Conrad
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- Canada
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- Blue Sky
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- Nordic Tugs 42 Hull #001
All aluminum. Saw it up close in Port McNeil a month ago; gorgeous in person.
ABD Aluminium Yachts | Home
Anyone For A Fleming!
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The friendliest place on the web for anyone who enjoys boating.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
All aluminum. Saw it up close in Port McNeil a month ago; gorgeous in person.
ABD Aluminium Yachts | Home
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2012
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- Australia
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- Insequent
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- Ocean Alexander 50 Mk I
I just received an email from the local Fleming folk. Although its Friday here, and I am in Brisbane already I'll stick with my OA Mk 1 rather than take the 55 they are selling!
And of course I needn't bother asking about the new 85... If you follow the link below and then click somewhere on the first page it should take you to a page with lots of info on the 85, and launch video.
Obviously Fleming were happy with the job Norman R Wright did with the 58 design, so used them again for the 85. Wrights are quite close to me, and they repaired the damage incurred when I shipped my boat from the PNW. They are a premier business in all respects.
Although the 58 is very nice I would take the conventional layout, master in the bow as that GA provides reasonable 2nd and 3rd cabins. Apparently sales are 50/50 vs the midship master. But the issue I have with it is that although the midship master is pretty sensational in itself, the third cabin is almost a closet, and only fit for children. For some buyers that would be fine I guess. One mistake with the 58 (and perhaps others) is that the battery bank is in the ER, and as such the bank's life will be shortened.
Fleming Yachts Australia - Newsletter
And of course I needn't bother asking about the new 85... If you follow the link below and then click somewhere on the first page it should take you to a page with lots of info on the 85, and launch video.
Obviously Fleming were happy with the job Norman R Wright did with the 58 design, so used them again for the 85. Wrights are quite close to me, and they repaired the damage incurred when I shipped my boat from the PNW. They are a premier business in all respects.
Although the 58 is very nice I would take the conventional layout, master in the bow as that GA provides reasonable 2nd and 3rd cabins. Apparently sales are 50/50 vs the midship master. But the issue I have with it is that although the midship master is pretty sensational in itself, the third cabin is almost a closet, and only fit for children. For some buyers that would be fine I guess. One mistake with the 58 (and perhaps others) is that the battery bank is in the ER, and as such the bank's life will be shortened.
Fleming Yachts Australia - Newsletter
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ranger58sb
Guru
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- Aug 21, 2013
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- Annapolis
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- Ranger
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- 58' Sedan Bridge
Me too. Unless we were to decide on the Sabre 66 flybridge version.
The 58 looks pretty good; seems to speak to all the things the 55 isn't so great at.
The Fleming dealer up here is right next door to our own marina, leases several slips from our place... so we get to swoon over 'em all the time.
-Chris
Great boats, just ran from San Diego to Friday harbor, WA, 6 days one fuel stop averaged 10knts running 24/7. We sold our Ocean Alexander Mk1 and as Brian says the midship master on the Mk1s are nice, I would probably buy a new Mk1 if they built it today! As long as you are on the water doesn't really matter what type of boat!
I'm 6 ft 1 in, could I walk around down there without having to crouch here and there - incl master stateroom, its head, shower etc?
w8n4sun
Senior Member
Now there's a trip I'd love to hear more about, especially this time of year.
High Pocket was built for a Tall Guy. Stan was called High Pockets as a kid, cause he was .... well you get it.
He kept HP in a shelter at Reed Pt, so she was always clean when not out cruising. Don't know where she is based now, or if still sheltered.
garychurch
Senior Member
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- Feb 17, 2018
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- 113
- Location
- US
- Vessel Name
- Laa-Dee-Dah
- Vessel Make
- 64’ Grand Banks Aleutian
First I really love the Flemings. I looked at a 55 and it wasn’t quite suitable for me snd my wife.
1. Didn’t like the master in the bow. Midship master is quieter and more comfortable.
2. Being retired the 55 didn’t provide stand up engine room with easy access to systems and engines.
3. The salon was too narrow and felt cramped.
While the Fleming 65 fit the bill, used prices were too high. Again, have a high regard for Fleming and would love to have a Fleming 65 as a live aboard.
1. Didn’t like the master in the bow. Midship master is quieter and more comfortable.
2. Being retired the 55 didn’t provide stand up engine room with easy access to systems and engines.
3. The salon was too narrow and felt cramped.
While the Fleming 65 fit the bill, used prices were too high. Again, have a high regard for Fleming and would love to have a Fleming 65 as a live aboard.
garychurch
Senior Member
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- Laa-Dee-Dah
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- 64’ Grand Banks Aleutian
Both Outer Reef 65 and Fleming 65 are fine boats. Actually made a. Offer on an Outer Reef 65 before getting the Grand Banks 64 Aleutian.
Since most of these boats are built to owner spec it really depends on the layout and equipage and finding one that suits your needs snd wants. Of course if you had an extra few millions and had the time you could order a new one.
Since most of these boats are built to owner spec it really depends on the layout and equipage and finding one that suits your needs snd wants. Of course if you had an extra few millions and had the time you could order a new one.
gknoepfler
Member
Powerball win purchase for me!
KiwiClive
Veteran Member
Love em.
Unfortunately we just had one burn and sink here in New Zealand.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-advocate/news/fire-destroys-luxury-boat-in-minutes-in-the-bay-of-islands/QHHWYIVKQHG44NEOY7TGAXRB2Q/
Unfortunately we just had one burn and sink here in New Zealand.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-advocate/news/fire-destroys-luxury-boat-in-minutes-in-the-bay-of-islands/QHHWYIVKQHG44NEOY7TGAXRB2Q/
Simi 60
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- Australia
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- Milkraft 60 converted timber prawn trawler
Agreed, engine room is a fail from my viewpoint.
If it ain't easy to get into I ain't inclined to want to get in there.
Full headroom and cat swinging space was a number one requirement when looking for ours.
#2 was a cabin not down in the bowels with a hot engine for company
#3 was some sense of style and generous overhangs to help with shading - seems they got that bit right.
They do look nice.
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Simi 60
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- Jul 1, 2016
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- Australia
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- Milkraft 60 converted timber prawn trawler
Very nice
And a sizable chunk of coin left in those "high pockets" for fuel and maintenance
ASKING PRICE: CAD 949,010
https://boatingfreedom.com/boats/ABD Yachts Custom Expedition-trawler-3730143/
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That's at Burr Yacht in MD. Some day I hope to call one my own! Love em. Shortcomings mentioned..... I can live with. Stand up engine room would be nice but in keeping with a low CG something had to give. Thankfully still limber enough I think I can work with it. Another 10 years maybe not so much. Love everything about it and hey, how can anyone live without a dumbwaiter on ones yacht anyway.
greatpapabear
Senior Member
We bought our Fleming 55 in 2003 after falling in love with the photo of a Fleming on the front of a boating magazine.
Before buying, we saw one at the Southampton Boat Show and Tony showed us around. When I saw the wasted amount space in the lazarette and engine room I commented that if the waste was reduced and the engines moved aft, a mid-cabin could be created for the owner. Surely that would be better?
Looking at me, somewhat askance, he said, 'But Piers, engines are far more important than people.'
We bought her, and still have her. We know every inch of her. Yes, there've been issues, some very, very costly to repair indeed (with no help from Fleming), but we can't bear to get rid of her.
Before buying, we saw one at the Southampton Boat Show and Tony showed us around. When I saw the wasted amount space in the lazarette and engine room I commented that if the waste was reduced and the engines moved aft, a mid-cabin could be created for the owner. Surely that would be better?
Looking at me, somewhat askance, he said, 'But Piers, engines are far more important than people.'
We bought her, and still have her. We know every inch of her. Yes, there've been issues, some very, very costly to repair indeed (with no help from Fleming), but we can't bear to get rid of her.
What were the "issues" suffered? I will be in the market in about 18 mos and this is my top choice. Cant afford new and likely looking at an '04~'07 based on my wallet and current prices. That said I am very curious of your early experience and what went wrong.
I took a hard look at (I recall was) a 55 at the Annapolis Boat Show 2019 and came to similar conclusions. However the biggest killer for me was that I want a single only.
Phyrcooler
Senior Member
I learned my lesson with my last boat (Mainship 390). I will never have a boat where you can’t reasonably get ALL around the motor(s), for maintenance. Standing headroom in ER isn’t mandatory for me, but access IS. As important is access to everything else that will eventually need repair or replacing. Loved my boat, but it was a prime example of LAZY design/ engineering with no thought to maintenance/repair. Even stuff I didn’t fix myself was way more expensive because of the man hours involved to R&R. I’ve moved back to my first love - sailing, and have great access. If I ever get another powerboat/trawler, maintenance access will be near the top of the checklist.
rslifkin
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Agreed. I've seen plenty of boats where engine access is top down only, or there's a tank directly outboard of an engine, leaving minimal access. But crawling around with enough space arrive everything isn't so bad.
Jimintheair3
Scraping Paint
Simply sit in the salon, try too look out the window's NOT! Next Boat Show, you will say, "that guy was right"! The seats are to low! Sorry, "we will not change."
This is true, third stateroom! We would like to make into an office, "that is not available! You can change it after delivery."
That is a quote given to the owner of OUTER REEF! That's why he got into the boat building business!
IMO, Jim
This is true, third stateroom! We would like to make into an office, "that is not available! You can change it after delivery."
That is a quote given to the owner of OUTER REEF! That's why he got into the boat building business!
IMO, Jim
greatpapabear
Senior Member
Issue 1 - started when I found hundreds of small 2mm blisters on the pilot house roof.
Over the coming months, these started showing on most surfaces above the waterline. Thousands of small blisters.
The Fleming Europe dealer and their recommended GRP company came to see the issues.
The boat was lifted, tented and it didn't take long to identify the problem. When, in 2002/2003, she was taken out of the mold, many areas needed filling and re-gelling. Some filling was over an inch thick and the problem was that the filler was not epoxy. Quite the opposite - it seemed to be 'water attractive'. So, rain water was being 'sucked' through the gel coat into the filler. When the sun came out, blisters would start to bulge.
It took almost three months for a team to cut and grind out the blistered areas, reinforce with bi-axial cloth, re-fill, gel and polish.
Some blisters were also found around the back of the boat under and along the waterline, extending forward some 12 feet or so on each side. Again, these all had to be dug out. The worst areas were on the aft corners where the filler was some 3 inches thick.
As my surveyor said, it was not the dreaded osmosis as we know it. His report was long, detailed, and full of photographs.
Issue 2 - whilst on the hard, we decided to clean under the waterline and epoxy the hull. As the old antifoul was removed, hundreds and hundred of tiny holes were found through which you could see the glass matting. My surveyor was clear that this was not due to the removal method.
Thankfully, the hull and matting were completely dry, testament to the original build. Rather than fill each hole, my surveyor recommended having the hull peeled, reinforced with bi-axial cloth, and re-gelled.
Overall, the costs were approx £80,000 (that's GB pounds sterling).
The result? The most bullet-proof Fleming hull, according to the surveyor.
Is our hull (#129) the only one affected? A question I'm often asked. It appears the issues are around the specific mold used for the hull in question.
I'm told by my surveyor that a way to check is by using a surveyor's liquid chalk which comes in the form of a pen. Wipe it on the gel coat. If it wipes off easily, you're fine. If it seems to sink in, the hull may suffer the same issues.
Areas affected are typically those which 'look at the sun' such as the pilot house roof, the top and front of the radar arch, the top of the rubbing strakes, the surround of the bathing platform, the front of the Portuguese bridge and its doors, the tops of the flybridge seating and the list goes on.
Does Play d'eau still suffer from blisters? Just a few, but as they appear I have them ground out.
Any other issues? Only one - rain water leaks. But after five years of hunting, they've finally been resolved - but that's another story.
55 #129
Simi 60
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Wow, totally unacceptable on a boat at that price point
And I thought it was bad seeing half an inch of epoxy bog getting trowelled onto heavily welded aluminium superyachts back when I was doing my apprenticeship.
But a boat out of a mould? No excuse for that which I can think of
In my research with Fleming I have learned that the F55 mold was changed with Hull number 136. So, it appears that you were on the tail end of the extended useful life of the first set. Molds, apperantly are a wearing tool which gets damaged along the way which may explain "why" they used fairing material to repair the imperfect sections? Just a guess on my part but will definitely drive me to look for Hulls after 136...
Great - Now I just need an additional few hundred thousand. Surely I have that laying around somewhere.
greatpapabear
Senior Member
I'd heard #136 was the mold change, but whether it really solved the process problems, I don't know.
Take your liquid chalk with you and if you need a second opinion, I'll introduce you to my surveyor who oversaw the works from start to finish. I know I'm not the only one who has suffered / is suffering blister problems.
Having owned Play d'eau from new in 2003 I known every inch of her and her systems and have nursed her through various illnesses, some major, some minor. Now, we have a bond. She looks really good, she's in fine fettle, and I'm proud of her. When thinking of upgrading, two key points stop me. First, would I have similar issues with a new boat and have months, maybe years, of torment putting things right? Second, I can't bear the thought of divorce - we know each other far too well.
I'll talk about Issue 3 (rain water leaks) sometime.
For longer passage making a midship master cabin will guarantee the most comfortable place to rest.
We own hull#131 55 Fleming. The boat has NEVER had a blister in the gel coat! In fact I think she shines better than new(I may be biased) I have seen some earlier Flemings with some blister, my opinion is some boats may have been laid up at different times of the year or maybe a resin problem? We also had ZERO deck leaks. Engine room is a little tight but I have a good in shape mechanic! She spent her whole life in the PNW although the last 2 were in San Diego before we brought her back in December. No boat is perfect but she fits are family very well.
