Engine oil level. Any way to monitor it remotely?

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The pressure, as measured at the bottom of any tank, tells you the "weight" of the water column above it, and hence how deep the fluid level is. But it only measures what's above the sensor, so the sensor needs to be at or below the tank bottom. That's why you would need to install it off the drain plug, like you would install plumbing for an oil change system.


Thank you for the additional explanation, TwistedTree. Makes perfect sense. Even if I could only rely on it for accurate readings with the engine off, while sitting at the dock, having such a device would help immensely. Sounds like a fairly easy thing to try too. If I do go this route, I'll let you know how it works. Unfortunately, due to Corona, it will be many months before I get to tinker with this.
 
Scott- Is that the only access to the engine compartment? You mentioned a "cocoon". Sounds like it completely boxed in so you really don't have an engine "room". Do you have access to the sides of the box? You could cut out panels in the sides of the box and install plastic hatches.

They really made engine access fun with that design!!!

I think I see the yellow tipped dipstick on the top of the motor. You probably could shorten the tube and stick then access it from one of those hatches.


Hi Ski,
I have good and easy access to much of the bilge by taking up the stairs going to the forward cabin. This gives me good access to most systems (waste apparatus, fresh water apparatus, fire extingushing system, Inverter, charger, hybrid components, etc.). Unfortunately, there are no access hatches through the "cocoon" to the engine from here. Only way to access the engine is by raising the big hatch in the salon. You are correct, the dipstick is in the upper right corner of the engine photo. One thing I will take a closer look at when I am able to return to my boat is moving the dipstick to the other side, cutting it a bit shorter and angling it such that it points forward. This is because I have excellent bilge access to the outside of the forward facing wall of the cocoon. I could make a small access hatch door in the cocoon there. I do not have any easy access outside the side or aft panels of the cocoon. On the rare occasion when I have to get equipment in these areas, I actually have to remove the entire cocoon, which is a 30 minute PITA project all by itself.
 
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IIRC US boats have a composite floor, no table, and no “cocoon” with easy access to all systems. I haven’t been on one in about a year but that’s my recollection. Doesn’t help in this situation, but others should know that the current US boats are not configured like this.


I think the main problem, Beaverlake, is that the boat is simply too small and too low for a "proper" engine room along with decent headroom in the main salon. My air draught is only 9 1/2 feet, which I've come to prize very highly over the years, as it opens up an incredible number of inland cruising possibilities (which I admit, is probably not so interesting to folks in this forum).

What a difference 6 feet can make, however. I was astounded by the engine room in a 39' Kady Krogan I saw for sale (in this forum, I think). It even had a built in toolchest and WORKBENCH!!! under the pilot house. Amazing.
 
Ok, now that I have seen what a disaster your engine access is, who would design it that way, my suggestion changes a bit. How about putting an access hatch in the large hatch above the dipstick. Google Bowmar inspection Hatch for a possible one. Then I would take the carpet and cut a rectangle in it a bit larger than the inspection hatch. Take 2” velcro and sew around the hole in the original carpet. Have 1” under the carpet and 1” exposed around the inside of the hole. Then sew 1” velcro on the bottom of the cut out piece of carpet so then you can velcro the inspection hatch cutout carpet down until you want to access the dipstick. When you want to check the oil, rip up the carpet cutout, open the inspection hatch and check the oil. Easy peasy. We have done the velcro trick on a previous boat and it worked well. You would need to find someone to bind or serge the edge of the carpet where you cut it. Or instead or the velcor just put snaps in the small hatch piece and snap it down.
 
Speaking as a long time owner and operator of them, tradition M series Allison marine transmissions do NOT "self monitor" oil levels. Typically they will have a oil pressure gauge tapped off them. The most accurate reading of the oil level is by doing so when the engine is running and in neutral, which is what the dipstick is calibrated to. Some owners, after taking such a reading at "full" will take another with the engine off for a little while and etch the dipstick to get an approximate "cold" reading.

Perhaps the so-called "Allison man" tries to extrapolate from pressure readings? I'll have to look. EDIT: ok I just took a quick look see. He is talking about modern over the road vehicle transmissions, not marine.

I have a manual for the Allisons on another drive somewhere. Acadian is an excellent resource https://www.acadianmarinetransmission.com/
 
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My reference was to the Allison 3000 motorhome tranny. It has a dip stick but advice is to use to do rough check. When run and at temp you push a combo of buttons and it reports fluid level status.
 
Some cars have an electronic oil level sensor that check oil level before you start the engine, you may look at retrofitting this in your boat.
Good thought.!..My car, 2019 Toyota, sends me an E-mail health check every month that confirms the oil, fluids, tire pressures, etc. How do they do that!:blush:
 
What about having the carpet cut and bound around the hatch? It would remove 1 step in the process.
That's what I did on my boat to make ER access faster. The carpet guy called it "upholstering the hatches". All my floor hatches (5)
are done in this manner.
 

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At some point PO could not lift the hatches. Maintenance took a dive. They are heavy. I'm looking into hinges and struts, but even then, they are not something I would want to fool with offshore. I rely on oil pressure, water temp, and EGT. Thermistors and digital readouts are extremely easy to add so I anticipate adding more to monitor block temps. I want early warning if a hose pops.
 
Google Bowmar inspection Hatch for a possible one. Then I would take the carpet and cut a rectangle in it a bit larger than the inspection hatch. Take 2” velcro and sew around the hole in the original carpet. Have 1” under the carpet and 1” exposed around the inside of the hole. Then sew 1” velcro on the bottom of the cut out piece of carpet so then you can velcro the inspection hatch cutout carpet down until you want to access the dipstick. When you want to check the oil, rip up the carpet cutout, open the inspection hatch and check the oil.


I had a look at the Bowmar inspection hatches, Comodave. Thanks for the idea, along with the clever velcro tip. I had sort of ruled out an inspection hatch before because the one I was envisioning was round (screw in) and only about the size of a hand. It wouldn't have worked because I am not able to position it exactly over the dip stick. But the Bowmars, being larger might just give me enough room to reach the dipstick. Furthermore, I would also be able to access the coolant cap. I would want to be able to affix engine room insulation to the inside of the hatch cover. Right now, about the only positive thing I can say about my engine access situation is that the whole installation results in VERY quiet operation. Carrying on a normal conversation while sitting directly above the diesel engine running at cruising speed is no problem :)
 
At some point PO could not lift the hatches. Maintenance took a dive. They are heavy. I'm looking into hinges and struts, but even then, they are not something I would want to fool with offshore. I rely on oil pressure, water temp, and EGT. Thermistors and digital readouts are extremely easy to add so I anticipate adding more to monitor block temps. I want early warning if a hose pops.


Hi SoWhat. Wouldn't you worry that by the time the oil pressure shows "too low" (as a result of lack of oil), it's already too late...and that damage has already been done? Along the same lines, I recently installed an exhaust temperature alarm...because by the time the cooling water temp gauges show overheating, the exhaust system may already be in crisis.
 
That's what I did on my boat to make ER access faster. The carpet guy called it "upholstering the hatches". All my floor hatches (5)
are done in this manner.


Thanks for the idea, Codger2. Looks like a nice, clean solution, in the photo. I will be up for new carpeting before long and will give "upholstering the hatches" strong consideration!
 
Using camera to check fluid levels

I like the idea of the sight gage. I have multiple PTZ 1080p wifi cameras in my engine room arranged so I can pan around, look and listen while on boat and remote. On Amazon around $40 they are almost throw away cheep but have lasted 2 years so far. I have found a pinhole diesel, clogged filters, and diesel filter vacuum by strategic positioning and panning cameras. Adding the sight tube to oil and trans. answers that one too.
I also find them useful to monitor the bilges.
IR capability shows what's up even in the dark and shows excessive heating.
Hard to see but I highlighted on of the cameras in yellow.
App can pan and zoom in on gages of interest. Not 2nd pict. diesel filter gage and tank sight tube. Easily zooms in to view.
 

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oil level monitor.

If you are worried about engine oil level underway, the easiest way to keep your eye on what is happening is to attach a thermocouple to the side of the sump with glue and monitor the oil temperature as part of your hourly log. Put an alarm in the system and you can get the alarm to tell you when the oil temperature is getting too high. You can set the temerature yourself by noting what is 'normal' and adding say 10 degrees to the alarm level. Temperature gauges and alarms are so much easier to fit. I do have one on my exhaust mixer and one attached to the side of my Jabsco with alarms on both. The Jabsco will warm up if water fails and if you set it to 50C it will give you a good warning that you only have a few minutes before the Jabsco will fail. The temperature and alarm at the exhaust mixer will be following close behind!
I would expect the oil temp to go up gradually and only experinece will tell you what to set its temperature alarm at. These temperature alarms are quite cheap and easy to fit.
 
While all these remote reading ideas are great, as a pilot, mechanic (A&P/IA) and avid boater, I am a strong believer in a physical check of the engine room. Both a "preflight" check of fluid levels, belts, leaks, loose equipment/accessories and general condition as well as periodic checks of the engine room while underway. I am afraid that the only suggestion that I can make is to modify your ER access to make this easier.
I have also just re-read Beebe's book "Voyaging Under Power" where he spends a lot of time discussing engine rooms and ER checks. Access us important
 
I would think this switch, which I use as a bilge pump switch. Could be connected to a tube which would replace your dipstick and show a idiot light when oil was low. Then you could open the hatch and replace the tube with the dipstick b/4 deciding to add oil or mark the tube to match the dipstick and eliminate the original dipstick. I don't think it would be too accurate while running as it would be reading crankcase pressure also but then neither would a level sensor.
https://www.ebay.com/b/Maytag-Washer-Dryer-Water-Level-Switches/99697/bn_3214368


These switches are very reliable and have much to recommend them as bilge pump switches Par and Groco both make a bilge pump switch based on this.
 
The recent thread on ST44 Daily Engine Checks prompted me to create this thread.


The only way to check the oil level in my 165hp turbo diesel engine is via the dipstick. In order to do this, I must take up the carpet and padding in the main salon and raise a very large and heavy engine hatch (that has the dining table permanently bolted to it). A real PITA.


I thought maybe I could find some type of electro-sensor device I could insert in place of the dipstick, such that I could have an oil-level gauge at the helm. So far, I haven't been able to come up with one. Has anyone ever seen anything like this? Or, does anyone have any alternative solution to suggest?


I have ruled out cutting an access hole in the hatch because the construction of the hatch would not allow me to position such a hole in the necessary location.



Thank you, in advance, for your thoughts on this!
Hi, I do not recommend the short-cut. One of the important details of being a seaman is to--just piddle around the bilges—you never know what you’ll find. Let me copy here an article I wrote for Professional Boatbuilder:
THE GENIE IN THE CIGAR BOX
September 15, 2008

Back in Havana in 1945 we were about to finish the construction of our new sailboat, ALFIN. An old seaman by the name of Cucho had found our first boat, the Black Eagle, for us a couple of years before, and let us moor her at his dock, where he watched out for her. He had become a good friend of our family. One Sunday afternoon, while I (age 14) was visiting Cucho’s home, he told me this story about his own youth and his father.
“My father was, as I am, a commercial fisherman. He fished on a sailboat with a small auxiliary engine, the type of boat they call a goleta. We were living in Regla, a town directly across the entrance channel of the port of Havana.
“Our family lived in a small house not far up the hill from the port, from which you could see many landmarks: the National Observatory; La Cabaña, the Spanish fort defending the east side of the harbor’s entrance; and next to it, the Morro Castle, which was right at the entrance to the harbor.
Cucho grew up helping his father in his spare time. When the old man decided to give up the hard life of fishing and retire to a home he owned inland, Cucho left school at the age of 17 to captain his father’s 45-ft Goleta. His family, which included several brothers and sisters, depended on the income from his fishing.
Six months into this operation, Cucho’s father came to see the family on one of his periodic but not-too-frequent visits. Sitting with Cucho on the porch that evening, he asked his boy about the fishing business and the Goleta.
“It’s not going well, Father. I just don’t seem to be able to keep up with things breaking. I’m always having problems with maintenance, and I’m about to give up and sell the boat.”
Cucho clearly remembered that his father jumped up, put his hands on his head, and said to him, “Ay, Cuchito, I am so sorry that I completely forgot to give you my genie.”
“A genie? Father, I’m serious. The boat seems to break down on every trip. That prevents me from fishing, and you want me to get a genie?”
His dad went to a closet in the back of the house and brought Cucho a small cigar box closed up tight, with paper and fibers from a tow-sack glued over it to keep it shut.
“Son,” he said, “inside this box there is a genie--a maintenance genie. My father had him for years, and now you will inherit him from me. Never--remember never, ever--open the box and allow the genie to fly off. Keep him aboard the boat, and just get in the habit of moving him every Sunday. Take the box from where you had it last week, and put it somewhere else on the boat, as far from the previous place as possible. You should know that the genie is a solitary fellow and favors places in the boat that a person can hardly get to. You know: those really out-of-the-way places in the bilge and in the forepeak and under the engine. Promise me that you’ll do this every week, and I can assure you that the genie will take care of the maintenance problems.”
Six months later, on his father’s next visit, Cucho could not wait to talk to him about the fishing, the goleta, and the genie. “Father,” said Cucho, “that genie is fantastic! The boat has had absolutely no problems since you gave him to me. Just last Sunday, while I was moving his box, I discovered a sea-cock that was about to fail and could have sunk the goleta. I’m now moving him twice a week, and you won’t believe the things I’m finding that need repairing. I wouldn’t trade him for a million pesos!”
EL FIN (THE END)
Kiko Villalon, Pine Island, Florida
 
I like the idea of the sight gage. I have multiple PTZ 1080p wifi cameras in my engine room arranged so I can pan around, look and listen while on boat and remote. On Amazon around $40 they are almost throw away cheep but have lasted 2 years so far. I have found a pinhole diesel, clogged filters, and diesel filter vacuum by strategic positioning and panning cameras. Adding the sight tube to oil and trans. answers that one too.
I also find them useful to monitor the bilges.
IR capability shows what's up even in the dark and shows excessive heating.
Hard to see but I highlighted on of the cameras in yellow.
App can pan and zoom in on gages of interest. Not 2nd pict. diesel filter gage and tank sight tube. Easily zooms in to view.




Thanks for the tip hpogue! The pictures demonstrate impressive quality for an IR camera at near-throw-away pricing!
 
If you are worried about engine oil level underway, the easiest way to keep your eye on what is happening is to attach a thermocouple to the side of the sump with glue and monitor the oil temperature as part of your hourly log. Put an alarm in the system and you can get the alarm to tell you when the oil temperature is getting too high. You can set the temerature yourself by noting what is 'normal' and adding say 10 degrees to the alarm level. Temperature gauges and alarms are so much easier to fit. I do have one on my exhaust mixer and one attached to the side of my Jabsco with alarms on both. The Jabsco will warm up if water fails and if you set it to 50C it will give you a good warning that you only have a few minutes before the Jabsco will fail. The temperature and alarm at the exhaust mixer will be following close behind!
I would expect the oil temp to go up gradually and only experinece will tell you what to set its temperature alarm at. These temperature alarms are quite cheap and easy to fit.


Thank you for the idea, mikecambrai. I am happy to have all input on this topic. With this strategy, I already have two thoughts, however:
1) I'm not sure I would trust any kind of glue to reliably hold something to the side of the crankcase cover.

2) If I'm getting a low-oil "warning" as a result of temperature rise in the oil, then I think it might be already too late. Too much damage already done!
 
While all these remote reading ideas are great, as a pilot, mechanic (A&P/IA) and avid boater, I am a strong believer in a physical check of the engine room. Both a "preflight" check of fluid levels, belts, leaks, loose equipment/accessories and general condition as well as periodic checks of the engine room while underway. I am afraid that the only suggestion that I can make is to modify your ER access to make this easier.
I have also just re-read Beebe's book "Voyaging Under Power" where he spends a lot of time discussing engine rooms and ER checks. Access us important


I don't disagree. Some have suggested inspection ports on this thread and that might help me with oil and coolant checks. For the rest of the checks, the entire engine hatch has to come up. My current hatch has pistons, but even with them, the hatch is almost too heavy for me to lift. I struggle more and more with this as I get older. The table bolted to the hatch cover is a really heavy, solid table that has a lift top with a full bar inside. So this adds to the overall challenge of lifting the hatch. Perhaps I could lighten the load by first consuming the gin, vodka & rum :rolleyes: Somebody mentioned "motorized" for the hatch. This is also something I hadn't considered. A motorized hatch together with a complete re-work of the carpeting layout might wind up being a good answer for me.


P.S. I have seen so many recommendations of "Voyaging Under Power" that I now have it on order with Amazon.
 
Hi SoWhat. Wouldn't you worry that by the time the oil pressure shows "too low" (as a result of lack of oil), it's already too late...and that damage has already been done? Along the same lines, I recently installed an exhaust temperature alarm...because by the time the cooling water temp gauges show overheating, the exhaust system may already be in crisis.

My experience has been different. On a 2-day voyage my old Perkins developed a
slow oil leak. I noticed that the oil pressure was gradually decreasing hour after hour.
An engine check revealed that the level had dropped by a quart or two. And the leak.
No harm was done and it showed why it is so important to monitor oil pressure.
 
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