Generator comparisons

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i have to take exception to the post about high rpm gensets not being up to the task. we have 2 boats. one has an entec (farryman diesel) 1900 hrs and the other is a nextgen 3.5 1100 hrs. we anchor out 90% of the time so we're using the gensets a lot. both units can power all electrics pretty much simultaneously using common sense power management. both have provided solid service with no major problems, one for 17 yrs the other 10. when i have had to talk to manufacturers they both have been great.
 
We took a 5kW NL around the world 1995-1998. We put about 3,000 hours on it and it ran flawlessly, so when it came to buying new generators for Fintry in 2003 to replace her existing 220VDC pair, I chose a pair of 9kW NL with 24VDC operation.


IIRC the 9kW was new at the time. We went through half a dozen belts, supplied by NL, in the first 100 hours. Then, at 300, and 500 hours we lost the fuel solenoids in the two units. I sent a photo of the nameplate from one of the solenoids to the solenoid manufacturer, who told me that they were 12V units. Well made, I guess, to last several hundred hours at 24V.


My guess is that the generators were originally built as 12V units and were converted to 24V for us. I would have assumed that there was a BoM and maybe even a kit for doing the conversion, but somehow the fuel solenoids were overlooked. It took NL 4 months to admit their mistake and refund my cost for the new solenoids.



We replaced one of them with a 12kW NL when we installed a Quick gyro in 2019. It had about 2,100 hours on it when we took it out. The other one is still going strong, with about 2,300 hours, as is the 12. So, except for the belts and solenoids, our experience with NL has been excellent.



An NL generator would be my choice the next time I have to choose. As it happens, we have made an offer on a boat that has an 8kW NL and a Lugger main engine and I couldn't be happier.


With that said, I think you'll probably be all right with any of the 1800 rpm units, but if you expect to put thousands of hours on your generator, I'd pick NL.


Jim
 
I can't compare to other brands, but had an Onan EQd on my last boat and liked it -- quiet, reliable and easy. So, when I spec'd this boat, which has Cummins mains, I went with a pair of Cummins/Onan EQD (17 or 18 kw, as I recall). They each have about 1800 hours, completely trouble free. I should also mention that they are quiet. If the boat isn't plugged in to shore power the generator is on, 24/7.
Really have to strain to hear it, even in the middle of the night in a quiet anchorage. In fact, after returning to my dock and plugging back in to shore power, more than once I have left the boat without realizing that I had not shut down the genset.
 
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Generators

Would like to get thoughts and opinions on different brands of diesel generators from those with experience with them.

What diesel generator do you think is the highest quality, and why do you think it is?

What maintenance issues have you dealt with, with yours? Brand, Age/hours is a factor here, so it may help to state that?

For those who have had warranty service, how satisfied with the service from the brand are you?

What has the support been like from the brand you use?

Thanks for any help that can be offered.

I have a 9kw Isuzu. 2000 hrs on it. Works like a champ but it's loud. No issues so far other than annual maintenance.
 
I worked in a boat yard once upon a time, general wrench monkey, and put an automatic start on an Onan eqd. I remember being really impressed with the unit. Which is a funny contrast to the old ball of rust (Onan) in our mainship. That Onan always was hard to start, wanting for repairs, and noisy. It was almost 40 years old though....
 
Our 7Kw Onan EQD,fitted to an 05 boat, came with just 135 recorded hours(mains were 700hrs). It starts well, runs quietly,churns out amps. Big improvement on the MDKD 6.5 in the previous boat. In Australia, Onan(Cummins) tends to be the most common brand.
 
Our 7Kw Onan EQD,fitted to an 05 boat, came with just 135 recorded hours(mains were 700hrs). It starts well, runs quietly,churns out amps. Big improvement on the MDKD 6.5 in the previous boat. In Australia, Onan(Cummins) tends to be the most common brand.

Love australia. Sidney is great. Traveled the world and never met anyone as nice and fun to be with. Was there in the late nineties on business.
 
I love diesel gensets but they are old technology. Why not consider an EFOY? Basically a fuel cell. Much cheaper, simpler and so quiet.


https://www.efoy-pro.com

Looking at the Efoy products, I would question how much power they provide. Maybe the larger one. I also saw some complaints about availability of fuel. Not sure if that is an issue or not. Finally, I didn’t see any pricing info anywhere. Any idea how much those cost?
 
Currently have two NL gensets. 12kw is the workhorse and used extensively for AC and other power needs, it has 7800 hours and only needs the normal oil and filter changes and clean fuel. Not much more needed. The 20kw operates the hydraulic pump for the windlass and bow thruster, so mainly sees short periods of service for those needs, and occasional use for electrical requirements.. It has 2500h or so on it. Both are equipped with water separators so are pretty quiet at anchor. In the past I had a 3.5kw NextGen on a smaller boat. It was newly installed when I bought the boat due to they replaced the original one due to warped head (so I was told). This genset operates at higher rpm, 2700 or so, and unfortunately I had several issues with it. Failed oil pressure switch, it ate several RW impellers, and I had a failed RW hose that was really difficult to get to to replace (probably not the generators fault). As a result I found the generator wasn't available when I needed it as the failures occurred while I was on multi day trips with minimal access to parts and service. But for the boat I had this genset fit the space I had available. And the NextGen service was excellent, and I had easy access to a technical person to help me. For the bigger boat, the NL have basically been flawless.
 
Jeff, can I get the info from you on the NL classes? My new boat has 2 NL units and I changing fluids this weeked but would love to learn more about them and your post has me curious and intrested.
Thanks Jeff.
 
I love diesel gensets but they are old technology. Why not consider an EFOY? Basically a fuel cell. Much cheaper, simpler and so quiet.


https://www.efoy-pro.com


Let's see, why not:


A) Both methanol and hydrogen are in the same class as gasoline for explosion risk, so the unit and the fuel would have to go in a separate compartment, like propane.



B) On equal energy content, both fuels are considerably more expensive than diesel.


C) EFOY quotes 0.9L of methanol per kWh. That's 0.24 US gallons. An NL 5kW generator uses about half a gallon of diesel per hour at full capacity or 0.1 gallon per kWh. And, surprisingly, at half load the consumption is only a little more than half of full load.



D) Therefore the methanol storage will take at a minimum of 2.4 times the volume of the diesel required to produce the same power, and, unlike diesel in a tank, is in containers that occupy more space than their contents.


E) Diesel has about 2.3 times the energy content of methanol on a volume basis. (129,500 btu/gallon vs 56,800) Since the EFOY unit uses 2.4 times as much fuel, it is actually less efficient at using the contained energy than a diesel generator, so while "fuel cell" sounds green, it's not.



F) EFOY is a single source vendor for the fuel cartridges.


G) Rolling and pitching (inclination angle) are an issue.



H) We all already have diesel aboard.


Jim
 
Jeff, can I get the info from you on the NL classes? My new boat has 2 NL units and I changing fluids this weeked but would love to learn more about them and your post has me curious and intrested.
Thanks Jeff.

The training class info is on the Northern Lights website and easy to find. I don’t think they have anything scheduled now due to Covid, so you might have to wait a bit.

They do a 1-day and a 2-day class, with the difference being the longer class does some hands-on maintenance on an actual unit, while the 1-day class is talking and looking. I did the 1-day and recommend either version. I was happy with the shorter class, but the option to turn wrenches is available with the 2-day if you want it. The class is intended for NL owners, and I’m not sure if they offer it to non-owners, which probably keeps the group size down. It also makes it a perk of being a customer. The guy that teaches the class is a treasure, and knows more about NL, diesels, and boats than maybe anyone I have met.
 
They do have some on-line clips, if you search YouTube.
 
I love diesel gensets but they are old technology. Why not consider an EFOY? Basically a fuel cell. Much cheaper, simpler and so quiet.


https://www.efoy-pro.com

Ok I took a further look. If I am misstating something, or the facts in the attributed articles are incorrect or out of date, feel free to correct me.

https://www.bwsailing.com/fuel-cell-basics/

“Available through Hydrovane Intentional Marine Inc. (www.hydrovane.com, yes the same as the self-steering units) the Hydromax 150 is $3,725, a Hydrofuel Dry Refill Cartridge is $40 and an Additive Dry Refill Cartridge is $12. A full Fuel tank and a full Additive tank can last for about 24 hours of production and will produce about 300 Ah, which comes out at around 10-days at 30 Ah per day.”

This particular cell produces 14 amps per hour. The Efoy’s produce in the 5 to 8 amp range per the same article.

A 10,000 BTU AC requires around 554 amps over 8 hours per another article.

https://marine-ac.com/diy-question-marine-ac-wattage-draw-dc-inverter-power-2/

So, a fuel cell would handle about half the requirements of one AC for one evening and would cost $52. Add the at anchor requirements prior to calling it a night and it would still require a very large battery bank or two or three of these fuel cells at a minimum to run systems over night. Of course, as you add batteries the requirements are less, but as you add days at anchor in the same place it would also require solar and perhaps running the engine for a while each day and multiple fuel cell refills.

Perhaps if you are in the PNW where there are usually lower overnight temps than the Southeast it would be a good use case.

However, it seems the “hump” these fail to get over is the overnight AC requirement.
 
My Cummins Onan is fine, parts are easy and fast with local Cummins, haven't needed any other than routine maintenance
 
Re EFOY - many thanks for the research, review and responding. Living in northern Canada, it never occurred to me that people would have a bent for AC all night long. If AC is the main reason for a genset, I cannot argue. To keep the fridge running while at anchor, methyl hydrate could be a great solution.
Please note - I have no direct experience with this product. Just putting the thought out there.
 
Re EFOY - many thanks for the research, review and responding. Living in northern Canada, it never occurred to me that people would have a bent for AC all night long. If AC is the main reason for a genset, I cannot argue. To keep the fridge running while at anchor, methyl hydrate could be a great solution.
Please note - I have no direct experience with this product. Just putting the thought out there.

Hey, I am glad you brought it up. It was good to look into it. The flip side of the heat equation is that during the winter the temp gets down to the twenties routinely while occasionally down to zero. I like the idea of diesel heat as a backup to the heat pumps. It might keep me from winterizing the engine and generator for January/February. Would probably still drain the fresh water tanks and AC but it would be nice to get the boat out and run it south during those months.
 
After all my research I decided and am in the process of installing a Onan Cummins 7.5kw. The kabota engine and the large parts and service network were big factors for my decision.
 
I've got 8kW and 20kW Westerbeke. The little one's about dead, coughing up butterscotch in the exhaust, which it somehow manufactures from oil and seawater. Maybe 2000hrs, who can tell, the meter's broken. The big one runs great but has a messed up electrical system. I don't know about generators but have been able to keep these going by reading the shop manuals. I am going to replace the little one with a 14kW Phasor which'll fit in the same space and meet all my needs. Then I'll sell the big Westerbeke and rebuild the little one for "fun." I feel sorry for the little old guy.
 

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