Heading south, where's fuel?
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CPseudonym
Moderator Emeritus
Yeah you two are sooo right
Heaven forbid I'd actually suggest the op talk to someone who's "been there and done that". Whatever could I had been thinking
Edelweiss
Guru
Yeah you two are sooo right
Heaven forbid I'd actually suggest the op talk to someone who's "been there and done that". Whatever could I had been thinking
Agree. . Talking to knowledgeable skippers can be a real advantage. Hopefully he has at least two separate tanks and in an unknown boat, I would second taking a small auxiliary supply of clean fuel just in case there is a fuel issue.
Ski in NC
Technical Guru
Must know how to change filters and reprime at sea. Each engine is different in what is required. Recovering from clogged filters or an air loaded fuel system is not fun while in the rough stuff dippin' rails with crap rolling all over the place and engine room hot as blazes. But you need to know how to do it.
That is more of a concern than actually running out of fuel.
Need: Filters. Small jug of fuel. 5gal bucket. Wrenches for bleed screws and inj lines. Knowledge of how to reprime the particular engine.
A good exercise is to pop the top on the racor with engine idling dockside. Let it run til it stalls. Then reprime it.
That is more of a concern than actually running out of fuel.
Need: Filters. Small jug of fuel. 5gal bucket. Wrenches for bleed screws and inj lines. Knowledge of how to reprime the particular engine.
A good exercise is to pop the top on the racor with engine idling dockside. Let it run til it stalls. Then reprime it.
Yeah you two are sooo right
Heaven forbid I'd actually suggest the op talk to someone who's "been there and done that". Whatever could I had been thinking
We're not suggesting he not talk to the one you suggested. He should. Only suggesting he can't rely his fuel usage being the same as anyone else's.
caltexflanc
Guru
Is it doable, absolutely positively! Many much smaller boats with much less range have made the trip. But it takes away some flexibility and safety margin. For instance, if one was counting on getting into a particular harbor and they close the bar, or if you simply want to skip a harbor and perhaps do an overnight, or you have a need to crank up the speed (weather, on board illness, etc) and thus dramatically increase consumption.
sunchaser
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Yeah you two are sooo right
Heaven forbid I'd actually suggest the op talk to someone who's "been there and done that". Whatever could I had been thinking
Your suggestion to talk to Alaska Seduction was spot on. Don 't forget though many of us have sailed and cruised a mile or two on the west coast long before TF existed. The suggestion to know true fuel capacity, burn rate, general maintenance procedures etc apply to any of us going offshore. Boating 101 I would think.
CPseudonym
Moderator Emeritus
I agree with you Tom until it gets to the "never leave the dock unless you do it my way approach" that is often prevalent on forums. People have harbor hopped the west coast quite successfully and regularly for decades, patiently waiting weather and bar crossings when needed. Delivery skippers jump on unknown client boats(albeit with more powerboat experience) routinely delivering them successfully as well.
The idea of drawing down tanks to verify how much usable fuel you have makes total sense if crossing to Hawaii but makes little sense going a couple hundred miles max between safe harbors. I wonder how many delivery skippers do that prior to leaving port? Opening up the tanks and inspecting them, or better still having them cleaned on a new to you boat is wise but drawing them down to see how much fuel can be scavenged? Really? Unless I missed something in this thread it sounds like he has at least 300-400 miles of fuel unless he runs it on the pins.
Assuming the boat isn't a candidate to be turned into an artificial reef it will likely be a safe and fun trip down the coast. No different than hundreds of others every year. That and the fact the OP did mention he is a pro captain on sailboats, kinda leads me to believe he didn't just step out of the onion fields and likely has a commensurate amount of common sense and seamanship skills. Probably explains why he was interested in good fuel stops to begin with as sailors typically have no need to know that info. If he doesn't like his consumption numbers I'm quite certain he will pull in and top off at the next harbor. He may have to jog a bit before crossing the bar but it's not likely his first time doing that either if he is a pro blow boat captain.
The idea of drawing down tanks to verify how much usable fuel you have makes total sense if crossing to Hawaii but makes little sense going a couple hundred miles max between safe harbors. I wonder how many delivery skippers do that prior to leaving port? Opening up the tanks and inspecting them, or better still having them cleaned on a new to you boat is wise but drawing them down to see how much fuel can be scavenged? Really? Unless I missed something in this thread it sounds like he has at least 300-400 miles of fuel unless he runs it on the pins.
Assuming the boat isn't a candidate to be turned into an artificial reef it will likely be a safe and fun trip down the coast. No different than hundreds of others every year. That and the fact the OP did mention he is a pro captain on sailboats, kinda leads me to believe he didn't just step out of the onion fields and likely has a commensurate amount of common sense and seamanship skills. Probably explains why he was interested in good fuel stops to begin with as sailors typically have no need to know that info. If he doesn't like his consumption numbers I'm quite certain he will pull in and top off at the next harbor. He may have to jog a bit before crossing the bar but it's not likely his first time doing that either if he is a pro blow boat captain.
caltexflanc
Guru
A new to the owner boat, unfamiliar to the captain, which has not had these things checked out, yes a delivery captain will check things out before heading offshore. Heck, they do it for ICW trips for that matter. I don't know where the drawing down the tanks part comes from, but certainly a fairly aggressive draw down is needed to learn what the fuel burn really is.
I have total respect for the OP, he is asking the right questions and has the right attitude. And he understand the implications of piloting a boat that is purely reliant on fuel, no sails. I once helped a very experienced guy take a little 25' Bayliner Ciera (nice little boat) single engine gas I/O, from Sausalito to Eureka. Just because he wanted to; would have been safer and quicker cheaper to put it on its trailer and motor it up. Waited a few weeks for perfect weather, brought extra gas.. though theoretically we plenty had of range, but going uphill, he knew exactly what the boat could do and what condition it was in. Fun trip, caught a couple of nice fish while we were at it. But again the guy, an experienced pan Pacific sailor, knew the boat's condition and performance precisely.
What excuse is there for not doing so?
Scary
Guru
Lonely trip
Something I would look at if is the condition of your steering hoses and check your hydraulic steering tank. Should have 30-40 psi on gauge. I know of more than one boat that has lost steering on the trip down. Your steering gear will get a workout on this trip. Spares besides fuel filters, should include a small container of diesel for priming filters, water pump impellers, emergency tape, and several quarts of hydraulic fluid, or atf.
Something I would look at if is the condition of your steering hoses and check your hydraulic steering tank. Should have 30-40 psi on gauge. I know of more than one boat that has lost steering on the trip down. Your steering gear will get a workout on this trip. Spares besides fuel filters, should include a small container of diesel for priming filters, water pump impellers, emergency tape, and several quarts of hydraulic fluid, or atf.
caltexflanc
Guru
Been up here on the Sonoma Coast the last few days. Dream conditions, especially today, not a whitecap in sight and almost infinite visibility. Reminds me of that Bayliner trip I recounted. Sigh....
bligh
Guru
I visited Richard Rodriguez (of the bitter end blog) when he stopped here in santa cruz on a delivery. If you read his blog, it seems on most of his deliveries up or down the coast there is some sort of mechanical problem at some point during the trip. One thing that caught my eye on the boat he was delivering was a full case of fuel filters. Made sense to me.
Fuel issues are the most likely to interrupt a trip of this nature. Filters, filters, and more filters. And know what is in your tanks. If it's water or sludge or other things other than fuel it will become problematic.
So, I made it back to Alameda, and learned a bit along the way. Here's a brief run down on the experience.
As some of you might know, we bought the boat nearly a month before we had time to go up to Olympia to pick her up. This was a costly delay, since the weather between closing date and departure was about as good as it gets on the PNW coast. We arrived in Olympia on October 13th- just in time for the onset of winter.
After a busy day of little errands and stowing our stuff away, we headed out and made it to Seattle Shilshole Marina just before dark. Boat worked great with no hiccups what so ever, and the weather, though not ideal, had yet to be a factor. The next day we cruised up to Anacortes under bright blue skies. The channel that goes through La Conner was totally cool, and again the boat worked great. I even got some docking practice in La Conner where we stopped for lunch. I believe the curent was about 17 knots at the time.
Anacortes is a beautiful town and he marina is great, but he entrance was a bit of a challenge in the developing breeze. My crew was a girlfriend and her siblings who are not sailors, so line handling and boat handling skills were a challenge. We did, however, make it to the dock without killing anyone. The rain and wind set in pretty well for the next couple f days, so we just chilled out on the boat, are a lot and explored the town. We actually had just one night out in the San Juan's, which was beautiful. We took a circuitous route through and around islands and dropped anchor in Parks Bay on the west side of Orcas Island. The return trip we went wide around Orcas and came back to Anacortes in what was to prove to be the Windiest conditions allowable, with gusts up to about 26-28 knots. The wind chop was bad, but the wind was the real factor. I'm glad we saw this before we headed out. Now I know how much wind is too much.
The crew headed home in the car the next day, and a couple of sailing friends joined me for the trip south, but the wind and rain had us pinned in Anacortes for a few days, so we spent most of our time looking at weather on the computer and talking to fishermen. It was three days before we had a good window shaping up outside the straights, so we headed to Port Angeles so we could be ready when the weather broke. Eventually we settled on a late night/early morning departure from Neah Bay, and motored up there to buy fuel for the first time this trip. Much to
My surprise, the half full "250 gallon tanks" took almost 240 gallons! This meant that our range was going to be much better than originally forcast. It also meant that we were burning something like 5.2 gallons per hour.
As some of you might know, we bought the boat nearly a month before we had time to go up to Olympia to pick her up. This was a costly delay, since the weather between closing date and departure was about as good as it gets on the PNW coast. We arrived in Olympia on October 13th- just in time for the onset of winter.
After a busy day of little errands and stowing our stuff away, we headed out and made it to Seattle Shilshole Marina just before dark. Boat worked great with no hiccups what so ever, and the weather, though not ideal, had yet to be a factor. The next day we cruised up to Anacortes under bright blue skies. The channel that goes through La Conner was totally cool, and again the boat worked great. I even got some docking practice in La Conner where we stopped for lunch. I believe the curent was about 17 knots at the time.
Anacortes is a beautiful town and he marina is great, but he entrance was a bit of a challenge in the developing breeze. My crew was a girlfriend and her siblings who are not sailors, so line handling and boat handling skills were a challenge. We did, however, make it to the dock without killing anyone. The rain and wind set in pretty well for the next couple f days, so we just chilled out on the boat, are a lot and explored the town. We actually had just one night out in the San Juan's, which was beautiful. We took a circuitous route through and around islands and dropped anchor in Parks Bay on the west side of Orcas Island. The return trip we went wide around Orcas and came back to Anacortes in what was to prove to be the Windiest conditions allowable, with gusts up to about 26-28 knots. The wind chop was bad, but the wind was the real factor. I'm glad we saw this before we headed out. Now I know how much wind is too much.
The crew headed home in the car the next day, and a couple of sailing friends joined me for the trip south, but the wind and rain had us pinned in Anacortes for a few days, so we spent most of our time looking at weather on the computer and talking to fishermen. It was three days before we had a good window shaping up outside the straights, so we headed to Port Angeles so we could be ready when the weather broke. Eventually we settled on a late night/early morning departure from Neah Bay, and motored up there to buy fuel for the first time this trip. Much to
My surprise, the half full "250 gallon tanks" took almost 240 gallons! This meant that our range was going to be much better than originally forcast. It also meant that we were burning something like 5.2 gallons per hour.
Billyfeet
Senior Member
Hummmmm........so your surprise was that you took on 240 gallons of fuel into a tank that you thought was 250 Gal capacity? Or that you had a fuel gauge that indicated 1/2 full on a 250 gal. tank and took 240 gals? Oh well..... you said you made it to Alameda.
After fueling up in Neah and making some dinner and some prepared food for the next leg, we settled on a 6:00 am departure to either Greys harbor if we made good time, or Newport if we made Great time. Then we learned another lesson. We tried to sleep around 9:00 pm but nobody could sleep, so we decided we would leave early, at around midnight. The plan was supposed to get us closer to Newport, and hopefully avoid the bad weather we were anticipating at the end of this leg. Unfortunately, the swell was pounding the entrance of the Strait, and the wind was steady at about 20-22 kts. We went into it for about an hour and decided that we would do better in the light so we tucked back in at Neah, and headed out again at 7:00 am with a light grey sky. We knew this would be the worst part of the trip, but nobody really knew what to expect as far as boat performance, comfort, or even safety. Needless to say, the first 8-10 hours were pretty tense and uncomfortable. We found every leak the boat could show us, and confirmed the fact that an 8 knot cruising speed equals a 4 knot cruising speed in waves. The wind and waves eventually subsided and we had a decent trip down to Greys where we arrived about 11:00 pm with a dying ebb and swells at around 9-11 feet in the channel. Nice! I've sailed really big boats in really bad weather, but I had no idea what to expect from this fish tailing, side rolling pig in waves like this. Luckily, I had two good crew guys with me to help spot the channel and line me up on the ranges. It could have been much worse, and at least the really nasty part was over. We fueled up the next day and adjusted our range for longer trips. The next window was looking good for 72 hours, especially if we went out a bit. The next day we took off SWans went about 50 miles off shore before aiming for Creaxent City. We figured if the weather was good, we could keep going from there to Eureka or even Ft Bragg. Outside, the weather was perfect. We were listening to weather reports of small craft advisory and bar closings as we passed, but where we were was perfect light wind and smooth swell at about 9-10 seconds. Not bad at all. Did I mention the whales, dolphins, sunfish, dall porpoise, etc? Yea, we had rainbows too. No fog. Not one drop of rain.
hollywood8118
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We arrived in Olympia on October 13th- just in time for the onset of winter. ng.[/QUOTE said:
markpierce
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Was under the impression we are only half way between summer and winter. But then, mother nature doesn't respect humankind's artificial differentiations.
So to wrap it up, we ended up rolling straight through to Eureka and arrived around 4:00 am in perfect weather. My crew had to get back to Seattle, so I rented a car and drove them to Oakland where I picked up my new crew. We hauled ass back to the boat and headed out before sunset. This time there was no weather anywhere. I mean if we were saing, we would have waited. Made it to the golden gate in under 28 hours. Parked in my new slip in Alameda and eating a burrito on Int Blvd by midnight. Way to go boat.
caltexflanc
Guru
Some fine seamanship there going out to where you weren't dealing with the near-shore break, but man, I'd have been ultra-paranoid being that far out and in the dark no less, on a new-to-me boat.
Great job!
Great job!
Thanks for the props. I'm actually used to travelling much further offshore - like 100s of miles. Generally speaking, the farther from the continent you are, the less likely you are to hit it. That said, the idea of bobbing for hundreds of miles in a power boat with no motor/full of water/engulfed in flames did have me feeling a bit edgy at first.
