Proposed boating safety law in Florida

[SteveK]

There are many of these on net, accuracy?

 

[psneeld]

Reread post #89, there are a few factors and many more that drive that chart to the next level versus "fact". One thing it does show, that for a lot of large people that exist in the US at least, a couple of drinks over a long lunch would probably not make a pleasure boat trawler captain much of a threat on the waterway.

It like many charts I have seen I believe are based solely on blood volume and percentage of alcohol in it...assuming it all goes in at a given rate (which it never does) and even then, different people can preform quite differently than all the same with the same amount of alcohol in them.

Does alcohol change a few things in a person?...sure...but everyone a bit differently...that includes many things....some of those things affect people to greatly different extents. External factors also can be additive/overwhelm the effects of alcohol and actually be overlooked because of the societal negatives in today's society about alcohol in many circles.

 

[SteveK]

Speaking for myself I have noticed that if I do not have a few drinks during the week before having several one evening then the first two will give me a tipsy feeling that goes away after a few more.
So far I have had the pleasure of blowing about 6 times and previous to that the physical acrobats and have not been cited for being above limit.
I also have a breathalyzer and have checked a few times out of curiousity when I know I was over, how accurate I dunno. But one of the guys drinking with us blew .3 we were all surprised as he was still standing. So there is nothing certain about how it affects different people, except dont blow over for the ouscepher.

 

[psneeld]

I have never in all the years posting here condoned drinking more than a few at a time, a couple with lunch, a couple with dinner. Ashore, afloat, underway, anchored...never flying an aircraft or commercial vessel operation. Alcohol to me, after being denied it for many days, hours, months, reasons on and off for decades...is really just something to make my meals taste better. I look at people who drink diet soft drinks and chuckle. Who really knows which is worse in the long run?

At my weight category according to that last posted chart wouldn't make me much of a threat, especially if you factor in a bunch of other things.

So don't consume if you don't feel like it, but lecturing me at having a few here and there and being a threat is always going to get me on a step. Seen too much of the world from an elbows deep operator position to think "conceptual standards" apply very much.

 

[Hyperion]

Car Drivers are no more safe with licenses than without.
In Florida about 1/3 of drivers on the road have no license. Even though it is the law.
Creating this law will have no discernible effect on boating accidents because the same people doing the stupid things today without a license will do it tomorrow with or without one. The net effect of this will simply be more bureaucracy and more hoops to jump for those of us already taking the time to learn to do things properly. What is it you think the fine for not having a safety certificate be if they pass it? $50? $100? Do you know now many marine patrol boats the Citi of Miami has for all the waters in it's jurisdiction?

Two (2)

This entire operation is a giant waste of time and money.

 

[markpierce]

a drink is a drink, or is it?

Coors light has 1.4% alcohol. That is nearly alcohol-free. Most beers are 4% and up to 10% alcohol.

 

[psneeld]

a drink is a drink, or is it?

Coors light has 1.4% alcohol. That is nearly alcohol-free. Most beers are 4% and up to 10% alcohol.

Often left out by the charts too.... a shot of Vodka is 40 proof, a shot of spiced rum can be over 90 Proof. So how many drinks is a shot of one or the other?

Have to read the fine print if any comes with them.

 

[PhilPB]

a drink is a drink, or is it?

Coors light has 1.4% alcohol. That is nearly alcohol-free. Most beers are 4% and up to 10% alcohol.

Coors light is 4.2% abv

 

[rslifkin]

Car Drivers are no more safe with licenses than without.
In Florida about 1/3 of drivers on the road have no license. Even though it is the law.
Creating this law will have no discernible effect on boating accidents because the same people doing the stupid things today without a license will do it tomorrow with or without one. The net effect of this will simply be more bureaucracy and more hoops to jump for those of us already taking the time to learn to do things properly. What is it you think the fine for not having a safety certificate be if they pass it? $50? $100? Do you know now many marine patrol boats the Citi of Miami has for all the waters in it's jurisdiction?

Two (2)

This entire operation is a giant waste of time and money.

That first point about car drivers is why I push for effective courses for things like this. I'm generally of the opinion that the amount (and scope) of training required to get a driver's license is inadequate. Same goes for most of the boating license courses. They spend so much time on things like how to use a launch ramp for your trailered boat that they end up only covering the very basics of COLREGS and skipping over plenty of other things boaters should learn.



None of that is a reason not to have a licensing requirement. But if you're going to do it, do it well enough that it has some positive effect.

 

[Hippocampus]

Might want to read my posts. At no time did I or anyone else lecture you about what you should do.
I run a dry boat when underway. I’m not the parent nor a cop of the people on my boat. I have no interest in assuming those roles. I have no desire to be vigilant about how much others are drinking nor need to confront them and shut them off. I don’t care what machinations about body size, rate of imbibing, metabolic differences etc. you make if the boat is dry while underway this whole thing is a non issue. I’m no puritan and have often hosted great parties on my boats when we are still. Similarly the wife likes her Prosecco and I my single malt as we watch the sun set. But I know I like to be on my game and sh-t happens. I know having alcohol on board isn’t necessary for me to enjoy my transits. I know how it affects me (and every other human being) varies ( sleep prior night, preexisting stressors, state of health, food intake etc.). I know it doesn’t increase my performance and well may decrease it. So see vey little upside to alcohol while underway so don’t. You want to BS yourself and say the science doesn’t apply to me and justify a real wet boat have a good time. No question if you’re reasonable risk is marginal . But ts another thing on the list. I like a very short list.

 

[psneeld]

Don't like to lecture but suggesting a well informed person is BSing themselves?

No wonder the constant disagreement.

That's why I post and if disagreeing... it's to keep the balance of opinions.

Not like I don't have some pretty good experience on both ends....especially operating and picking up the pieces of other operators.

 

[PhilPB]

Regardless of the route used to become under the influence using any substance, it's not good for yourself or others. Bottom line for me, is if you, or they, are operating a watercraft or vehicle of any type you shouldn't be under the influence of anything. I've met many people over the years that in my opinion were impaired even to a small degree but they would argue that they weren't at all.

 

[slowgoesit]

Please keep on topic!

Can we please get back to "Proposed Boating Safety Law Florida?"
If some of you wish to start a thread regarding "Alcohol and Boating", I'd be happy to set it up and move all the posts relating to it over to that new thread.

 

[Hippocampus]

Regardless of the route used to become under the influence using any substance, it's not good for yourself or others. Bottom line for me, is if you, or they, are operating a watercraft or vehicle of any type you shouldn't be under the influence of anything. I've met many people over the years that in my opinion were impaired even to a small degree but they would argue that they weren't at all.

All I’m saying. Spot on.

Not demeaning the knowledge or experience of others.

 

[dannc]

There are many of these on net, accuracy?
View attachment 142375

Yes, I have seen charts like this for years.

Notice how weight and gender affects the BAC as well as how much has been consumed and the time frame.

Later,
Dan

 

[alormaria]

I'm fur'em.

 

[PhilPB]

Getting back to the FL Boater Safety Bill

The proposed Florida bill is weak in my opinion and doubt it will add much value. My take on it is you get a lifetime Safety ID symbol on your FL driver's license or state ID card. Only requires someone to have boat insurance if convicted of BUI, no required insurance for anyone else. To me it appears to be written by a non boater.

For one thing I would have proposed that all vessels require insurance. I also understand that it would not be possible to enforce either legally or realistically

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2024/30/?Tab=BillText

 

[psneeld]

One reason that may have been mentioned but I forgot is that other states require carrying a card so if you ever are the operator of a boat/PWC out of state, it may come in handy.

No matter what, best to make sure the course is NASBLA approved and the test taken in person (versus on line) so it is universally accepted.

 

[Cold Duck]

Like most of you I am against more regulation but for more education. After seeing a guy with a new $500,000 go fast come into a crowded anchorage over July 4th, walk to the bow, drop a small anchor until it hits the 20ft bottom, he secures it and proceeds to the cockpit to party. Most of us have been around enuff, but newbies need to be exposed to the simple things and an educational course, as simple as it may seem to most of us, is needed. Even we were not born knowing about scope LOL! BTW, anyone know if my Hawaii card approved by NASBLA and recoginzed by USCG is valid in Fl or Ca or Tx or???

 

[psneeld]

Like most of you I am against more regulation but for more education. After seeing a guy with a new $500,000 go fast come into a crowded anchorage over July 4th, walk to the bow, drop a small anchor until it hits the 20ft bottom, he secures it and proceeds to the cockpit to party. Most of us have been around enuff, but newbies need to be exposed to the simple things and an educational course, as simple as it may seem to most of us, is needed. Even we were not born knowing about scope LOL! BTW, anyone know if my Hawaii card approved by NASBLA and recoginzed by USCG is valid in Fl or Ca or Tx or???

I think the course is NASBLA approved... it's up to the state you are boating in to list all the requirements of the course and other matters.

If a transient boater, you are generally good with any other states requirements much like an out of state driver's license.

As far as the USCG, these are state requirements and the USCG will probably never ask you to produce one.... state officers will/might.

 

[Cold Duck]

Like most of you I am against more regulation but for more education. After seeing a guy with a new $500,000 go fast come into a crowded anchorage over July 4th, walk to the bow, drop a small anchor until it hits the 20ft bottom, he secures it and proceeds to the cockpit to party. Most of us have been around enuff, but newbies need to be exposed to the simple things and an educational course, as simple as it may seem to most of us, is needed. Even we were not born knowing about scope LOL! BTW, anyone know if my Hawaii card approved by NASBLA and recoginzed by USCG is valid in Fl or Ca or Tx or???

Just did some checking and looks like all states accept Hawaii or other state cards if NASBLA approved (exception in La for PWCs). I might get an issue since live 1/2 time Hawaii, 1/2 time Ca. have card from Hawaii but resident of California. But the courses are basically the same so we will see. But as an "old Guy", won't need a card in California until 2025. Always learning something new. Long time ogo for the course but sure I learned something I didn't know

 

[Seevee]

The US Military came out in the late 1990s and reported (not sure if externally) that alcohol and accidents was a badly skewed argument and to fix the problem, stop arguing something that even prohibition couldn't stop.

They showed where the majority of alcohol related incidents were really due to fatigue because the hour of the incident.

Loosely said, if the same situation happened at 2pm in the afternoon, compared to 2am in the morning, there was a much higher probability that the incident would have not happened.

Anectdotal stories are usually half BS in my "trained" opinion.

I am so sick and tired of the anti-alcohol bandwagon based on outright lies that I can't stand it.

Sure there is an issue with some people and their alcohol habits...and there are still a bunch that are a lot more reasonable and safe.

Out..........

I feel the same way... drinking has been beat to death with primarily false info.



Statistically, alcohol consumption is fifth down the list for primary causes of boating accidents (according to the 2018 homeland security annual statistics report): Behind inattention, improper lookout, operator experience, and excessive speed.


I have no issue is one has a drink or two before boating, but the problem is a lot of folks don't know when to stop. One should know his limits.... experience, paying attention and drinking. all important.


As for the license, I'm against, but would sure like to see some training requirement. Lots of idiots out there and the reason I usually avoid Sat and Sun boating.

 

[Delta Riverat]

Yeah, me too -

Been on the Delta for 25 years now and I know for sure that in the summertime you will have hordes of beer drinking, loud obnoxious people tearing around blind intersections, loud ski boats tearing up your trolling lures and best ever "panic at the ramp".

What's taking you so long, hurry up the line is long, you're supposed to release the transom lines before the ramp, why don't you practice backing a trailer somewhere else, you want me to help you with that?

Yeah. I keep my boats in a slip and watch the show...

Now happily retired and enjoying boating while the crazies are working -