Coast Guard

[menzies]

Interesting conversation.

The majority of our calls are out of Coast Guard Station Mayport (Jacksonville seems to handle most of Eastern Florida from a control standpoint down to Port Malabar, for some reason including managing Lake Okeechobee). We hear them all the way from Fort Pierce (and sometime more south than that) which is amazing given the distance. In fact we hear them louder than Sector Miami!

We never have an issue with pronunciation or speed of delivery. Sometime the signal can go in and out when way south, but the guys and gals there have it pretty clipped.

 

[psneeld]

USCG regional commands are sectors and usually have an operations or command center and radio room that monitors and controls radio traffic within their area.


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/60/USCG_Sector_Map.jpg


Command Center

The Sector Command Center (SCC) is the center of Sector Operations. It provides 24-hour command, control, coordination, communications, intelligence, sensor analysis, and data mining (C4ISM). The SCC coordinates with other federal, state, and local operations centers, and issues Notices to Mariners, Situation Reports, and maritime security alerts. The SCC displays the current Common Operating Picture (COP) and Common Intelligence Picture (CIP), including a presentation of all vessels, aircraft, communications equipment, and personnel belonging to the Coast Guard and supporting agencies.

 

[Bud]

Yep....it's always someone elses fault....especially the govenment's.


My pretty high up NMFS friend spent a lot of time in academia....maybe tech for everyone helped figure out to help.... but in the mean time while stocks were collapsing...nets were still in the water or where they shouldn't have been even when management said lets try this.



I know as I was in court or deposed enough.

Its not somebody elses fault. The magnuson stevens act is based on scientific threshholds, so science drives the management process. You can't just say as a manager well I think we should t try this... legally you have to have fairly solid science to back up your action. Thats the law. The reauthorization of the act changed some of the legal wording to "Best available science" that helped a little to stimulate faster management action. but it still was dificult because the science wasn't very good at predicting the future which is required for 10 year rebuilding schedules. Basicly the science was derived from samples taken in by towing a trawl net along the bottom for a certain amount of time in different quadrants of the ocean (New England) and they could try to calculate a species stock size from the amount of sample size they caught. They would have to be certain about things like effecency of the net, natural mortality (fish eating fish) growth rates, fishing mortality for 17 main groundfish species. then project that out ten years for the rebuilding schedule. They were overwelmed. they did use models in some cases with some species but some key species did not respond well to models. They could check it by doing retrospective anaylasis, which basicly is using the model with historic data on the species where you already know the results and see how it performs. It is a daunting task. I went on several stock assesment sample survey trips and sat in on the calculation and modeling workshops. Which like I said once they let academia in to participate the results improved. They even started letting academia do some of the sampling (scallop survey}

Bud

Bud

 

[menzies]

USCG regional commands are sectors and usually have an operations or command center and radio room that monitors and controls radio traffic within their area.


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/60/USCG_Sector_Map.jpg


Command Center

The Sector Command Center (SCC) is the center of Sector Operations. It provides 24-hour command, control, coordination, communications, intelligence, sensor analysis, and data mining (C4ISM). The SCC coordinates with other federal, state, and local operations centers, and issues Notices to Mariners, Situation Reports, and maritime security alerts. The SCC displays the current Common Operating Picture (COP) and Common Intelligence Picture (CIP), including a presentation of all vessels, aircraft, communications equipment, and personnel belonging to the Coast Guard and supporting agencies.

That map isn't very well defined - but based on the colors I wonder why Sector JAX has responsibility over Lake O management?

 

[psneeld]

That map isn't very well defined - but based on the colors I wonder why Sector JAX has responsibility over Lake O management?

Pretty sure USCG Sector Miami has Okeechobee as it has USCG Station Ft Pierce.


Though the Lake falls under the Jacksonville ACOE.

 

[SoWhat]

The problem was not the fisherman. Fisherman are suppose to catch fish.

Problem was the fishermen. Carlos Rafael, the Codfather, caught depleted regulated stock like flounder and called it haddock. He owned the largest fishing fleet in NE, and owned the seafood processing plant. They recorded everything as haddock and bought it for pennies. It was then sold as flounder in NYC for dollars using duffle bags of cash.

They finally nailed him. He had to cease all commercial fishing, give up his 30 fishing permits, sell all his boats (25), sell his seafood plant, pay a fine of $3 Mil, and serve 4 years in prison.

He probably falls asleep each night in prison with a smile. He keeps the millions he smuggled to the Azores over the years, and he keeps the profit from selling his boats.

NOAA also nailed all the boat captains that made it all happen. All licenses were suspended. Problem is not NOAA.

 

[Seevee]

Great thread drift....


From communication to fishing problems...


However, interesting.

 

[Bud]

Its true Carlos Rafael is a crook. That does not represent the industry. Noaa subed out there enforcement to the states (they have a contract with every state in New England to enforce fed fish regs) and that was probably a mistake. Local influence and such. They are suppose to have dockside monitoring and at sea observer coverage data that can be reconciled. Crooks like Carlos took advantage. I presently serve on an infractions committee that determines violation penalties for fisheries violations and I try to figure out if the infraction is intentional or not and if it is I go for the maximum. Most infractions are related to confusion of the 3inch reg book.

Bud

bud

 

[MYTraveler]

That opens up a question. Is it legal to record in all jurisdictions. Many states have a one party recording rule which allows pretty much anything. However, the two party states require the consent of both parties of a conversation.

Are there special rules for VHF perhaps?

FCC has jurisdiction, so federal law trumps any conflicting state law. So far as I know, there is no general prohibition against recording VHF traffic (though there are laws and regs pertaining to the use of the recordings).

 

[BandB]

FCC has jurisdiction, so federal law trumps any conflicting state law. So far as I know, there is no general prohibition against recording VHF traffic (though there are laws and regs pertaining to the use of the recordings).

It's open broadcast so no expectation of privacy.

 

[MYTraveler]

It's open broadcast so no expectation of privacy.

Federal law doesn't require an expectation of privacy when one citizen is recording another (4th amendment searches has its own body of law, but applies only to "governmental" searches). For example, it is legal, under federal law, to record any telephone conversation you are party to, even if the other party is unaware and reasonably believes the conversation is private. The point I was trying to make is that state law (which is not uniform and in some cases permits recordings where there is no reasonable expectation of privacy) is not relevant to the question of recording VHF transmissions, since federal law pre-empts.

 

[sunchaser]

There has been consolidation of CC resources to Victoria, so you will hear the same personnel dealing with Mayday situations over most of the BC Coast, whereas in years past, there were stations at various points, Comox, Vancouver, further north. I don't know if Victoria controls the whole coast, but wouldn't be surprised.

It seems Prince Rupert CG radio holds sway until around Cape Caution. Then we hear Victoria.

 

[koliver]

It seems Prince Rupert CG radio holds sway until around Cape Caution. Then we hear Victoria.

Thanks for the clarity, Tom.
On my recent delivery trip we had the VHF on the whole way, to Kitimat, but never heard a peep out of CG radio.

 

[OldDan1943]

Currently listening to WX1 for south FL. So very easily understood.
Very professional.

 

[psneeld]

I think thats the National Weather service and its automated in most places.

 

[OldDan1943]

I think thats the National Weather service and its automated in most places.

I hope it is automated. I would not like to be the person reading totally and then starting at the top.

 

[menzies]

I hope it is automated. I would not like to be the person reading totally and then starting at the top.

They reset the automatic voice about ten years and called him Paul!

 

[OldDan1943]

They reset the automatic voice about ten years and called him Paul!

Thank you Paul.
You are a real professional.

 

[menzies]

You're welcome!

 

[Olebird]

Cobra MRHH500FLTBT Floating VHF Radio with Bluetooth Wireless Technology and Rewind-Say-Again

 

[Seevee]

Cobra MRHH500FLTBT Floating VHF Radio with Bluetooth Wireless Technology and Rewind-Say-Again

I've got a bunch of these, (the 350 and 500) without the rewind, and a great little radio for the money. Floats and waterproof. They are not the quality of an Icom, but must less $. And their service and warranty is outstanding. Had to send two back, quick turnaround.



I used to have a bunch of Icoms (still have a newer one). Better but repair costs a much as the Cobra radio costs..... and they don't last forever, either.


(thread drift)

 

[Olebird]

Somebody was looking for a way to record CG announcements - the "say again feature" records the last transmission and lets you play it back. It's available on a number radios now - some Aircraft radios for copying clearances - very handy at busy airports. Haven't used it for CG broadcast yet. Electronics has come down in cost to the point I don't even try to have it fixed - just toss it and buy the latest gee whiz!

 

[Camden Jack]

The Coast Guard radio operators along the entire east coast need serious voice and diction training. Almost all of them speak too quickly, and mumble words. The female radio operators seem to be much better than than the men.

 

[menzies]

Like Coast Guard Station Mammy!

 

[Wayne]

'Lo All,
Again, a little off topic, but... During the mid to late '60's, Alaskan fishermen were restricted to fish quite a ways offshore from the mouths of salmon producing rivers, (Can't remember exactly how far), but other nations' fishing boats did not comply with our territorial nor state fishing laws and regulations. The main culprits were Japanese fishing fleets with their mother processing ships. They would string nets directly across the mouths of primary salmon rivers, catching everything that tried to go upstream. The Federal Government simply looked away - ignoring the pleas and complaints of the State of Alaska and the fisherman. SO, one fine day, the Governor of Alaska ordered that the captains of all offending ships be arrested and jailed. The howling was immediate, but the Governor stayed the course. IIRC, the captains were fined a a very substantial amount, (?someone?) paid the fines and the captains were released and sent back to Japan. The Federal Government then decided that it was better to enforce the fishing laws than to risk anymore international fiascos. The Governor was everyone's hero that I talked to. I was in the USAF then, and had no connection with the fishing industry, but was appalled at the way the Federal Government and all of its departments ignored the violation of US territorial rights as well as fishing laws.

 

[Comodave]

The Coast Guard radio operators along the entire east coast need serious voice and diction training. Almost all of them speak too quickly, and mumble words. The female radio operators seem to be much better than than the men.

I agree, I have started calling them back and telling them that they are not understandable. Hopefully if a lot of people do this they will get tired of having to deal with it and consciously slow down and try to speak more distinctively.

 

[Bud]

'Lo All,
Again, a little off topic, but... During the mid to late '60's, Alaskan fishermen were restricted to fish quite a ways offshore from the mouths of salmon producing rivers, (Can't remember exactly how far), but other nations' fishing boats did not comply with our territorial nor state fishing laws and regulations. The main culprits were Japanese fishing fleets with their mother processing ships. They would string nets directly across the mouths of primary salmon rivers, catching everything that tried to go upstream. The Federal Government simply looked away - ignoring the pleas and complaints of the State of Alaska and the fisherman. SO, one fine day, the Governor of Alaska ordered that the captains of all offending ships be arrested and jailed. The howling was immediate, but the Governor stayed the course. IIRC, the captains were fined a a very substantial amount, (?someone?) paid the fines and the captains were released and sent back to Japan. The Federal Government then decided that it was better to enforce the fishing laws than to risk anymore international fiascos. The Governor was everyone's hero that I talked to. I was in the USAF then, and had no connection with the fishing industry, but was appalled at the way the Federal Government and all of its departments ignored the violation of US territorial rights as well as fishing laws.

We had similar issues in the late 1960's an more so in the 1970's. (Foreign fishing fleets) We had a Russian factory trawler ship here on Georges Bank for over a year that was 534 ft long with a crew of over 600 guys and they changed crews with a helicopter. Fishing 24-7.
This started the legistative process to change federal fisheries juristiction from 12 miles out to 200 miles. The west coast tuna fishery blocked it for a while because they fished in foreign waters and feared retalatory measures and the west coast does not have the continental shelf the east coast has. But eventually it passed. The damage was done though. That is what stimulated most of the programs to help fisherman. Fisheries eventually started to improve, but then president Carter gave away half of Georges Bank fishing grounds to the Canadians for no reason late 70's or early 80's.

 

[ProMaritime]

Had the same issue with certain air traffic controllers. Seems they would rather deal with two or three "say agains" than to slowly and speak clearly the first time.

 

[Olebird]

Ran into one last night returning from BUYING a boat!!! Finally told him if he wanted me to comply with his instructions he would have to speak SOUTHERN ENGLISH! Otherwise I'll squawk 7600, declare a comm emergency and assume I'm cleared direct - right thru is empty class B airspace! Enough paperwork to keep him busy for a few days!! Jerk slowed down.

 

[OldDan1943]

Quick question regarding channel 22A. Does it except transmissions from boats?
That 'say again' has no meaning unless the CG hears it.