Changing out the sight tubes on fuel tank for remote tank/senders

[Barking Sands]

A while ago I posted this idea to open it up for criticism. I had no gauges on the boat only sight tubes. No major issues were brought up so I went ahead and ordered the pieces. 3 inch aluminum tube .125 wall 6061T6 and some bungs. Welded those up with a spool gun
Not pretty, but pressure tested to 20 psi. Ordered fittings with extra long barbs that would allow double clamps. Ordered marine approved and rated hose and the senders and gauges x2. All in it was about $180 give or take. Of course I already had paint and primer and some materials. Add about 20 hours of labor including welding and painting. Labor was a bit high because I was not sure of the final destination of several things such as gauge location. Im sure it could be done in nearly half that or less.

Anyways happy to report it works great. Gauges have 8 backlight colors including one with no backlight but the needle and numbers light up. The gauge and senders are very nice when considering they were 35 bucks as a kit. I went ahead and bought a spare set gauge and sender for future repairs if needed. I am very very happy with the simple outcome.

 

[SeaLion]

Gauges look nice. Why didn’t you keep both? Less work + belt and suspenders.

 

[Barking Sands]

Gauges look nice. Why didn’t you keep both? Less work + belt and suspenders.

The location of the valves made it very difficult to get in behind the engine area and open the valves. Many say just leave the valves open and say they have done so for years. I dont find that as a safe practice IMO. I have changed hundreds of broken Tygon, PVC and poly tubes on aircraft over the last 37 years. Fortunately they can only be used as drains on aircraft. So using fuel rated hose, pressure tested vessel and gauges and leaving the valves open was the simple solution. Of course the gauges will be primary for tracking fuel. Secondary will just be sticking the tanks. I would prefer to manually stick the tanks than climb down and open valves.

If I had a bigger engine room it would not have been too big of a deal. Sight tubes and valves would be perfectly fine. But on my smaller boat, getting down in that area which is over the driveshaft is brutal on the knees and shins..lol. I dont want to have to climb down there unless absolutely needed.

 

[SIBERNUT]

Looks great. Where did you get the kits?

 

[Barking Sands]

Just got them on Amazon. When I got them it was around $35 per kit. Now its $44. Still a good price. They have senders from 4 inches to 19 inches https://amzn.to/3ORJuSq

 

[Delta Riverat]

Very cool idea and execution!

 

[Barking Sands]

Very cool idea and execution!

Thanks. I just wanted to share it for the few people that may have a similar predicament and dont want to spend a ton. Also the fuel system is powered of a breaker I relabeled "Helm DC". This powers just a few things at the lower helm like a flexible led gooseneck light, USB chargers and other small items. So I dont have to power up a bunch of stuff for fuel readings.

 

[rgano]

3 feet of pipe. not inches. Had me cornfused. Very clever idea.

The reason I don't leave the sight gauges open is because it does not take a lot of fire or other things flopping around down there to end up with a nice, steady flow of fuel into a (fiery?) bilge via broken sight gauge tubing. Because others have done so for years makes them years stupid and lucky.

 

[Barking Sands]

3 feet of pipe. not inches. Had me cornfused. Very clever idea.

The reason I don't leave the sight gauges open is because it does not take a lot of fire or other things flopping around down there to end up with a nice, steady flow of fuel into a (fiery?) bilge via broken sight gauge tubing. Because others have done so for years makes them years stupid and lucky.

Thats what I thought as well. We constantly hear people play safety police (rightfully so) in regards to heat shields on Racors. But to have tygon open for years at a time that will empty the tanks? Even if no fire a broken tube can empty a tank in the bilge. Still a disaster..lol.

When I was replacing the old stained sight tubes with new I searched for some kind of justification to leave valves open because it just didnt feel right. I came across a reply you made like 5 years ago stating the same thing. There was really no arguing the point. Its not a safe practice.

 

[Delta Riverat]

I agree. Our training captain did also. Open valves, check new level, close valves.

That clear plastic tubing is fragile.

 

[Steve1.0]

What is the preferred tubing to use for the site gauges? I'm thinking of adding them back on my new tanks as a back up. Currently have the tank tender system.

 

[CaptTom]

Just got them on Amazon. When I got them it was around $35 per kit. Now its $44. Still a good price. They have senders from 4 inches to 19 inches https://amzn.to/3ORJuSq

Looks great. Too bad my tanks are 26" deep.

 

[Barking Sands]

What is the preferred tubing to use for the site gauges? I'm thinking of adding them back on my new tanks as a back up. Currently have the tank tender system.

Per ABYC alumin tanks need to be Alloy 5052 or
5083 or 5086 at min of .090 wall. But thats for a whole tank. For plates and other structures it also adds 6061 and 6063 as options. 6061 tube is readily available. Its 3 inch OD. That gave plenty od room for the float as well as a flange at top to drill and tap for the screws. Use thead lock/sealer on screw threads.

**EDIT** Woops. Misread your question. Tygon is a very good tubing for this. I think people use PVC as well.

 

[twistedtree]

You can also use a self-closing valve on the lower tank port for a sight gauge. They have a spring-loaded lever that you open to equalize the sight gauge level, then release to re-close the valve. So you can't accidentally leave the valve open. They are a bit pricey, but work very well. Automatic closing valves like this are required on CE boats.


An example is an Apollo 71-500.

 

[Barking Sands]

Looks great. Too bad my tanks are 26" deep.

A bit pricier but here is a 24 inch unit for $75. https://amzn.to/3OCWFoS

The brand I chose didnt have that length but many others do . Kus probably does too.

 

[KnotYet]

A bit pricier but here is a 24 inch unit for $75. https://amzn.to/3OCWFoS

The brand I chose didnt have that length but many others do . Kus probably does too.

In this application the Holley Easy Level sending unit would work great.
Available online for $99. No moving parts is its main attraction.

 

[Barking Sands]

In this application the Holley Easy Level sending unit would work great.
Available online for $99. No moving parts is its main attraction.

I love the idea of the Holley unit. But if you read the reviews on Summit Performance so far its about a 10% success rate.

The floats I have use the magnetic reed switches. I counted the corresponding positions and it appears there are about 16 to 20 or so positions, I cant remember exact number Not a tremendous amount of resolution but good enough to inform me for my purposes. The Holley would be great since the resolution should be very good. Ill let the gearheads and Holley work out the kinks first though. Seems like its not quite ready.

 

[heysteve]

What is the preferred tubing to use for the site gauges? I'm thinking of adding them back on my new tanks as a back up. Currently have the tank tender system.

McMaster-Carr has a nice selection of sight tube components here.

 

[SIBERNUT]

My tanks have hand holes with plates but they are centered. I could remove the plates, cut for the senders and slightly bevel weld the seats to reach the low point of the tank. Have to ask if floats will work tilted, but it's plenty slippery in there!

 

[KnotYet]

I love the idea of the Holley unit. But if you read the reviews on Summit Performance so far its about a 10% success rate.

The floats I have use the magnetic reed switches. I counted the corresponding positions and it appears there are about 16 to 20 or so positions, I cant remember exact number Not a tremendous amount of resolution but good enough to inform me for my purposes. The Holley would be great since the resolution should be very good. Ill let the gearheads and Holley work out the kinks first though. Seems like its not quite ready.

Maybe they have 'cleansed' the reviews on the Summit site. I couldn't find the 10%
success rate you reference. Only 5 reviews total, 2 bad and 3 good so not much of
a sample anyway. I know they have a facebook presence but I don't so there may
be more discussion there.
People with bad experiences tend to report more often it would seem, also.

 

[CaptTom]

I have a DIY ultrasonic sensor on my heating oil tank at home. Works great, but not sure how well that translates to an odd-shaped, baffled, moving fuel tank on a boat.

Plus, I'd need to match up the cover plate exactly. The home tank is a standard pipe thread, and the tank doesn't move, so that part wasn't a concern.

 

[Barking Sands]

Maybe they have 'cleansed' the reviews on the Summit site. I couldn't find the 10%
success rate you reference. Only 5 reviews total, 2 bad and 3 good so not much of
a sample anyway. I know they have a facebook presence but I don't so there may
be more discussion there.
People with bad experiences tend to report more often it would seem, also.

Go back and read the reviews though. A bit odd, two of the reviews that had 5 stars stated it didnt work. So of the 5 only 1 worked even though the avg was a little over 3 stars. Some seem to be duplicate reviews too. It could just be user error. Need a larger sample size. At that price I would be tempted to buy one and mess with it. It may actually work better in a small tube like I am using since there is nearly no sloshing. But then again the close in sides may interfere. I may try one just to experiment.

 

[Hippocampus]

Gauges look nice. Why didn’t you keep both? Less work + belt and suspenders.

Lots of logic to this. Sight tubes are pretty fool proof.

 

[Hippocampus]

I have a DIY ultrasonic sensor on my heating oil tank at home. Works great, but not sure how well that translates to an odd-shaped, baffled, moving fuel tank on a boat.

Plus, I'd need to match up the cover plate exactly. The home tank is a standard pipe thread, and the tank doesn't move, so that part wasn't a concern.

Had a Phillipi monitoring system on last boat for batteries, all tanks, draw etc. it came without ultrasonic tank sensors . Loved the ultrasonic sensors. No floats, nothing to maintain, accurate and much better than anything I had before.

 

[Turtle Blues]

Do the tubes / wells provide any buffering action?
I have old school top floats and they mirror the roll of the boat in rough weather.

 

[KnotYet]

Go back and read the reviews though. A bit odd, two of the reviews that had 5 stars stated it didnt work. So of the 5 only 1 worked even though the avg was a little over 3 stars. Some seem to be duplicate reviews too. It could just be user error. Need a larger sample size. At that price I would be tempted to buy one and mess with it. It may actually work better in a small tube like I am using since there is nearly no sloshing. But then again the close in sides may interfere. I may try one just to experiment.

To clarify what I wrote earlier, your implementation is pretty flawless and
the low-cost float sensors come with gauges, too. A win-win in my opinion.

 

[SIBERNUT]

Anyone got a mfr of Rupse to ask if it can be tilted ?

 

[AlanT]

I have changed hundreds of broken Tygon, PVC and poly tubes on aircraft over the last 37 years.

Nice job! I am interested in your experience based comment on Tygon. When I purchased my current boat 4 years ago the sight gauges were nylon hose. These were picked out by my surveyor and after purchase I replaced with Tygon fuel rated hose. My sight gauges are nicely located and with a huge engine room am happy with this arrangement. However your comment re Tygon failing concerns me. Can you add context please? FYI I generally close the sight gauge valves but have certainly left them open from time to time and am wondering if this is safe.
~A

 

[Barking Sands]

Lots of logic to this. Sight tubes are pretty fool proof.

Sort of. But implementation of retaining sight tubes actually adds a bit of cost and complexity and makes use a bit unwieldy.

1) If you read my reason for deleting sight tubes of not being able to access valves easily + leaving them open 24/7/365 as unacceptable from a safety standpoint this renders sight tubes as they were installed of little use. Or at least use with some difficulty.

2) I went through the steps to make the new system ABYC compliant so that the valves could be left open 24/7/365. Pressure tested vessels, A1 hose, long bards for double clamping etc. The components chosen should be reliable and really have proven reliable over time.

3) if I add in a T at the valves to retain the sight tubes, I would have to add another two valves per side to shut off the sight tube when not reading it since I do consider it unsafe to leave open at all times. Then again I have to climb down and open valves.

Sight tubes are good and simple. In this case I am swapping sight tubes as a back up indication for putting a stick in the tank as back up. For me this is much easier.

Obviously each scenario and engine room and budget will be different. I racked my brain for a while and this to me was easy and simple as well as something I just wanted to make myself. My engine room and access to tanks is not great. Its a smaller 31 Senator.

 

[Barking Sands]

To clarify what I wrote earlier, your implementation is pretty flawless and
the low-cost float sensors come with gauges, too. A win-win in my opinion.

I may have not been clear in my response either..lol. If the Holley had been tried and true at this point I would have likely used it. I love the product as described. Your suggestion is a good one. Its just so new I am waiting on better feed back.