first time in fog

[OldDan1943]

I have a bright upper deck light. I know it wont help much but, I think I would turn it on too. Maybe even turn your spotlight so as to light up your mast.
If 'they' refuse to be seen, you want to be seen.
Stick your head out of the pilot house or run with a door or window open and listen.

 

[bayview]

IMO the big danger today in fog is other people running fast because they think their electronics makes them safe.

 

[OldDan1943]

IMO the big danger today in fog is other people running fast because they think their electronics makes them safe.

and out run their depth sounder.

 

[psneeld]

I guess I am different because of life experiences and where I have lived, driven and boated....but its the rare time I wind up in fog all day and I still feel safer than driving many times and in many places.

I bet statistically my chances are better too.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Good time to find out if you can steer a compass course.
It’s not all that easy and one should practice before one gets into the soup.
Also a good place to practice is not in the Swinomish Chanel.
But a good compass makes it much easier.

 

[hollywood8118]

This is a great read, lots of great advise here.
The only thing I would add is in fog I slow down and use the autopilot to steer, taking steering out of the mix allows more time to study the chartplotter and the radar. The OP didn't really have that choice with the channel width. Target fixation is a common problem in fog as one can easily loose situational awareness. Of course in tight quarters you need to watch the effect of current so the boat doesnt crab itself into something you don't want to hit.
I prioritize radar first, plotter second,compass third.

And don't forget the sound signal.. in the PNW there is always a group of kayakers that decide paddling between islands in pea soup is a good idea

HOLLYWOOD

 

[psneeld]

And a good autopilot makes it even WAY easier....

 

[Codger2]

How else does one get experience without baby steps? Its how I learned and most of the other captains I know.....its sorta how we learned in aviation. One day you are practicing and getting pretty good at it, the next you are doing it.

My aviation experience (Instrument flying) resulted in absolutely no fear when running in fog. Don't get me wrong, when I say no fear, I was equipped with an excellent radar, AIS, sonar, electronic charting, etc. practiced almost daily. I embraced all the safety measures like proceeding slowly, using my programmed fog horn signals, but did not have a fear of being in those conditions. (Thick fog) I owe it all to great instruction when
I was pursuing my commercial pilots license and became very comfortable when I was under the hood or in actual low visibility situations. IMHO, there is no substitute for professional instruction in running in fog & trusting your instruments!

 

[bayview]

yes trust your instruments. After a while in fog people are disoriented and may think they are going in the wrong direction. the instruments dont usually lie. A compass and depth finder can confirm that the chart plotter is correct.

In coastal sailing staying outside a certain depth such as the ten fathom curve removes depth worries.

 

[firehoser75]

As has been stated, have the right instruments, know how to use them, slow down, and trust your instruments. Without your instruments to guide you, fog can be incredibly disorienting.
What worries me the most, are some "other" boaters. I have come across many (unfortunately) who don't have either radar or AIS, don't put lights on or sound signals, and run at planing speeds despite very limited visibility! Crazy IMO, but they can be out there.

 

[Mako]

yes trust your instruments. After a while in fog people are disoriented and may think they are going in the wrong direction. the instruments dont usually lie.

Isn't that what did that Kennedy kid in with his plane over Long Island?

 

[magna 6882]

One thing that helped me in this channel that the current was running like 4 kts so i new i was not going run into a log, as previously sighted, since i was floating with them and only idling for steerage. I had thought of turning around but had to factor in control upstream and the possibility of contacting debris.
One good thing is learning and i sure know now i can handle the channel when the suns out.

 

[Alaskaflyer]

In or near an area of restricted visibility, whether by day or night, the signals prescribed in this Rule shall be used as follows:

(a) A power-driven vessel making way through the water shall sound at intervals of not more than 2 minutes one prolonged blast.

(b) A power-driven vessel underway but stopped and making no way through the water shall sound at intervals of not more than 2 minutes two prolonged blasts in succession with an interval of about 2 seconds between them.

(c) A vessel not under command, a vessel restricted in her ability to manoeuvre, a vessel constrained by her draught, a sailing vessel, a vessel engaged in fishing and a vessel engaged in towing or pushing another vessel shall, instead of the signals prescribed in paragraphs (a) or (b) of this Rule, sound at intervals of not more than 2 minutes three blasts in succession, namely one prolonged followed by two short blasts.

Etc.

 

[Alaskaflyer]

One of my rules of thumb is never wait until night or fog to become intimately familiar with your radar unit, its capabilities, nuances etc. Heck, pay for some instruction even.

The first two years of professional work years ago I never went more than a short distance without running radar as if my life depended on it, in broad daylight. Practice like you’d want to perform. Back then you were manually tuning gain and sea and rain clutter, and practicing allowed me to find the geese on the water at night and not just the boats. If boarding a new to me boat now I’d do the same thing.

 

[jungpeter]

Hi Magna 6882,

Well, as you've obviously learned by now, running the Swinomish Channel with good visibility is a challenge. To survive running the Swinomish Channel in deep fog, particularly for the first time, is putting yourself WAY, WAY out there on a limb! Congratulations on your success. I bet you won't do THAT again!!!

But to answer your question, "...should I have turned around?". Ah, yup.

No matter how sophisticated you electronics, and your confidence in its ability to provide adequate situational awareness to operate in a very shallow, very narrow channel, this Channel is NOT the place to test your abilities. As others have mentioned, there are many, many small boats (usually crabbers) running to and fro in the Channel this time of year. Virtually none of the locals seem to practice COLREG requirements (slow down, turn on running lights, sound appropriate sound signals, etc.) required to operate safely in reduced visibility. Even absent other traffic, the Channel itself offers up such treats as missing channel markers, shoaling, floating logs and other debris, and plenty of other navigational challenges, even in daylight with unlimited visibility.

Much of the advice you've been offered is fine. However, much advice is often wrapped in non-local regional practices. From many, many years of operating in and out of that Channel, I can say that running the Swinomish Channel totally under autopilot in fog is NOT good practice! A moment's missatention to course and/or location puts you in the mud REAL fast. Poor response to autopilot command (at turns, for instance), puts you in the mud REAL fast. If you need other eyes on the electronics to help you stay in the channel, that's a REAL good idea. And despite some admonitions to get a good compass, and learn to steer by it, that's really a red herring. True unto itself, but in the Channel in the fog, also not good practice.

And I'm sorta alarmed that some of the pilots in our midst state that running in the fog brings on absolutely no fear of boating in the fog, as their absolute trust in there instrumentation (presumably in their aircraft) translates to fearlessly running a boat in the Swinomish Channel in deep fog. While I'm not a pilot, I've been afloat for many, many years in very well equipped powerboats, in this local region, and the prospect of running this Channel in deep fog absolutely tips my concern level from deep respect into "nope, time to beat feet,wait for the fog to clear, and live to fight another day."

So, what's the best practice to navigate the Swinomish Channel in deep fog? Simple. Don't. Stay at the dock, or immediately return when conditions go to pot. But again, bet you've learned that lesson for yourself!

Regards,

Pete

 

[SoWhat]

Isn't that what did that Kennedy kid in with his plane over Long Island?

Kennedy had spatial disorientation where he lost both horizontal and vertical awareness. Vertical being the more fatal part. If you think you are falling and pull back on the controls you will stall the plane. Game over. Not an issue with boats.

Important to note that gps accuracy is not always what they claim. It is easy to check on most mfd's.
AIS can provide a false sense of security because most boats don't transmit.
If you are at lower helm with noisy engines you probably won't hear fog horns even with the door open. If you are outside the door, it can be difficult to determine exactly where the sound is coming from.
Radar is the most useful but takes a lot of practice to pick out small craft in all the noise.

In area fog there is no point in turning back because it might drop down anywhere. If it's coastal fog bank then you have choices to make. In OP's scenario I would have proceeded.

 

[sledge]

Magna,
I spent a full season based in La Conner and yes there is a great deal of logging right there in the channel. Sounds like you left at highest current speed, which can be challenging even on a clear day... though it is docking there that obviously is much more difficult.
I get what others say about "turning back"... but honestly turning around in that channel especially at high current would be really difficult and I don't know that I would've tried it. Plus perhaps someone else is following you slowly and you don't know if you could have pulled a U-turn right in front of them.
One other thing I don't think anyone mentioned: Many VHF marine radios like my Icom have an automatic Fog sounding function if its connected to an outside hailing horn. I've practiced with it to make sure it works and the radio through that loudspeaker actually does a pretty good impression of a normal air horn and blasts for 5 sec every 2 minutes, and you can make adjustments to this period. Anyway, if it was something you were familiar with you could engage the mode to take your mind off of watching a clock....
if this sounds like something you're interested in, just pull out your VHF radio manual and search for "foghorn" function. Anyway, congrats on getting through!

 

[markpierce]

All-white vessels can be difficult to see in fog. Dark-colored hulls have an advantage.

It seems the typical boater here doesn't turn on running lights or make sound signals in the fog.

 

[Mako]

Mark, that yellow stripe on top of your bridge was a smart addition. Safety orange may be better, but is sorta ugly actually.


Personally I've always enjoyed running in fog, open ocean, no traffic around. Calming. Much different than being in a busy waterway of course.

 

[High Wire]

To the OP, you did well.

Now what would you do different for the next time to reduce your anxiety?
Hopefully you get to the point where you anticipate targets coming onto the radar. IE Marker R6 should be coming up here, yes there it is. Wait now there are two targets so one is the marker and the other is a small boat, coming at me, etc.
Leave your radar on all the time underway and fog (or heavy rain, smoke, or dark) will be easier on you.

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

Now Learn On Your Experience

So we were in La Connor last night. Our first time running the Swinomish channel. When we woke up this morning real heavy fog which the weather had forecast so we waited for it to lift. It did around 11:00 and i saw other boats running so figured the coast was clear. About a half mile down we ran into the fog that hadn't lifted. It was thick enough that i could not see the water in front of the bow. I slowed way down and just followed the chart and the radar. Finally became clear after a couple of hours.
Should i have turned around?
Is there anything i should have done differently?
Since i could not even see the channel markers is it prudent to put that much trust in the charts?
The pictures were taken when we got out of the worst of it. I had my hands full but once out of the channel i relaxed a bit.

Disclaimer: I have never run the Swinomish Channel.

Now you have had your first fog encounter (We all here have had that experience). So now based on this and the good advice here on TF (use what you feel is valuable and **** can the rest) sit down with the Admiral and review your actions, her's actions. Do you need more radar training, are there times when you should stay in port and other things. Update on electronics? When was the last time you updated your electronics charts.

You won't always be able to turn around of avoid fog. No need to fear fog if you use a spotter, slow down and use your electronics. Use your VHF. Ferries and such run on VTS and channel 13. Don't be afraid to call them to let them know where you are.

So now when you get back to your dock, pull the chunk of coal that was between your cheeks as it is now a diamond....

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

To the OP, you did well.

Now what would you do different for the next time to reduce your anxiety?
Hopefully you get to the point where you anticipate targets coming onto the radar. IE Marker R6 should be coming up here, yes there it is. Wait now there are two targets so one is the marker and the other is a small boat, coming at me, etc.
Leave your radar on all the time underway and fog (or heavy rain, smoke, or dark) will be easier on you.

Dang you beat me to it

 

[OldDan1943]

Isn't that what did that Kennedy kid in with his plane over Long Island?

On subs, you close the hatch and submerge, you better believe your instruments, that's all you got.

As a forester when I was running compass lines for 'cut blocks' I most definitely believed my compass to lay out the block and to get back to the truck.

I let another guy run a line, he did not believe the compass. I told him to give me back the compass. You believe it or dont, your decision. If you choose not to believe the compass, either throw it away or put it in your pocket. He decided to believe the compass. Guess what, we ran the block and did not get lost. SMILE

I suspect, for whatever reason, Kennedy decided not to believe or lost faith in his instruments or perhaps had a electrical or mechanical failure.

Buy an aviation hood to qualify for instrument rating. Take to the boat and have you wife/other person, standing next to you giving you guidance..... you can only use your instruments. No peeking up. After a while, you will believe your compass, your electronic charts and RADAR

 

[Seevee]

Kennedy had spatial disorientation where he lost both horizontal and vertical awareness. Vertical being the more fatal part. If you think you are falling and pull back on the controls you will stall the plane. Game over. Not an issue with boats.

Important to note that gps accuracy is not always what they claim. It is easy to check on most mfd's.
AIS can provide a false sense of security because most boats don't transmit.
If you are at lower helm with noisy engines you probably won't hear fog horns even with the door open. If you are outside the door, it can be difficult to determine exactly where the sound is coming from.
Radar is the most useful but takes a lot of practice to pick out small craft in all the noise.

In area fog there is no point in turning back because it might drop down anywhere. If it's coastal fog bank then you have choices to make. In OP's scenario I would have proceeded.

So What,


Yea, Kennedy was not instrument proficient and just lost his situational awareness... didn't know which was was up, and even though it was a visual night, there was no horizon, with haze. Had he just turn on the autopilot, he would have likely survived that.



And, along that note, an autopilot is great in a boat. It will hold the heading you want with little effort, and a lot of them will hold the heading with drift correction. And one can focus on other things, like the radar.


A minor note.... GPS IS accurate, usually within 10 feet. It's the mapping that may not be.

 

[Northern Spy]

Sounds like the OP did just fine. I would have done what you did. Running through Deception would be my last choice. Would not use an AP in Swinomish either. Particularly in fog with a current running. Prefer to hand steer, particularly to avoid logs and kayakers.

Funny how we in the PNW and BC get nervous in shallow water. It's the norm for Floridians. Wouldn't go anywhere in the NE if you waited out the fog. And you did it in a 4 knot current which might freak out some.

We fear what we don't understand.

 

[Portage_Bay]

The good advice continues in this thread. An example of how good TF can be!

I am going to wander off topic and challenge you on one of your decision points. This does not specifically relate to fog but boat handling in general.

One thing that helped me in this channel that the current was running like 4 kts so i new i was not going run into a log, as previously sighted, since i was floating with them and only idling for steerage. I had thought of turning around but had to factor in control upstream and the possibility of contacting debris.
One good thing is learning and i sure know now i can handle the channel when the suns out.

You have much more control of your vessel running upstream than downstream. Think docking in a strong current. If the current is on your bow you match boat speed to current speed and gently ease into the dock. If the current is on your stern then you need to be backing the entire time or come in hot and back hard.

In the channel moving downstream this translates to needing to stop moving over the ground you must back into the current, in your case at 4 kts! To maintain steerage add your minimum steerage speed to the current. Heading upstream you have broad range of boat speeds to achieve your goals. Move upstream over ground, move down stream over ground, hold your position over ground. All while have more flow past the rudder(s) for control.

That said, yes you are correct, you were much less likely to strike foating debris when headed with the current. Until you come up on a dead head stuck in the bottom. I saw that on my last transit of the slough.

 

[Hippocampus]

I’ve cruised a lot down East. Fog still scares the pants off me. Docking in a cross wind or strong current and lightning does too. Guess I’m a wimp.

 

[Fletcher500]

This photo is from this morning in the San Pedro Channel off LA. The last 2 hours of the trip was about 100 to 200 ft of Vis. Some of the worse fog I have ever seen. It’s all good when everyone plays nice and slows down, until the 40 something sport fisher ignores my calls to slow down as he is approaching me and then does a close pass at 15Kn. Also, I don't think the color of a boat makes any difference when its pea soup thick.

 

[Ang]

certainly concur with comments on low speed, radar, AIS, automated fog horns and listening.

a fine point is transmitting an AIS signal. Had the experience of being on a course that intercepted a freighter at the northeast corner of Orcas island. The island block radar sweeps. Since we were transmitting, the captain of the freighter hailed on VHF and we coordinated. Was never able to see his 700+' vessel.

our greatest challenges is PNW fog are logs and very small fishing craft zipping at 15 kts+. Radar can have it's limits.

to the OP, doing the Swinomish in fog... Wow.

 

[Portage_Bay]

...Radar can have it's limits.

to the OP, doing the Swinomish in fog... Wow.

Everything has it's limits. That's why it's not a good idea to rely too much on any one device or source of information.

• Radar is line of sight and dependent upon operator skill.
• AIS is dependent upon the the other boat transmitting or having AIS at all.
• VHF depends upon the other vessel listening, and you knowing how to contact the other vessel. It isn't always 16.
• Plotters and electronic charts have accuracy issues at times.Sound signals depend upon the other boat using them.
• Magnetic compasses must be compensated.
• Sounders sometimes just go nuts.