How do I build in a freezer?

[angus99]

We’d like to remove the old, non-working U-Line ice maker and shoehorn a small freezer into the same space on the (covered) sundeck. Whynter makes a 2.1 cu.ft model that would just fit but they don’t recommend it for an enclosed area, like a closet, much less a tiny cabinet. I was thinking of adding a pancake fan and vents to the cabinet to draw air through whenever the compressor cycles on. Would this work or should I continue searching for the perfect undercounted model?

 

[ksanders]

We’d like to remove the old, non-working U-Line ice maker and shoehorn a small freezer into the same space on the (covered) sundeck. Whynter makes a 2.1 cu.ft model that would just fit but they don’t recommend it for an enclosed area, like a closet, much less a tiny cabinet. I was thinking of adding a pancake fan and vents to the cabinet to draw air through whenever the compressor cycles on. Would this work or should I continue searching for the perfect undercounted model?

buy one and cut the hole to fit.

Several drawer types available for a space like that.

 

[angus99]

Thanks, Kevin. If only that simple. No drawer type with any useable capacity will fit this space—it’s too shallow. There’s a chance I can fit the Whynter upright I mentioned in post #1, but it’s not recommended for enclosed spaces. Looking at Isotherms, one of which might fill the bill with a little cabinet work, and which can be built in.

 

[Comodave]

I suspect they don’t recommend building it in is for ventilation. If that is indeed the reason then add a bunch of intake and exhaust vents. Then put in a couple of low draw fans to help the air move up and out of the cabinet.

 

[SteveK]

Fridges lose a lot of cool air each time they are opened. So would a front open freezer. Try to make one chest style, top opening. This summer I converted the original under seat ice box to freezer. In your picture there is a bench seat, a thought.

 

[Cigatoo]

Fridges lose a lot of cool air each time they are opened. So would a front open freezer. Try to make one chest style, top opening. This summer I converted the original under seat ice box to freezer. In your picture there is a bench seat, a thought.

Do you have pics? Be interested to hear about that project. Maybe a new thread?

 

[SteveK]

Do you have pics? Be interested to hear about that project. Maybe a new thread?

I have this top view before I added a wire shelf on floor to keep a air flow on bottom. This is a Nova Kool kit, plug and play pre-charged. The case of water was test and they all froze solid. Have tested with ice cream too, kept hard. This was during 30*C plus temps. The compressor is remote mounted.

 

[SteveK]

I have since that picture moved the control to end between the plates and added a one inch insulation wall (movable) which made the right hand end into a fridge temp space.

 

[angus99]

Fridges lose a lot of cool air each time they are opened. So would a front open freezer. Try to make one chest style, top opening. This summer I converted the original under seat ice box to freezer. In your picture there is a bench seat, a thought.

Great idea and good eye. Unfortunately, that bench seat is barely 12 inches tall. I’d start to hit the point of diminishing returns at the size I’d be confined to.

 

[Frosty]

Fridges lose a lot of cool air each time they are opened. So would a front open freezer. Try to make one chest style, top opening.

I've always wondered if this is really much, in the real world. I have used chest iceboxes and refrigerators on a sailboat, plus a modern "cooler chaped" compressor refrigerator, all of which were top loading. . Nothing against them and I'm sure they are somewhat more efficient.

But, with a boat-sized refrigerator, who has a lot of air inside them? I know on my 4.7 liter door style (first one with a side door!), the majority of the space inside is taken up with solid items (milk, yogurt, cheese, water, iced tea, whatever). I don't see those losing a ton of cold each time the door is opened (indeed, I don't really notice my temp display going up after opening and closing the door).

Maybe someone who has a large enough refrigerator that there is a ton of air space?

Last note is that I'd say my "shopping" time with the door open is cut to about 25-50% of what it was with a top-lid style. So even though it must be somewhat more cold-losing, I bet it evens out. With the door shelves and then the interior ones, I can whisk in and out of there in a flash. Even though I was pretty organized with the top loader on the sailboat, there was always more "shopping time" involved (and maybe even removing some items to access others and then putting them back).

So upshot is that although I'm sure that's correct from a pure physics perspective, once you add in the fact that most of a boat refrigerator's contents hold cold much better than empty air -- plus the fact that it's generally easier to be quick with a door style, I wonder if that "issue" really is true in real life.

OP: Isotherm has one really shallow door refrigerator, although it might be too tall. IIRC it is the Cruise 90.

 

[FF]

"Fridges lose a lot of cool air each time they are opened. So would a front open freezer."

Its the weight of air that needs to be re cooled , thats why the recommendation is to keep the boxes as full as you can.

 

[angus99]

OP: Isotherm has one really shallow door refrigerator, although it might be too tall. IIRC it is the Cruise 90.

Thanks for that. It is, unfortunately, too tall. Dometic makes one—the CRX 1080S—that is actually a reefer that coverts to a freezer and would fit nicely. The specs say it cools to +17F, which makes me wonder if that’s enough for a true deep freeze.

https://www.suremarineservice.com/CRX-1080S.html

 

[Frosty]

Dometic makes one...The specs say it cools to +17F, which makes me wonder if that’s enough for a true deep freeze.

I would say no. IMO that's just enough to make ice cubes, or perhaps keep something like frozen vegetables that you intend to use soonish vs. store for months. Ice cream would be really soft at that temp. (I find ice cream is the canary in the coal mine and needs the coldest temps - closer to zero or at least below 10º)

To me a "true" deep freeze should be able to get down to 0ºF. Or at least close. And stay that way consistently. But that's long term storing of meat, plus ice cream etc.

 

[angus99]

I would say no. IMO that's just enough to make ice cubes, or perhaps keep something like frozen vegetables that you intend to use soonish vs. store for months. Ice cream would be really soft at that temp. (I find ice cream is the canary in the coal mine and needs the coldest temps - closer to zero or at least below 10º)

To me a "true" deep freeze should be able to get down to 0ºF. Or at least close. And stay that way consistently. But that's long term storing of meat, plus ice cream etc.

Thanks! With your username, I’m taking this advice to the bank.

 

[Frosty]

Thanks! With your username, I’m taking this advice to the bank.

Ha!

Just to make sure I was clear, you can use a freezer warmer than those super low temps. My fridge has a little freezer at the top (the type with a wee plastic flap for a door), and I make good use of it. Just not in a "deep freeze" way. More of a "this week" type of freezer with some fruit and veg, and ice cubes -- and the ice cream will not be rock hard. I'm not sure what temp my "day" freezer maintains. Maybe around 12ºF if I had to guess.

(But if you are looking for what I think of as a deep freeze -- storing meat, ice cream, etc. for longer-- then I'd want the lower temps.


Just to make sure I wasn't steering you wrong, I looked up what the FDA has to say. They do also recommend a freezer be at 0ºF.

https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/are-you-storing-food-safely

Frosty

PS: Buddy has a CFX-50 (Dometic cooler style unit with their own compressor). It will go down to -8º on the thermostat and I believe it will hold 0ºF.

I have a Dometic CF-50 with the Danfoss compressor, and that only sets down to 0ºF. I'm not sure whether it will hold 0º in actuality because I've mostly used it as a fridge.

But yeah, a setting that only goes to 17ºF? Meh.

 

[BruceK]

It`s not widely known Nigel Calder published a book on marine refrigeration:
https://www.amazon.com/Refrigeration-Pleasureboats-Installation-Maintenance-Repair/dp/0071579982
I have one, useful from building a DIY set up to troubleshooting problems to understanding how heat makes cold(though it doesn`t acknowledge Frosty`s input). Australia once had a range of "Silent Knight"(it was) brand kerosene powered fridges for remote area use, it actually had a flame on a burner, but it sure froze ice cream.

 

[Frosty]

Australia once had a range of "Silent Knight"(it was) brand kerosene powered fridges for remote area use, it actually had a flame on a burner, but it sure froze ice cream.

We had those (or similar) kerosene refrigerators in the US under the Servel brand name. In many an up-north cabin back in the day.

Actually the still-quite-common absorption refrigerators that run on propane still do have a flame in the back. Refrigerator with a chimney!

Thanks for the book recommendation. I've read his Boatowners' Mechanical "bible" but not the refrigeration one.

 

[Seevee]

Just a thought.....


How about rebuilding the cabinet... or get a new one. Might allow for more freezer room.

 

[angus99]

Ha!

Just to make sure I was clear, you can use a freezer warmer than those super low temps. My fridge has a little freezer at the top (the type with a wee plastic flap for a door), and I make good use of it. Just not in a "deep freeze" way. More of a "this week" type of freezer with some fruit and veg, and ice cubes -- and the ice cream will not be rock hard. I'm not sure what temp my "day" freezer maintains. Maybe around 12ºF if I had to guess.

(But if you are looking for what I think of as a deep freeze -- storing meat, ice cream, etc. for longer-- then I'd want the lower temps.


Just to make sure I wasn't steering you wrong, I looked up what the FDA has to say. They do also recommend a freezer be at 0ºF.

https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/are-you-storing-food-safely

Frosty

PS: Buddy has a CFX-50 (Dometic cooler style unit with their own compressor). It will go down to -8º on the thermostat and I believe it will hold 0ºF.

I have a Dometic CF-50 with the Danfoss compressor, and that only sets down to 0ºF. I'm not sure whether it will hold 0º in actuality because I've mostly used it as a fridge.

But yeah, a setting that only goes to 17ºF? Meh.

Excellent advice. Thank you!

Just a thought.....


How about rebuilding the cabinet... or get a new one. Might allow for more freezer room.

I’m considering this as well. i’d enlist a friend who is a cabinet maker if I go this route. It may also be possible to put some thick framing around the opening and increase the front-to-back cavity. Thanks for the thought.