How do you manage wires in your engine room?

[bridaus]

How do you do it? Pictures especially welcome here.

My battery cables run along side the engine on top of a stringer (rail, can't recall the word) and the PO built a "box" around them complete with nails (ugh) to protect them.

Some others appear to be screwed direct to fiberglass with twist tie like holders. Doesn't that compromise the inner hull moisture-wise?

Others are just lying around. More ugh.


I'm betting some of you have come up with some really nice solutions. If I didn't mind any length of battery cable (but I do, keep em short!) I'd go out to the wall, up and into a cable tray.

If I didn't mind fishing them and not being able to see them, I'd put conduit down in the bottom of the bilge.

There has to be something elegant at and around the engine and the bilge that works. Once I get to the walls, I'm good....

Thoughts/ideas/pics, what works on your boat?

 

[Lou_tribal]

Conduit/tray/wire loom for small size wires. I like split loom as it is quite easy to add wires if needed.
For large size battery cables just U shape holder (like for pipes).

L

 

[Bacchus]

My MS 34HT uses wire trays for main runs w/ multi wires.
Wire Trays

My ER main run...

 

[bridaus]

My MS 34HT uses wire trays for main runs w/ multi wires.


My ER main run...

Looks like it's on the wall though, not on the floor? Or is that just that one picture?

BTW, that looks like Panduit, which I'm considering, just wondering if it would hold up. Mainly I'd love to be able to step and kneel on it, yet move cables around as needed (that would probably die down after I get the setup settled).

 

[Bacchus]

Looks like it's on the wall though, not on the floor? Or is that just that one picture?

BTW, that looks like Panduit, which I'm considering, just wondering if it would hold up. Mainly I'd love to be able to step and kneel on it, yet move cables around as needed (that would probably die down after I get the setup settled).

Mostly on bulkheads and side of stringers.
I don't think it would do well with standing or kneeling on it. While working on the wiring you would likely have covers off and the fingers arent sturdy ( or suitable for even kneeling on.
If you need to run in frequent step locations I think I would consider some kind of a "box" around the tray.
Home depot sells 4" & 5" quare PVC fence posts / covers that are a little more substantial yet easy to work with. You would need to protect wires if they exit at / near the pvc as cut edges may be sharp and chafe insulation but split wire loom would do that for individual / group sidevruns off the main.
For long runs Mainship built in PVC pipe runs - fore - aft on both port & stbd side. Thrusters bow & stern & windlass.

 

[Larry M]

We use a lot of split loom tubing. It also adds additional fire protection.

https://www.cabletiesandmore.com/black-wire-loom-tubing?

 

[DCDC]

Perforated drain pipe is available at hardware stores. 3” - 4”, heavy PVC or lighter corrugated versions with large, spaced holes for wires in or out. Good for larger wire bundles, coax.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. b. All somewhat valid suggestions thus far. I say "somewhat" because I suspect I share your view of messy wiring and the seeming efforts by both boat builders and DPO's to add to the mess.


While I would love to have all my electrical systems look like this:

The reality is most resemble this:
Minus the wire nuts (internet photo NOT my boat).

Pretty well any and all wiring set ups are compromised by the simple addition or removal of equipment. "Rocket Scientists" do NOT help matters at all!



I think it's safe to say that the majority of members have experienced the "joys" of redundant wire removal and the added pleasure of that ONE wire tie or wire clip in an inaccessible location that turns a one hour job into a two day ordeal.



Couple that with trying to add wire to a built in conduit or chase (IF one is so fortunate) that was barely sized to fit original factory wiring.


Apologies for my rant but I've been looking for an "elegant" solution for a long time.



Perhaps Mr. B's suggestion of PVC fence posts is most applicable for your battery cable run. As for the sharp cut edges, a quick pass with a small torch will melt them smooth.

 

[Bacchus]

RTF
Good suggestion to "flame polish" the cuts....
Sorry a glass term but it works and hadnt thought of it w PVC

 

[Mrwesson]

Like most people who didn't post here... My answer is.

Not well.

To the next owner.. i'm sorry.

 

[bridaus]

That cable ties and more site is perfect!

Still everyone's pictures are wall and hanging, which I feel very comfortable with already. I'm interested in the stepping areas.... the wires that run along the stringers/rails.

I like this product for instance: https://www.cabletiesandmore.com/drop-over-polyurethane-cord-cover

 

[bridaus]

Like most people who didn't post here... My answer is.

Not well.

To the next owner.. i'm sorry.

Made me laugh, and for that I raise a glass to you...

Apology accepted.

 

[Shrew]

I think it's safe to say that the majority of members have experienced the "joys" of redundant wire removal and the added pleasure of that ONE wire tie or wire clip in an inaccessible location that turns a one hour job into a two day ordeal.

I've been dealing with this all spring (wirenuts and all!!!). I wanted to add a chartplotter to my lower helm so I could have GPS and Radar at my lower. I found a rats nest in the lower helm very similar to what Mr. RTF has shown. I found electrical tape and wire nuts.

It took me almost 2 days to basically clean-up and re-run all the wiring runs. Everyting was in straight lines (point a to point B). One was so bad, I couldn't even open the console the entire way because a wire was too short and run in a straight line.

How hard is it to use wire ties properly??!!!! I can buy hundreds of them for 10$.

I was working under the upper helm and had a bowl of spaghetti hanging in my head and face. I did a little up there, but need to spend a weekend re-rigging everything.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Slight thread drift alert: I wish to add to Mr. S's testimonial (post #13)...So, you've cleaned up your wiring and secured, wrapped, fastened and wire tied the bundle together. Looks like my first picture I posted above-REALLY nice and neat....but wait! You've just acquired a new "widget". Do you undo all the fitments and neatly incorporate those new wires into the bundles or.....??????


To eliminate the possibility of "too short" wires, just how much slack does one leave?



Further. Does anyone know of a good solution to the razor sharp ends left when you trim wire ties?


Wiring!

 

[Bacchus]

RTF
Expanding on your flame polishing... cut off w a hot knife or elec soldering gun?

 

[bluebyu]

post 13:
Flat back cutters. (Gate cutters in Injection molding trade)
use with flat side against wire tie that remains.
(leaves square wire tie, very close to latch, not nearly as sharp)

From
https://www.mcmaster.com/7059a11
Or:
https://www.imscompany.com/product/130594

 

[Mrwesson]

Made me laugh, and for that I raise a glass to you...

Apology accepted.

One day i'll get around to "fixing" it but based on my "good enough" attitude i'm probably not the man for the job.

 

[Action]

^^^^^^ Here! Here!!
(Raises Glass)

 

[Francesco35]

Greetings,

Perfection in the world !

Mr. b. All somewhat valid suggestions thus far. I say "somewhat" because I suspect I share your view of messy wiring and the seeming efforts by both boat builders and DPO's to add to the mess.


While I would love to have all my electrical systems look like this:

 

[healhustler]

Oh, wiring? Yeah, just the other day I organized a space big enough to get my head through!

 

[eheffa]

Greetings,



Further. Does anyone know of a good solution to the razor sharp ends left when you trim wire ties?

I use these.

Hugely helpful in tidying up.

https://www.amazon.ca/Fastening-Cut...4492&s=gateway&sprefix=zip+tie,aps,214&sr=8-2

-evan

 

[exmaggiedrum]

Greetings,
Slight thread drift alert: I wish to add to Mr. S's testimonial (post #13)...So, you've cleaned up your wiring and secured, wrapped, fastened and wire tied the bundle together. Looks like my first picture I posted above-REALLY nice and neat....but wait! You've just acquired a new "widget". Do you undo all the fitments and neatly incorporate those new wires into the bundles or.....??????


To eliminate the possibility of "too short" wires, just how much slack does one leave?



Further. Does anyone know of a good solution to the razor sharp ends left when you trim wire ties?


Wiring!

I was a professional (at least I professed to be one) and the best way to keep the wire ties from ripping your skin to the bone is to get some nice small flush side cutters. I couldn't find really good ones at any hardware stores so bought some off the web. You can use the cutters to tighten up the wire tie by grabbing, twisting in to the tie over and over until tight, and then make sure the cutter is perpendicular to the tie and cut off the end. The end should be square and flush.

When getting on a customer boat and I had to work inside a busy area with bad wire tie ends I would often take a couple of minutes and just cut off as many as I could see where I was going to work. You can grab even a small end and tighten it a little more or just cut off the little sharp piece.
This is the one I use. It is heavy enough to cut the big wire ties and small enough to do the little ones too.


https://www.all-spec.com/Catalog/Hand-Power-Tools/Cutting-Tools/Flush-Cutters/2175-56800

 

[ORIF]

Pacer Group has several wire management options:https://www.pacergroup.net/products/wire-management/

The "expandable sleeving" listed at the bottom of the attached page under wire routing is one of my go to's. Works like Chinese finger traps and comes in long reels and varying diameters.

Not the best picture but the attachment shows the black expandable sleeving running with and zip tied to large cables from my battery chargers. Contains a new wire harness I made up to run from my 3208's to the helms. I moved a lot of wiring overhead to get it out of the bilge.

Expandable sleeving is easy to work with, although always reminds me of a rat snake moving through the ER

 

[hpogue123]

I like to use the metal or plastic wire chases that you can even pickup at Home Depot or Loews. They come in various sizes and colors and can be strong enough to stand on. In my trawler, I have used them to surface mount on fiberglass in areas to hard or impossible to fish lines. They come with adhesive and screw mountings. I found if I clean the surface and put spots of thickened epoxy every few inches and then use their adhesive to hold while setting it's pretty bulletproof if I don't want to use screws.

 

[Mule]

As a professional land based wire runner, sorter and organizer it is beyond me why Marine electricians so often insist in hard strapping long wire runs with tywraps? There are different plans and ideas contained in this string to not screw into the bulkheads... good, no doubt! But clinching down wires in long runs....into a harness... no no no. Leave the tyes loose so 2 or more fingers inserted loose. Leave a pull string behind, then when another wire is needed (inevitable) the attach the new wire to the string, along with a replacement string and pull it through. Thereby cutting and replacing mass numbers of wraps is unnecessary.
The final feed near the termination point is the time to bend it in pretty, organized runs and chinch it down for both beauty and security, such as RT’s pictures. Now if you are a hourly paid Marine electrician, job security is a concern then by all means use lots of plastic ties and chinch ‘em tight and by all means leave no pull string behind.

 

[exmaggiedrum]

As a professional land based wire runner, sorter and organizer it is beyond me why Marine electricians so often insist in hard strapping long wire runs with tywraps? There are different plans and ideas contained in this string to not screw into the bulkheads... good, no doubt! But clinching down wires in long runs....into a harness... no no no. Leave the tyes loose so 2 or more fingers inserted loose. Leave a pull string behind, then when another wire is needed (inevitable) the attach the new wire to the string, along with a replacement string and pull it through. Thereby cutting and replacing mass numbers of wraps is unnecessary.
The final feed near the termination point is the time to bend it in pretty, organized runs and chinch it down for both beauty and security, such as RT’s pictures. Now if you are a hourly paid Marine electrician, job security is a concern then by all means use lots of plastic ties and chinch ‘em tight and by all means leave no pull string behind.

I totally understand why you suggest loose wire ties. As an electrician running wires was always the most expensive jobs labor-wise (cost) and PITA of the job. But - you should always cinch tight wires where they terminate - at a battery, or a device. You do not want the wires to be loose so they can loosen the connection or destroy the terminals from vibration. I always would leave pull wires or string. Wires (leftover, used, whatever) are best as they are stronger and slicker. String will get caught easily at corners. Wire pulls can too but less likely.



I hated tight wire ties in hard to get places and would prefer conduit to hold the wires going through long runs in hard to get places. Cutting wire ties in easy to get locations is easy and cheap and they really make for visually nicer installations. But your suggestion works too except at terminations.


By the way, I hated those snap together gray square wire runs. They were usually hard to get off and hard to put back together and they often broke the small snap parts. If it were a choice between those and wire ties I would go with wire ties any time. But to each his own.


Also wire ties allow for adding several more wires in a run. Adding equipment later sometimes resulted in problems when the wire chase got full. They are impossible to remove and put in bigger ones and usually you can't add another to the side. I had this problem on many boats I worked on.

 

[JimW]

Not the total solution as you still have to place them normally in a location not easy to get to . . . But the “reusable wire ties” work great as you can open them to remove or place new wires.

 

[Action]

Wire ties are cheap. For situations that require wire ties, use them. When a new wire or cable is needed cut off the old tie and dispose of off vessel. Run new wire/cable and install a new wire tie. They are cheap, fast and effective. A rare combination.

 

[ben2go]

I don't like to use zip ties. In the event that something has to be pulled out it makes it a pain. Especially if stuff is added and blocks access to said zippies. I prefer conduit or wire raceway/track where possible and over size split loom.

You can get slip loom in multiple colors and sizes if you want to color code your electrical system.
https://www.amazon.com/Split-Wire-L...385d617079387063d864c80f260c60&language=en_US

The thing I like about raceways is that the wiring can be brought into or out of the track where needed. A few prongs can be snipped off cleanly with a pair of cutters if needed for larger wires
https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com...6e3ae1b787a752de7646a776408411&language=en_US

 

[audioshark]

https://www.amazon.ca/wotu-Durable-...JGD1TZGCQEN&psc=1&refRID=5YCSYQTYEJGD1TZGCQEN




The link above are the best cutters for tie wraps, you can make a perfect flush cut. I have used the majority of cutters this style is the best hands down.