vessel security

[scarletbison]

I gave the head dock guy a 5th of burbon, and took him out shrimping.
He can see my boat from the harbor office.
Also you have to leave my harbor via a tunnel that only opens on the hour. plus we have a strong police department in town.
Cruise ships dock here so tax money pays for a over the top cop shop.
SD

SD,

I've never heard of that, about tunnels. Why is it only open on the hour, what happens the rest of the time? Admittedly, My tunnel experience is mostly limited to the Lincoln and Holland, going from NJ to New York City, as well as the Harbor Tunnels in Baltimore and the Chesapeake Bay Bridge Tunnel at the mouth of the Chesapeake Bay.

ScarletBison

Trawler Dreamer

 

[Art]

Yes, I think you would have a hard time claiming something was stolen when you made no effort to secure it.

Insurance Companies’ policies “theft clause” cover property theft; not how good your door lock is or is not, nor if you lock or even close your door – or not (unless there is a “secured-property” clause in the fine print).

Legal property ownership is your right and theft of your property is theft – period... pretty much no matter how the property theft is accomplished... as long as you didn’t do something like leave your diamond ring sitting atop a fire hydrant for days on end to let passers bye marvel at it! LOL :lol:

So, it goes to stand... As a thief enters or reaches into your container that is locked, not locked, or even wide open (home, garage, car, dock-box, boat, motor home...), and steals some of your property the thief can then be arrested for stealing and your property returned to you with legal prosecution against the thief (if apprehended). Therefore, if your insurance policy has a theft clause and you innocently left your owned property (let’s use a nearly brand new 20 HP Johnson outboard motor for example – this happened to me!) on the dock, on the transom of your runabout, in the bed of your truck, or maybe on your front yard with no lock device attached and a thief steels it then your insurance company will (should – and did for my 20 hp Johnson) pay for it as long as it was covered on the policy. With the ins $$$ for the stolen new-Johnson I purchased a real nice gently used 40 hp Johnson and had some $$$ to spare!

Therefore... if a thief enters your boat, by breaking the window or otherwise inappropriately gaining access by opening a door (or even walking into a door left open while you went to get something) and said thief steals property covered on your policy then the insurance company is obligated to cover your loss of property (unless otherwise stated in the policy fine print).

In a locked gate marina dock with a flashing light night time security truck, on our boat we keep all entries locked except the main entry slider door which we keep tightly closed and “looking” like it is “probably” locked, as well as having the guard rail firmly strap-secured in front of it. If a theft is attempted, we hope the thief will try to slide it first before smashing the window or using pry bar to jimmy the door open. This should save us repair hassle and the insurance company repair money... because, if a thief wants to get in – They surely will one way or another!

We also keep all windows obscured with blinds so no enticing items are visible from outside.

 

[skipperdude]

SD,

I've never heard of that, about tunnels. Why is it only open on the hour, what happens the rest of the time? Admittedly, My tunnel experience is mostly limited to the Lincoln and Holland, going from NJ to New York City, as well as the Harbor Tunnels in Baltimore and the Chesapeake Bay Bridge Tunnel at the mouth of the Chesapeake Bay.

ScarletBison

Trawler Dreamer

The tunnel to Whittier is a tunnel used by the Alaska Railroad and the public. It is one way. You have to drive on the train tracks. It is open for 15 min on the 1/2 hour going into Whittier and open 15 min on the hour going out of Whittier.

It is a toll road but you only have to pay going in as there is no other way out of whittier.
So you are kind of trapped once you get there.

You can leave by boat but not many people have a boat big enough to take your car. Just the State ferry.
It is pretty unique. It is the only community in the country with only one way in and out.
You can't get here from there.

SD

 

[koliver]

different strokes for different folks:

On my brother's float, he locks everything, all the time. When I tie up there, I lock nothing, ever.

We get the same result.

 

[Phil Fill]

I have high deductable so there is not reason for an insurance claim, and I prefer to buy used rather than newas I ma cheap.

Another determent is our windows are dark and 6 ft off the dock so people can not look/see in, stern and pilot house a canvas enclosed, we always leave lights music/tv on so it looks like someone is on the boat and/or going to be back soon. OK the real reason I ma afraid of the dark, so at least when I come home its not so scarey.

The docks we been moored at are locked, have security guards, other live aboard and most marina personal know the Eagle and me. The Eagle is one of a kind so when we do leave the dock people notice, and when people meet me they usually do not forget. So the best is to get to know the marina personal, other boaters, and ask other boaters to keep an eye on your boat. If we do leave for long periods of time we let the other live a boards and marina security know. In 16 years we have had nothing stolen taken, knock on wook.


Now went we start crusing that probable will change?

 

[FF]

Use stickey note on the door.

Honey , we were broken into I'm up talking to the cops in the parking lot.

Sam, that damn big snake got out again , I'm going home till its back in the cage!

Or simply have a sign created

SILENT KILL Guard dogs for sale.

Of course our carib bum boys technique could be used in a dock , of you have enough SS or handrails.

A 12V - 20 mile cattle fence shocking unit.

FF

 

[rwidman]

Regardless of the comments made by the insurance experts here, I believe it's irresponsible at best, to fail to take reasonable steps to protect your property and then expect an insurance company to replace that property when it is stolen. This is what causes rates to rise.

By "reasonable efforts" I mean locking the doors and windows and keeping valuables out of sight. You don't need a full time guard dog, booby traps, etc.

Locking your stuff won't make it safe from professional thieves, but it will deter the casual thief who will look for an easier target.

 

[timjet]

Locking your stuff won't make it safe from professional thieves, but it will deter the casual thief who will look for an easier target.

That certainly is true and probably the best approach. But a case can be made for the damage a thief could make breaking into a boat. In my case if they broke the companion way plexiglass sliding door, nothing they could steal would come close in value to the cost of replacing that door.

 

[rwidman]

That certainly is true and probably the best approach. But a case can be made for the damage a thief could make breaking into a boat. In my case if they broke the companion way plexiglass sliding door, nothing they could steal would come close in value to the cost of replacing that door.

That's what insurance is for.

 

[Art]

Regardless of the comments made by the insurance experts here, I believe it's irresponsible at best, to fail to take reasonable steps to protect your property and then expect an insurance company to replace that property when it is stolen. This is what causes rates to rise.

By "reasonable efforts" I mean locking the doors and windows and keeping valuables out of sight. You don't need a full time guard dog, booby traps, etc.

Locking your stuff won't make it safe from professional thieves, but it will deter the casual thief who will look for an easier target.

“Casual” Thieves do not inappropriately board boats! There is nothing casual about a thief that boards your boat with intent to steal your goods. They are “Determined” Thieves... plain and simple... fully ready and equipped to create havoc on your property (like break a window, kick open a hatch, or pry open a door) to gain access. "Determined" Thieves usually have plenty of experience for mechanically enabling their breaking and entering. And, it they're newly Determined... they quickly figure a way to break in if your door is locked.

It’s law breaking thieves that raise insurance rates, not innocent law abiding boat owners who are trying to limit material damage done to their boat – By “Determined” Thieves!

Some cultures cut a thief’s hand off... now I believe that would soon reduce the number of repeat “Determined” Thieves in the U.S... and therefore lower insurance rates... in relatively short order!

 

[Art]

That certainly is true and probably the best approach. But a case can be made for the damage a thief could make breaking into a boat. In my case if they broke the companion way plexiglass sliding door, nothing they could steal would come close in value to the cost of replacing that door.

That's what insurance is for.

Therefore, insurance rates go up even higher in general due to "Determined" Thieves creating $1K +/- damage to boat’s locked entry door... in addition to the value of whatever they steel... in addition to cost for malicious damage they may do just for the F of it while aboard steeling! Lying, Theiven, Bstds!! Off With Their Heads... err hands!! Only kidding, sort of, I’m actual a pretty compassionate guy and feel that thieves should be psychologically evaluated, then placed in taxpayer paid homes and nursed until they realize the wrong in their ways – Yeah right - - > just like I think mass murders should be placated and cared for too... for the rest of their natural lives.

Ya know, always been a rule in my family, if the dog has bone bad – humanely put it to rest before it goes badder (large caliber bullet to head is instant and painless). Once bitten twice shy; first time shame on you, second time shame on me!

 

[psneeld]

Therefore, insurance rates go up even higher in general due to "Determined" Thieves creating $1K +/- damage to boat’s locked entry door... in addition to the value of whatever they steel... in addition to cost for malicious damage they may do just for the F of it while aboard steeling! Lying, Theiven, Bstds!! Off With Their Heads... err hands!! Only kidding, sort of, I’m actual a pretty compassionate guy and feel that thieves should be psychologically evaluated, then placed in taxpayer paid homes and nursed until they realize the wrong in their ways – Yeah right - - > just like I think mass murders should be placated and cared for too... for the rest of their natural lives.

Ya know, always been a rule in my family, if the dog has bone bad – humanely put it to rest before it goes badder (large caliber bullet to head is instant and painless). Once bitten twice shy; first time shame on you, second time shame on me!

My thooughts exactly. I know lot's of "smart"..."responsible" people who have taken to the leave it unlocked mentality because in the long run it's easier to deal with the insurance company and police than the insurance co, police, marina, woodworker, glassman, and fiberglass guy. It's also cheaper in the long run becuse the valuables are considered separately in some insurance setups (like a renters insurance clause) and don't raise your boat insurance nearly as much as when you claim damage to the boat.

 

[koliver]

We have become used to the idea that anything not securely locked up is fair game for a thief. It wasn't always that way, and isn't everywhere. I resist the trend. I live in an urban area, a suburb of Vancouver, which is a metro of 2.5 million people. Attitudes towards theft there are the same as in any other metro area of the same size. There are of course pockets of safety, such as our marina, which has several staff, including 24 hr security staff, to make it more safe. Other places I boat are out of the metro area, in remote areas, and in places that have theft rates approaching zero, so security is less of an issue. On Saltspring Island, pop 10k, the only way for a thief to get away is to take one of the ferries, so easy for the police to apprehend. Theft is so rare, that the theft of a pie from a bakery made the front page of the local rag. There, locking as though you are in the midst of the 2.5M is way over the top.
One should assess the level of actual risk and secure accordingly.

 

[sunchaser]

A favorite target in the PNW are the easy to get at outboards on dinghies. Especially those hanging on swim platforms

 

[CPseudonym]

A good friend with his boat docked in the Ca Delta at a reasonably secure marina had 5 hatches pried/broken open and a locked door pried open. Thieves stole a marine radio, low grade 25 year old stereo, 3 fishing poles, an anchor and some old rope. Replacement value approximately $500. The bill from the yard to repair the damage to the boat came to $2,400 and 3 weeks downtime.

Locked security gates, doors and hatches are worthless when the thieves approach at 3 am on a Tuesday night in a small outboard boat with crowbars.

 

[markpierce]

We need alert and caring liveaboards. Fortunately, there's one an empty berth away from me.

 

[psneeld]

We need alert and caring liveaboards. Fortunately, there's one an empty berth away from me.

It's funny how many "anti-liveaboard" boaters, towns, marinas are out there. On the water...liveaboards are probably one of the best "community watch groups" there are. So I don't know why it's a hard call unless liveaboards get out of control in some way.

At my marina...I was going to put security cameras up on my mast and trade the marina 24hr surveillance for free wifi...then it got sold and the new owner did it himself..but there's still plenty of blind spots and so much foot traffic through the marina a "live watch" I think still is best.

 

[Art]

It's funny how many "anti-liveaboard" boaters, towns, marinas are out there. On the water...liveaboards are probably one of the best "community watch groups" there are. So I don't know why it's a hard call unless liveaboards get out of control in some way.

At my marina...I was going to put security cameras up on my mast and trade the marina 24hr surveillance for free wifi...then it got sold and the new owner did it himself..but there's still plenty of blind spots and so much foot traffic through the marina a "live watch" I think still is best.

In marinas north and east of SF many have live aboard facilities with a certain # of live aboards allowed to meet accommodations and some towns' laws, at an elevated monthly slip fee. Often there are waiting lists. Also, an interesting item... marinas here have the 3 night/4 day clause, i.e. you can stay aboard your boat for that much time before you need to leave for at least one day and night. I've found by talking with live aboards that that rule bends pretty easy if they are quite, respectful, and not blatantly obvious. Also found some that have two boats in close-by marinas and simply split their time aboard each.

I think one reason some municipalities and too upscale marinas stay so down on live aboards is due to the still occurring perception that only “wharf rats” and indigents live on boats. In this 21st Century I find the vast majority of live aboards I meet are up standing, productive persons and I’m very pleased to have them at our docks... they can be great assistance around your boat when needed.

That said... unfortunately due to economic conditions, at some marinas many boats have been abandoned and there are homeless inappropriately squatting in some of these boats – that is not a good thing; and due to news stories it puts a bad color into the eye of the general public regarding any type of live aboards.

And, Life goes On!

 

[Marin]

You're never burgled until you're burgled. So the people who leave their boats unlocked never have a problem until they have a problem.

Not wanting to make that transition ourselves, we have always kept our boat locked when we are not on board. There are no electronics on the flying bridge since we never operate from up there. We also keep smash-and-grab items like binoculars, cameras, iPads, phones, etc. out of sight when we leave the boat.

The other year I installed a latch plate over the gap between the main cabin door and the door frame to eliminate the risk of using a credit card or knife blade to push the deadbolt and door latch back. We have a clamp lock on the dingy motor and we lock the dinghy itself to the boat when we're not on it.

Our objective is not to deter the serious crooks as they will get into the boat one way or the other if they want to, but to cause the casual burglar to move on to an easier boat if he encounters our locked doors and locked dinghy and motor. From what we've been told over the years by our marina staff and local law enforcement, it's the casual burglar who is much more prevalent in marinas like ours. Kids, druggies looking for anything to sell, that sort of thing. And with hundreds of boats to chose from, they are much more likely to move on if they encounter even a slight inconvenience to breaking in.

We have insurance to cover losses but we don't want the hassle of having to go get new stuff, and insurance never quite covers the cost of replacement anyway since prices keep going up. So it's a hassle we'd just as soon avoid altogether.

 

[rwidman]

You're never burgled until you're burgled. So the people who leave their boats unlocked never have a problem until they have a problem.

Not wanting to make that transition ourselves, we have always kept our boat locked when we are not on board. There are no electronics on the flying bridge since we never operate from up there. We also keep smash-and-grab items like binoculars, cameras, iPads, phones, etc. out of sight when we leave the boat.

The other year I installed a latch plate over the gap between the main cabin door and the door frame to eliminate the risk of using a credit card or knife blade to push the deadbolt and door latch back. We have a clamp lock on the dingy motor and we lock the dinghy itself to the boat when we're not on it.

Our objective is not to deter the serious crooks as they will get into the boat one way or the other if they want to, but to cause the casual burglar to move on to an easier boat if he encounters our locked doors and locked dinghy and motor. From what we've been told over the years by our marina staff and local law enforcement, it's the casual burglar who is much more prevalent in marinas like ours. Kids, druggies looking for anything to sell, that sort of thing. And with hundreds of boats to chose from, they are much more likely to move on if they encounter even a slight inconvenience to breaking in.

We have insurance to cover losses but we don't want the hassle of having to go get new stuff, and insurance never quite covers the cost of replacement anyway since prices keep going up. So it's a hassle we'd just as soon avoid altogether.

Well, that makes two of us.

 

[rwidman]

Let's talk about another reason you might want to lock your boat:

You ask your wife or daughter to drop by the boat while she's out and bring home something you left on the boat. She walks into the unlocked boat and confronts a pair of crackheads in the process of stealing something off the boat. Or just a couple homeless men who have gone inside for a dry place to drink and nap. What then?

If the boat is locked and you see signs of a break in, you (she) can back off and call the police to go in and check.

When police speak to community groups in my area, their advice is to lock your homes and cars. I'm sure if asked, their advice for boats would be the same.

 

[Per]

the marina we are currently in have a lot of security, you really can only gain access to the docks if you have the electronic key card (i have tried) unless you swim or gain access from the waterfront.
we do lock the boat but have to admit we often leave fishing poles and other equipment on the bridge which is pretty open access.
we do have several liveaboards on our gangway and they do see who comes and goes.. having liveaboards as neighbors is for the most part a blessing.

 

[jleonard]

I never lock the boat. I very rarely (if ever) lock my house. I rarely lock my truck, mainly only if at Walmart or in a parking garage.
I believe it only keeps the honest man honest.
I had my truck opened once at the marina and they stole a quart of oil and poured it on my truck, then threw the key into the middle of the parking lot. I found the key. Now I don't leave the key in the truck any more, I still carry a spare qt of oil, and I still don't lock it.

 

[rwidman]

...........At my marina...I was going to put security cameras up on my mast and trade the marina 24hr surveillance for free wifi...then it got sold and the new owner did it himself.

"Security" cameras are great. They don't stop theft, but you do get a video of people carting your stuff away.

The police will look at the video if someone is shot or killed. Not likely if your stereo is stolen.

 

[psneeld]

"Security" cameras are great. They don't stop theft, but you do get a video of people carting your stuff away.

The police will look at the video if someone is shot or killed. Not likely if your stereo is stolen.

Some other people seem to agree with me...and MY local police would LOVE to have video of a crime scene...

http://www.library.ca.gov/crb/97/05/

Generally, the data suggest that CCTV video surveillance is successful in reducing and preventing crimes and is helpful in prosecuting individuals caught in the act of committing a crime. In addition, there may be public law enforcement cost savings. Critics argue that public video surveillance conflicts with the U.S. Constitution's Fourth Amendment prohibition against unreasonable searches and seizures. These concerns and other related issues are discussed in this paper.

another..
How to Reduce Crime Through Surveillance Cameras | eHow.com


Surveillance cameras help prevent crime by creating the perception of an increased risk in committing an offense.


another...

Video Camera Networks Link Real-Time Partners in Crime-Solving

Jonathan Lewin, Chicago’s managing deputy director of public safety, believes that video cameras help officers protect citizens — and he has numbers to back up his claim. The Chicago Police Department says that Operation Virtual Shield, the city’s network of public and private surveillance cameras, has led to more than 5,500 camera-related arrests since 2006.

 

[markpierce]

The police will look at the video if someone is shot or killed. Not likely if your stereo is stolen.

In Vallejo it seems only physical assaults and murders justify the police to make an onsite investigation. Ransacking of one's home doesn't qualify onsite attention. Guess where boat crimes rank?

 

[CPseudonym]

With ya 100% on that one Mark. A stolen vehicle from another part of town was abandoned in front of my house 6 months ago. The owner found it by dumb luck driving random neighborhoods at 8 am on a Saturday morning. Phoned in that he found it with a broken steering column and missing stereo. Dispatcher asked if he can start it and drive it? When he tried it and said yes she gave him a report number and told him to take it up with his insurance agent. He asked what if it didn't start? Her answer, she could send him a tow truck if he would like.

In our little slice of California you are lucky to get a non-sworn community service officer to respond within an hour to take a report on a non injury auto accident. It will get a higher priority if it's blocking traffic.

 

[markpierce]

On the other hand, there were at least seven USCG personnel, most if not all armed each with semiautomatic pistols, investigating a minor fuel spill (some sheen and odor) around K-dock in Vallejo earlier this week. (Culprit still not identified after three such instances in the last month, per the fuel-dock guy.)

 

[rwidman]

For anyone who thinks security cameras prevent crime, a much less expensive solution is fake (non functional) cameras.

Now if you suspect it's your dock neighbors or someone else you know messing with your boat, a video surveillance system might help to prove your suspicions.

 

[psneeld]

For anyone who thinks security cameras prevent crime, a much less expensive solution is fake (non functional) cameras.

Now if you suspect it's your dock neighbors or someone else you know messing with your boat, a video surveillance system might help to prove your suspicions.

Geeez...so cameras, fake or not.... DO help....right back to where I started from...