26 Nordic absolutely ,but I really like my 26 Nordic it does everything I needed it to do ,I’ll be installing a shower in the cockpit this winter .advice on a compressor refrigerator is a good one .the compressor for my refrigerator is under the cockpit floor 10 feet away from the refrigerator you can set it to freeze everything like a rock or refrigerate everything ,I didn’t think I would like it ,but I like it quite well, you’ll have to figure out heating and cooling ,two people in a small environment creates a lot of moisture and can get quite uncomfortable ,but you can deal with it fairly easily other than that it depends how well you get along with your woman ,there are women I couldn’t live with in a 10,000 square-foot house .when they start telling you How it Has to be instead of figuring out the best way to make it enjoyable .they’d be walking the plank ,If she’s a fun living nice person to be around, you’ll have the time of your life bumping into each other ,you could have the time of your life on that little boat with the right person

 

[rslifkin]

Your LG works the same way as many models of boat/RV reefers, that is, the compressor is 12 volts which, when on battery power, requires 12 volts to be converted to 120 VAC which is then inverted back to 12 VDC. I never could understand why anyone would purchase a combination 120 VAC/12 VDC reefer and suffer the double conversion energy losses. Simply buy a 12 VDC only unit. Plus, the 12-volt only models do not have the inverter module which can fail and are not inexpensive to replace and never mind having to remove the reefer from its enclosure to replace it. I suppose some boats only have 120 VAC handy so it makes sense for some folks. When we replaced our two reefers, we had both AC and DC lines avaible at the back of the enclosure.

If you're thinking of the Danfoss/Secop compressor based marine fridges, they're not 12v compressors. They run on low voltage 3 phase AC if I'm remembering correctly, so the power module is doing conversion regardless of input power. In my case, the fridge is 12/120, so I just didn't put the 120v outlet for the fridge on the inverter sub-panel for efficiency's sake (so it only uses 120 on shore or generator, 12v the rest of the time even with the inverter on).

 

[Hippocampus]

The Nimble is a nice little boat and IMHO would do just fine. Another choice is the Great Harbor 35. More likely to keep your S.O. happy and probably better in slop.

 

[Northern Spy]

In the original post the OP asks about a Nimble Nomad. In post 25 the OP writes of a Nimble Wanderer.

Which is it?

Personally, I could do the loop in either boat. But I'm not the stereotypical "bigger is better" North American.

With two people the Wanderer would be more comfortable, obviously.

 

[Frosty]

I never could understand why anyone would purchase a combination 120 VAC/12 VDC reefer and suffer the double conversion energy losses. Simply buy a 12 VDC only unit. Plus, the 12-volt only models do not have the inverter module which can fail and are not inexpensive to replace...

I wonder if this is true for one of the most popular compressors for 12V DC refrigerators, namely the Danfoss/Secop BD35 or BD50. Reason is say that is this: My Vitrifrigo (BD 35) Comes with one of two electronic controller modules. The basic one is 12VDC only. Then the AC/DC module simply has an AC section on the top of the otherwise-same controller.

From my reading, it does sound like that little AC section is more prone to failure than anything else on the controller; but when that happens the refrigerator still works merrily along on DC even if you never repair or replace it. You just lose the little AC adapter section on top.

Replacing the controller module (if you want to retain the ability for it to run directly from AC), is a matter of about $300 and ten minutes' time (undo one screw, swing out, unplug connector, then move ~10 blade connected wires over to the new tangs).

It's possible that some people have the refrigerator installed so you can't get to the compressor module easily, but that's a risk in any case because that means you can't get to the 12V DC connections, speed resistor, etc.

************
I got the controller unit with the additional AC converter module on it because it was not a lot more money and there are times it's convenient to run directly off shore power for one reason or another. If that section died, I would probably replace the controller module and keep the now-DC-only one as a spare, but there would be no rush.

 

[BandB]

And what is too big? I’ve watched a video of Tony Fleming in his F65 going up to Canada and exiting in Nova Scotia… all his videos look amazing. What a life he leads. Wonderful aspirational videos of seeing scenery at a measured pace.

Wifey B: And the F65 would be a great loop boat. We did the loop in a Sunseeker Manhattan 65 which was 69'4" vs the 70' 10" of the Fleming 65. Larger boats than those have done the loop.

 

[Scooby5959]

Funny made me laugh

Wifey B: And the F65 would be a great loop boat. We did the loop in a Sunseeker Manhattan 65 which was 69'4" vs the 70' 10" of the Fleming 65. Larger boats than those have done the loop.

Funny made me laugh, do you have the twin 800 hp or the twin 1200 hp engines in your boat .what are you doing on this forum 2000 hp planning hull boat ,don’t get me wrong nice Boat .I’m skeptical about doing the loop in one , you got any pictures of that boat on the Erie canal ,laugh out loud my twin engine Hatteras burned 27 gallons an hour . does that burn 270 ,I know I’m being sarcastic .I can’t help myself , I thought you were worried about global warming .Maybe you’ll trade it off on a solar powered boat next ,I can’t think of a worse Boat to do the loop ,but to each his own

 

[BandB]

Funny made me laugh, do you have the twin 800 hp or the twin 1200 hp engines in your boat .what are you doing on this forum 2000 hp planning hull boat ,don’t get me wrong nice Boat .I’m skeptical about doing the loop in one , you got any pictures of that boat on the Erie canal ,laugh out loud my twin engine Hatteras burned 27 gallons an hour . does that burn 270 ,I know I’m being sarcastic .I can’t help myself , I thought you were worried about global warming .Maybe you’ll trade it off on a solar powered boat next ,I can’t think of a worse Boat to do the loop ,but to each his own

Wifey B: Expect you to be a jerk. In case you didn't look up, about half the boats on this site are either planing or semi-displacement. As to planning, well, we're always planning ahead. :lol:

I've known one to do the loop in a 75' Hatteras. Actually, there was a guy with one of the earlier Pacific Mariner 85's who regularly took the Erie to and from the Great Lakes every year. When Westport redesigned the PM 85, it would no longer clear all the bridges.

We typically had six aboard for the loop so made it a good size.

As to being called a liar by you, I've been called one by much better people.

Since you're concerned with our fuel usage, I did pull up the old performance data on the boat we used. At 26 knots cruise, about 79 gph. Of course could run 10 knots at 9 gph or 12 knots at 21 gph. Only problem on the Erie Canal was the speed limits. Obviously didn't take the Western Erie with a flybridge so went up to Oswego and Lake Ontario. Later the Welland Canal to Lake Erie. Had twin 1200 hp MAN's.

I only answered the question asked by another and the point is you can do the loop with boats from 20' to 70' and probably even smaller and larger.

I am worried about global warming and readily admit the conflict between that and our boat usage. I hope to see continued progress on alternatives. Meanwhile we continue to do our part in other ways and we've significantly reduced our personal and business usage. Meanwhile we don't apologize for our boating.

We're here because we do a lot of cruising much like others here, see the same areas. Doesn't change things by doing it faster. On our current cruise in Europe, we've benefitted greatly by information exchange with the owner of a hybrid who boats similarly, other than speed, to us in our planing boat and we thank him for his continued information and advice. St. Tropez or Scandinavia look the same whether you arrived at 6 knots or 45 knots.

 

[PT Bay Watcher]

I am not familiar with the Nimble Nomad but my wife and I spent a year (over 6200 miles) doing the loop in our Ranger Tug 25 and had no regrets. It was the experience of a lifetime and the smaller boat helped us stay in shape because of all the time we spent going ashore and walking/hiking (sometimes for miles).

I agree:

Go small
Go simple
Go now

Gold looper 2016-17

 

[Seevee]

Wifey B makes some great points, as others have.



If one is comfy in a small boat, that's just fine. But most are not. The average boat size on the loop is in the 35 to 50 ft for a reason. They fit their owners well and they work with enough creature comforts, reliability and economy to get the job done.



Smaller that 40ft would not work for me, and I'd make no apology if I could afford a Fleming for the loop which is a fine boat, however, not my first loop choice.



And it one wants better economy, get a smaller single engine full displacement in the mid 30s. Great economy with some reasonable creature comforts.


As for global warming, that's a subject for another thread, but it's way over emphasized and a bunch of poppy cock and political food to fight with. I DO NOT support it.

 

[Scooby5959]

I’ll look at those boats real hard, I like a lot of the features .I’m not a big fan of having to climb out of the hole to get on the back deck ,like I do in my boat, one of the things I like about the Ranger .they seem to be real nice ,but in the end I ended up with what I have for better or worse