Sad Day for Northern B.C.

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If I were the king, I would ban all fishing for all species in the inland sea from Puget Sound to Port Hardy for a minimum of 10 years. We over-fish all species and need to let them all recover.

I've often wondered about this. Salmon are in short supply yet we can fish for them almost without limit. (Now, before the fishermen jump on me about the daily bag limits, I understand that. But those are daily bag limits.

I can't go into a restaurant and buy a fileted breast of spotted owl, why can I order a fish filet?
 
Ridiculous arguments based on conjecture and (shudder) opinion. There are far too few wild salmon left to feed the people that want them. Farmed fish feed the market and are an excellent source of protein. Another advantage is shelf life, wild fish have more enzymes in them and deteriorate faster than farmed, which have about double the shelf life.

If I were the king, I would ban all fishing for all species in the inland sea from Puget Sound to Port Hardy for a minimum of 10 years. We over-fish all species and need to let them all recover.

Some fish farms have been bad but that is largely lack of oversight by our useless government; I have heard there is one conservation officer for the entire Sunshine Coast.

I've often wondered about this. Salmon are in short supply yet we can fish for them almost without limit. (Now, before the fishermen jump on me about the daily bag limits, I understand that. But those are daily bag limits.............

In the late 70's, early 80's I sport fished with literally hundreds of other boats around east point, Saturna. That was when the daily limit was 8 per person. At the same time the commercial fleet worked overtime as there were that many fish to be had. That sounds like overfishing, however!

Fishing went from abundant to nothing the next year of the day Mt. St. Helens blew. Fish stopped coming past east point or there were so few, No one knew what happened until tagged fish were caught migrating from the north end of Van Isle back to the Fraser. This trend continued until great fishing at Campbell river also declined.
The expected returns were no longer happening. The fish counters predictions based on fry leaving the spawning grounds were no longer anywhere near accurate.
Commercial fishing had more closure than open times, so people lost their boats and livelihood. Still it was not from overfishing on the inland waters.
I think it was 88 I went offshore 300 NM off Oregon (just because) to find an underwater mountain at 90 feet, as the target (can we do it was the challenge).

Well, we found it all right. At first there was a glow in the dark night sky, then as the horizon was within 3-5 NM it was like sailing into Vancouver harbour, the lights of the city. Soon (approx midnight) we were surround by lighted ships as we found our mark and 180 the hell out of there.
They were commercial freighters processing the catch of what seemed like hundreds of boats. This is but one such spot in the ocean. No one knows/knew where the salmon went for 3-5 years.

Overfishing is occurring offshore, most likely by foreign ships, beyond any regulations.
Another reason there remains a shortage is that fish hatcheries were not, maybe still are not running operations 24/7/365 to add to the normal process.

P.S. Cross thread points, we did not have radar or auto pilot.
 
Two good books on fish and our food supply. FOUR FISH, and FAST FOOD NATION
Our issue is feeding 7 billion people on the planet. I used to be a salmon snob until I read FOUR FISH. There are not enough wild salmon to satisfy thee appetite for salmon. Over fishing is probably more of a problem than fish farms. I am not a fan of fish farms but I do realize that many people are not able to hunt and fish to gather their own food. We need factory dairies, feed lots, large efficient crop farming and mass produced chicken. We still need to better regulate the fish farms for pollution of water and wild stock.
 
What is the total of farmed fish that make it to market versus wild caught, does that info readily exist?

My main issue with any farmed fish product is the man made impact on the fish food supply chain that would not exist without this extraneous business - the pressure and collection of forage fish/meal is a bigger concern when looking at the potential collapse of multiple fish species impacted by the grow out process and am truly not a fan of feeding fish by products of the beef/pork/chicken industry.
 
Did you see the interview where they promised to either catch them all or kill them?
Good luck with that.
 
Such misinformation and claptrap, nearly as much as the impeachment... do the work, find out the truth instead of parroting all the bumper-sticker wisdom; the fish have no hormones nor antibiotics because their use would make the fish uneconomic. There is some concern with sea lice so that might be an issue. The reason the wild salmon are in decline is not fish farms or pinnipeds or “Crazy-rich Asian Housewives” vacuuming the beaches, its the herring fishery where all that salmon food is killed for the 20-ish percent of them that have roe which is sold to Japan and the leftovers go to the rendering plant.

If a fish has been fed pellets all its life, how successful do you think it will be as a top predator? Most will starve or will have zero skills in avoiding other predators.
 
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Such misinformation and claptrap, nearly as much as the impeachment... do the work, find out the truth instead of parroting all the bumper-sticker wisdom; the fish have no hormones nor antibiotics because their use would make the fish uneconomic. There is some concern with sea lice so that might be an issue. The reason the wild salmon are in decline is not fish farms or pinnipeds or “Crazy-rich Asian Housewives” vacuuming the beaches, its the herring fishery where all that salmon food is killed for the 20-ish percent of them that have roe which is sold to Japan and the leftovers go to the rendering plant.

If a fish has been fed pellets all its life, how successful do you think it will be as a top predator? Most will starve or will have zero skills in avoiding other predators.
Remember when there was suitcases of money for the cash buying of herring? Then kelp harvesting was allowed for a while until they realized small fish lost habitat. Yes the food chain is interrupted.
But last summer I have observed some revival I had not seen for a while, small herring balls, few but they were there.
 
The herring comes back quite quickly but the stocks are then raped and pillaged in the spring. Remember this is all managed by the same bozos who destroyed the East coast cod fishery and the west coast halibut fishery, wild salmon stocks, orca decline... Bureaucratic fzckwits.

If you like to eat salmon, in 20 years there won’t be a wild salmon on the coast and the only fish you could afford to buy is going to be farmed.

Trout, sturgeon, steelhead, atlantic is all farmed. Tilapia, shrimp and those poop-fed tiger prawns. Oysters, mussels etc. are all farmed. There are a lot of people trying to figure out how to farm halibut. The irony is that many will eat Asian tiger prawns, go to all you can eat or asian buffets but won’t eat farmed salmon?

David Suzuki is an hypocritical windbag, same as that idiot that “invented the internet.”
 
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I'm completely with you on the herring fishery. Get rid of it completely. It is unnecessary and will only affect a few.
 
If a fish has been fed pellets all its life, how successful do you think it will be as a top predator? Most will starve or will have zero skills in avoiding other predators.

I would have to take issue with this. I caught a King Salmon in Khutze Inlet. (The reason this thread was started) It was chipped and when Canada Fish and Game downloaded the chip it was discovered that it was a hatchery in Desolation Sound. This fish was big and headed to the the Khutze River with other Salmon. Most hatchery fish do not starve they thrive and help feed the world.

In Alaska fish farms are illegal for the same reason of danger to the wild/hatchery fish. Keep the Atlantic Salmon in the Atlantic. They are not welcome on the Pacific Coast.
 
That’s apples and oranges. That fish you caught was released as a smolt and had to grow up learning to feed itself and avoid predators. A huge amount of them died on the way to maturity. A fish farm fish is fully mature and has only ever had to learn how to eat kibble.

No comparison. I hope you purchase a fishing license annually, that tiny bit of cheap paper that allows you to go north and harvest fish in our waters whenever you feel like it. Maybe if the wild fish were not taken by sportsfishers for fun there would be a lot more of them around and farmed fish would not be necessary?
 
ASD, I am with you on fish farms. I think they should be eliminated or moved to "dry land" to remove the possibility of affecting wild stock or escape. I, personally don't like the farm fish. It doesn't look right, taste right, and has been proven not to have the same levels of nutrients which is one of the big reasons for eating fish!
Xsbank,
While there is certainly some logic to your argument about "kibble fed" fish having a disadvantage in the wild, I do not like the idea of any "invasive species" getting loose in our area, and this "disadvantage" has not (to the best of my knowledge) been "studied".

Also, I (personally) don't like your inference about our American friends / visitors. If we need to change our fishing rules/fees or provide better enforcement, then that is what we should do, not take "cheap shots" at all Americans. I am also sure you know that it is only a very small percentage of the salmon stock that are taken by sportfishers compared to commercial.

I agree with everyone who feels that it is "past time" that something needs to be done to try to save our wild salmon, including banning the herring catch (and penned fish farms), drastically limiting commercial limits, and temporarily reducing sportfishing, coupled with careful scientific study of the actual changes to fish stocks to guide future decisions.
 
Also, I (personally) don't like your inference about our American friends / visitors. If we need to change our fishing rules/fees or provide better enforcement, then that is what we should do, not take "cheap shots" at all Americans. I am also sure you know that it is only a very small percentage of the salmon stock that are taken by sportfishers compared to commercial.


Thank you! Your sentiments are very much appreciated. I don't fish (I know, heretic right?) but we've always felt welcomed in Canada.
 
Hmm... How about an on-the-water protest in front of the DFO Biological Science Center at Departure Bay?
 
Hmm... How about an on-the-water protest in front of the DFO Biological Science Center at Departure Bay?
Here, I can make it there. say when, who else?
DFO1.jpg
 
Oh, this could be fun, a maritime populist revolt... And my ex- works there (in Admin).

Peak summer tourist season...

Hmm, another idea, if a number of people got together with an objective. If these corporations are dumping pathogens into our waters they could be sued.
 
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I hope you purchase a fishing license annually, that tiny bit of cheap paper that allows you to go north and harvest fish in our waters whenever you feel like it. Maybe if the wild fish were not taken by sportsfishers for fun there would be a lot more of them around and farmed fish would not be necessary?

ASD, I am with you on fish farms. I think they should be eliminated or moved to "dry land" to remove the possibility of affecting wild stock or escape. I, personally don't like the farm fish. It doesn't look right, taste right, and has been proven not to have the same levels of nutrients which is one of the big reasons for eating fish!
Xsbank,
While there is certainly some logic to your argument about "kibble fed" fish having a disadvantage in the wild, I do not like the idea of any "invasive species" getting loose in our area, and this "disadvantage" has not (to the best of my knowledge) been "studied".

Also, I (personally) don't like your inference about our American friends / visitors. If we need to change our fishing rules/fees or provide better enforcement, then that is what we should do, not take "cheap shots" at all Americans. I am also sure you know that it is only a very small percentage of the salmon stock that are taken by sportfishers compared to commercial.

I agree with everyone who feels that it is "past time" that something needs to be done to try to save our wild salmon, including banning the herring catch (and penned fish farms), drastically limiting commercial limits, and temporarily reducing sportfishing, coupled with careful scientific study of the actual changes to fish stocks to guide future decisions.

Thank you! Your sentiments are very much appreciated. I don't fish (I know, heretic right?) but we've always felt welcomed in Canada.

Interesting that a Desolation Sound fish ended up in Khutze. Did the DFO guy say anything about other salmon returning to rivers they didn't come from?

Xsbank, my wife and I always purchase Canadian fishing license. We believe in supporting the fishery. I also, as stated, support the research that is being done as a result of the chips. Not sure why you would be against visitors to BC?

EngNate I wished I would have asked that question. Interesting that a hatchery fish would be following wild stock to spawn.
 
Fish are considered free game and the fishermen I know stuff their freezers and give it away while continuing to fish to exhaustion. Wild salmon should be left alone. If I were the king I would ban ALL fishing for every species from Puget Sound to Port Hardy for a minimum of 10 years. Take one oyster off a beach and be vilified and fined. Then if the ecosystem doesn’t come back in 10 (I’m sure it will) I’d extend it another 10. Ling cod, all rockfish, crabs, prawns and oysters are all very scarce here compared to my youth. Farms have nothing to do with it.

It was only 60 years ago that we were killing whales for body parts or for fun and they are now coming back beautifully, just to find a barren inland sea.

Sorry if some of you sensitive souls were offended but I think criticising Canada, which makes it very easy for Americans to transit, vacation or even leave your boats here with our blessing; no import taxes, a cheap dollar and cheaper moorage; to easily buy a license (or not) and fish all our waters, is rude. Who said Americans are not welcome? Fly a courtesy flag and follow the rules like (most) Canadians do in the US (like we did the last two weeks of October) and there should never be any friction.

Protesting and mouthing off and using violent tactics to silence critics is a useless tactic and pointless without any attempt to fix the underlying problem. THAT is where the friction arises.

Pigs
Cattle
Chickens
Horses
Dogs
Turkeys
Steelhead
Other trout
Mink
Oysters
Mussels
Prawns
Sturgeon
Salmon
Etc.

How else are we going to feed 8 billion people?
 
I am on the Central Coast every summer for the last 10 years. There hasn't been any commercial salmon fishing other than Chum for some years now. In certain openings they are allowed to keep and sell other species that are incidental catch, but there's been none of those lately, and the Chum fishery last year was a complete bust, two one-day openings the whole season and those were dismal. So, the commercial fishery on the Central Coast hasn't been impacting the main sport species to any great degree in recent years. What I think is though is the sport lodge industry, which I think ought to be regulated as a commercial fishery and put on a quota system.
 
Hello Alaskan, we cross-posted. Of course you are welcome! Canadians and Americans (except when you lost the war of 1812 to us!) have mostly always been friends and allies and we’re all better for it. I even wrote to the White House (nice site by the way) and wished Mr. Trump and family a Merry Christmas.

We are very bad at managing our own resources, in Canada that is; as the economists say, “the tragedy of the commons” and getting millions for one tuna is largely why we will eventually wipe out the sea.

The fact we are 8 billion and only survive by mutually-assured destruction means that those of us who cling to this rock need to eat so unless there is some sort of farming we are all doomed like a Taiwanese or Chinese beach.
 
Pigs
Cattle
Chickens
Horses
Dogs
Turkeys
Steelhead
Other trout
Mink
Oysters
Mussels
Prawns
Sturgeon
Salmon
Etc.

How else are we going to feed 8 billion people?

I believe there is only one on this list where the waste is not dealt with in any way. Salmon farming is not an economically feasible venture unless one is allowed to simply let all the waste fall through the net and accumulate on the bottom and in the environment.
"Let them eat Tilapia!"

https://vimeo.com/265944332
 
I can’t read that - do you really think one salmon farm is going to screw up a whole lot of ocean?
 
Greetings,
Mr. X. At the risk of having this thread closed I can only respond with the comment that the worldwide, general disregard for the environment is the problem and salmon farming is simply one of the many issues that governments, industries and societies are not ever going to deal with until it's too late IF that point hasn't already been reached.



This has been discussed in numerous other threads under various guises so I won't be flogging THAT dead horse. Talk is cheap but relocating salmon farms ashore is not economically viable and no-one is going to "do the right thing" for less profit. As always, follow the $$.


Just curious, do you have any mink recipes? Does it taste like spotted owl or manatee?


200.webp
 
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I don’t care for it myself, the fur gets caught in my teeth.

HAPPY NEW YEAR you lot.
 
There are two problems I see, 8 billion of us all scratching and clawing for “my share” and the fact that the only reason we haven’t killed everyone else on the planet is that they have the same weapons. Humans are nasty to the planet and nasty to each other. That isn’t a very good foundation for solving world problems.

Who will get the last piece of sushi from the last tuna?
 
my 2 bits. The government should never have opened the door to farming Atlantic salmon. By all means farm salmon, Pacific salmon so that they are compatible with and enhance local species. I am afraid that the loss of the salmon fishery is because of the mismanaged fish stocks, over fishing of herring a natural food. If DFO does not know what happened then they should all be replaced with those that can properly assess the problem. As I have said before I maintain that we send salmon into the wild blue yonder via natural spawning and hatcheries only to have them bulk caught offshore. There should have been red flags over the last dozen years when counts were well below expectations.
It is ot all the fault of penned atlantic salmon BTW, they just add to the problem. Seals, sea lions are cute, but they eat salmon don't they.
are they good for anything else but whale watchers to see because there are few whales anymore too. OH our resident whales also eat salmon, they moved on to where feeding is better, or died of hunger.
 
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