What is Idle Speed in a "No Wake" Zone?

[Lepke]

As someone that has a private dock, I see no wake as not causing damage, whatever speed that requires. I have weekly minor damage in the boating season. Sometimes heavier damage. Almost all of it from yachts that would be hard pressed to make 10 knots, but won't slow down to a no wake speed for a couple minutes. The other problem is speedboats, going by pushing a wall of water, bow high, maybe 5 knots.


I have an 83x17 boat with twins and can go by any dock or marina without rocking the boats. I do that at idle, with one engine in neutral, dragging the prop. And I have small rudders. About 50 years ago, on a 60,000 hp destroyer, we went by a marina in a narrow channel, weekly, without rocking the boats. (Hylebos Waterway, Tacoma)


I got no sympathy for you whiners that can't slow down for a couple minutes while you go by a dock. Maybe if dock owners put up cameras and started collecting for damage, we could get some compliance.

 

[rslifkin]

I got no sympathy for you whiners that can't slow down for a couple minutes while you go by a dock. Maybe if dock owners put up cameras and started collecting for damage, we could get some compliance.

I agree. Way too many people push it in terms of wake near docks. But on the other side of the coin, I don't feel much sympathy for those few dock owners that freak out over a 2 - 3 inch ripple in the water and scream about it. If a 3 inch wake is going to cause damage, I'm hard pressed to understand how the setup survives on a windy day.

 

[psneeld]

The real argument is when a federal waterway highway (ICW) starts to become unreasonably slow when mile after mile of new developments put in docks and expect " state sponsored" no wake areas.

The same argument for closing an airport because someone built a neighborhood at the end of the runway.

 

[psneeld]

I agree. Way too many people push it in terms of wake near docks. But on the other side of the coin, I don't feel much sympathy for those few dock owners that freak out over a 2 - 3 inch ripple in the water and scream about it. If a 3 inch wake is going to cause damage, I'm hard pressed to understand how the setup survives on a windy day.

I agree that a wake no bigger than what that dock sees on the average windy day should be overlooked.

 

[BandB]

As someone that has a private dock, I see no wake as not causing damage, whatever speed that requires. I have weekly minor damage in the boating season. Sometimes heavier damage. Almost all of it from yachts that would be hard pressed to make 10 knots, but won't slow down to a no wake speed for a couple minutes. The other problem is speedboats, going by pushing a wall of water, bow high, maybe 5 knots.


I have an 83x17 boat with twins and can go by any dock or marina without rocking the boats. I do that at idle, with one engine in neutral, dragging the prop. And I have small rudders. About 50 years ago, on a 60,000 hp destroyer, we went by a marina in a narrow channel, weekly, without rocking the boats. (Hylebos Waterway, Tacoma)


I got no sympathy for you whiners that can't slow down for a couple minutes while you go by a dock. Maybe if dock owners put up cameras and started collecting for damage, we could get some compliance.

We're in a very different environment as there are docks everywhere. You got no sympathy from whiners that can't slow down, yet most of it isn't a restricted wake area. So, I've got no sympathy for those who have docks along the ICW in the boating capital of the country and whine about every boat that passes.

I'm both a boater and a dock owner. As a boater I try to not create any massive wake but as a dock owner, I'm fully prepared for the fact there will be wakes, I'm on the water, in fact very close to an approved watersports zone with skiing and jet skis. Our best friends are right on the ICW and constant traffic. We're just off but we are in the path of hundreds of boats heading to the ICW and under speed as they pass our dock.

The marinas in our area are in slow zones, either no wake or minimum wake.

There's a balance. One thing I observe is a lot of boat owners don't know their own boat's wakes. They just think slow does it and you mentioned the plowing speed boat going slow, absolutely bad wakes. In our small, fast boat, it's either level running speed (boat level) or it's running on plane. In between can wake badly. Then on the other side, there's the dock owner who associates speed with wakes and we've been yelled at for going too fast when we were not creating even a small wake that hit the person's dock.

 

[ColonyCove]

I guess I'm lucky, having a slip on a tributary of a saltwater creek which flows into a river, which flows into a sound, which flows into the Atlantic Ocean. Shallow and dead end features protect dockmates and me from any wake issues. For boaters and dock owners along the ICW and elsewhere; it is easy to see both sides of the issue. A big yacht throwing a 3-4 foot wake can cause some actual property damage, but dock owners who say it takes only a few moments to slow down can be unmindful of the fact that a boat transiting can be reduced to many fewer miles a day because every person with a dock along the route feels the same way. I would suggest common sense, but that is too rare to be an effective solution.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Same thing as with the virus. It’s in our DNA.

We try to “get away with” whatever we can.
Free ways we go 75 to 85mph.
Taxes ... we try to pay as little as we can.
Getting in line at the bank. We stand between two lines and as soon as it’s obvious what line is probably going to be quicker .. we jump over to it. Really bad crowders will walk up and talk to someone near the head of the line .. like we know them. We talk a little to make it look like we know them.
We like to show we are winners when we pass in a car. We jerk back in line (so take that” when there’s plenty of room to pull ahead in the “passing lane” and be considerate to the people we just passed. Giving others space.
We like to be winners in everything and we like to show that we are. I just bought a (cool thing) and guess what I paid for it? And show you got ahead by taking advantage of some poor guy.

Sure some people making big wakes don’t even know what wakes are. And some slow more than they really need to. But most Just plow on thinking or even saying “naww that’s for old people and low-lifes” Not me .. I’m one of the in peeps, cool and it’s natural to speed, crowd or otherwise take advantage of other people. But we deserve it .. it’s our due.

Para deleted by TF Site Team - Politics

 

[HiDHo]

Willy, you just entered a no political spin zone.

 

[bligh]

I leave a small wake in my fishing boat often. I have to go down a heavily docked channel about 1 mile before I get to open water. I roll at about 5 to 5.5 mph. 2mph is not an option- I have to be at work on Monday. I leave behind about a 6 to 7 inch wake with a fairly short period. All the rag merchants in their 22 ft blow boats barely feel it as I go by. They all know me by now. They yell at me often as I tip my hat to them on my way by. My wake wouldn’t cause a full glass of wine to spill, but they sure make it clear I am going to fast since I am not leaving a glass like surface behind my boat. I wonder why those fellows chose the end tie on a busy channel in he first place. I’m positive they are the same gentlemen who drive 55 in the passing lane.

 

[Beaverlake]

We have far too many boaters in Seattle who see the 7knt / no wake signs and go 7 knots in a 16-18 foot runabout. MAJOR wake for a small boat at that speed.

 

[BruceK]

Ku Ring Gai Motor Yacht Club(KMYC) is on a part of the Hawkesbury River system in a "No Wake" Zone. Here, "4 Knot Zone" seems interchangeable. The man who runs the service office by their dock has both loud hailer and VHF radio at his disposal,and is not afraid to use them.
I find it near impossible to leave "no wake",I don`t think what I leave would inconvenience anyone. And I `ve never been called out by KMYC.

 

[Salish Nomad]

If anyone was enforcing that in Swinomish Channel, the tribal boys would never catch any crab!

Yup, more than once I've been forced out of the dredged channel.

 

[BobMc]

In reality, "no wake" is meaningless and absolutely subjective. Every boat, no matter the speed, leaves a wake. If I received a "ticket" for going to fast in a "no wake" zone, I'd contest it as having no basis in reality. A speed, say 5 or 6 MPH, is something that is quantifiable and at least has some meaning.

 

[jeffnick]

I got stopped by a water cop doing 5 1/2 mph in my 16' boat in a No Wake Zone. The cop said no wake means no white water from bow or stern. We did a test and that was 4 mph for me in his waters. This means I could get a ticket at anchor in a 5 mph current?

 

[Lepke]

The no wake laws are there for a reason. Small wakes collectively can cause as much damage as one big one. If you're too important to slow down, then be prepared for the consequences. Carry good insurance.

If you're somewhere crowded, like the East Coast, too bad. You chose to live there and voted for the people that make the zoning laws. I've been up and down the East Coast and never used the ICW. If you're in a hurry, travel on the ocean.

 

[jlgray]

In Washington State, deep in the definitions of the law, a wake is less than 12 inches of vertical swell. Very hard to measure from your boat. Easy to see when it hits a vertical surface.

I know that on my Kadey Krogen 39, the no wake speed is 1100 rpm. Never been stopped by the Everett PD who frequent the Marina.

 

[Swfla]

All these answers have some merit. But, if a water cop wants to issue you a ticket, he's gonna do it. All the explaining in the world won't change that. All you can do is explain yourself in court and hope for an "interpretation" in your favor. All the arm chair lawyering in the world won't change the ambiguity of this issue. Too many variables.

 

[jeffnick]

https://72land-n-sea.blogspot.com/2011/12/manatee-madness.html

 

[BandB]

All these answers have some merit. But, if a water cop wants to issue you a ticket, he's gonna do it. All the explaining in the world won't change that. All you can do is explain yourself in court and hope for an "interpretation" in your favor. All the arm chair lawyering in the world won't change the ambiguity of this issue. Too many variables.

Yet, I've never known them to issue a ticket for a situation that was even borderline. They might tell someone they need to slow a little more, but the tickets go to those flagrantly disregarding the wake zones.

 

[Swfla]

It seems we're all bored with COVID lurking outside the safety of our home or boat. All this chat is a form of therapy.

 

[FF]

"Isn’t the key word here “regulatory”? Lots of folks put up no wake signs but they’re not legally enforceable, are they?"


Manatee zone is also popular to stick on the lawn.

 

[Mark P]

FF - that's a good point - whether enforceable. From what I am gathering from the experts here is, a wake is much like porn as the Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart wrote in 1964 - "I know it when I see it" - so the cops will just look and decide. But the other point is whether someone has the right to plop down a no wake sign and force others to oblige? I generally see fisherman out in the middle of Calibogue sound fishing in a small boat - Do I owe this guy a no wake? Just from general courtesy, I always slow down when I see them out there, but from a legal position, could this person get my license numbers and come after me if I went by (even at 300 yards away) as 20 MPH??

 

[HiDHo]

I’d say yes, It’s your responsibility if you cause a dangerous wake even if someone is anchored in the middle of the bay or channel. Causing injury or damage because you failed operate safely ?
Not slowing makes no sense to me unless you feel like you have to arrive at your destination at a precise time which to me destroys the whole idea of a relaxing cruise on the water.

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

Really?

It ain't rocket science Ladies and Gentlemen! No wake is simply that no wake generated by your vessel.

I guess the ICW would need a standard as most of it no wake?


This is what happens with your wake.

-Arrested for negligent operation of a vessel (wake)
-$55, 000 in damages
-No insurance
-Court awards and orders plaintiff to pay $35000
-He pays $50 a month as he is on Social Security disability


Again "No Wake" ain't rocket science.

 

[Bacchus]

I was stopped by LEO in a canoe by myself w a 2 HP outboard for going too fast in a no wake zone.
I told him I couldn't make a wake if I tried.
He said it has nothing to do with how much wake and no defined speed. He quoted the regs as as slow as possible while able to maintain steerage.

 

[BandB]

It ain't rocket science Ladies and Gentlemen! No wake is simply that no wake generated by your vessel.

I guess the ICW would need a standard as most of it no wake?

.

Actually very little of the ICW is no wake, while many boaters in the ICW seem to think it all should be.

 

[Tin Man]

All these answers have some merit. But, if a water cop wants to issue you a ticket, he's gonna do it. All the explaining in the world won't change that. All you can do is explain yourself in court and hope for an "interpretation" in your favor. All the arm chair lawyering in the world won't change the ambiguity of this issue. Too many variables.

My Dad received a ticket on the CT river when he was definitely going slow. He was convinced it was because the town displayed on the transom was not on the CT river.

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

Washington State:

---snip---
“No wake” is defined as “The slowest possible speed required in order
to maintain steerage and headway.”

In Washington, it is unlawful to operate at greater than ‘no wake’ speed
when around gas docks, marinas, boat ramps, and people in the water
even if not marked by a regulatory marker.

You may be held responsible for damage caused by vessel wake
or wash resulting from negligent or careless operation of a vessel.
---snip---

I did a little research for a Washington State "No Wake." What I found was there is no "State Wide" definition. Local governments instead have the authority to establish no wake zones over waters they have jurisdiction.

The quate above is the No Wake definition is for King County (Seattle).

 

[Swfla]

There's at least two ways to look at this. From a law and court point of view, if you get ticketed for violating (even though you followed the law) you canopy the fine or go to court and try to contest the ticket. This is often far from real world experiences. An example is a trawler that can move at 7 knots and not throw a wake is theoretically in compliance to posted "no wake" signs. The boat is fully settled in the water and not producing a wave. Often larger commercial boats can travel at idle speed and still produce a large wake, they aren't in compliance. It's one of those "no solution" situations. The world is an imperfect place and most situations aren't black and white. The law falls outside of reality and attempts to be black and white. It sucks if you get caught between law and reality.

 

[Rufus]

Waterfront erosion is a huge issue on the Great Lakes. Try coming into inlet and river areas adjoining the big lakes throwing even a tiny wake and you will have property owners lined up with air horns blasting at you. (And understandably so in my opinion). Last week a transient 60 foot Princess came down the channel toward the fuel dock clearly throwing a wake. He slowed down a bit after the horn onslaught, but was still going too fast when he passed the marina. (A one foot wave slops over the fixed docks). I yelled at him and pointed to his stern. The operator threw his hands up and yelled that both engines were at idle....what am I supposed to do. I called the fuel dock and told the staff to tell the operator to run on one engine or nudge it in and out of gear on the way out...duh. He was "no wake" on departure.