Definition of trawler?

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Soo ... tabs just drag on this KK52. May be just weight.

We had a KK 52 visit every summer at Thorne Bay. Beautiful dark green. They are wider than they look from the side.
I think the KK52 was inspired by lobster boats. Big engines, wide beam and low freeboard aft. It looks great and slides along nicely .. like the modern lobster boats but requires lots of power.

But as to being a trawler she’s probably not heavy heavier than most cruisers. And thus faster than a trawler ... and thus not a trawler.
 
Nomad Willy said:
The recreational trawler is (as weebles implies) a cruiser. I don’t know what they were called before that. But in the early 50’s they were called HEAVY CRUISER. If the word heavy was not used they were called cruisers. All the cabin boats CC made then were called cruisers. From the 18’ OB cruiser (w 25hp) to the big fifty some foot cruisers .. except the 62’ boat that had three 160hp flat head gas engines. It was called a YACHT having nothing to do w the three engines.
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Interesting. My Grandfather served on the HEAVY CRUISER, USS Wichita (CA-45) during WW2. She doesn't look anything like any of the boats people on the forum here own!:D

USS_Wichita_CA-45.jpg
 
The Krogen Express 52 lists a dry weight of 43k lbs from what I can find. Comparing some other, similar boats, on the more trawler-y side, a Grand Banks 49 lists at 60k lbs. On the heavy end, a Nordhavn 52 comes in at a whopping 95k lbs.

But if we look at boats that are meant to be fast in that size range, most clock in a bit lighter than the Krogen. A Regal 53 Sport Bridge comes in at 36k lbs, and Cruisers lists a couple models in that range. The 54 Cantius is 43,600 lbs, but the 50 is only 36k.

So the Krogen 52 is torwards the upper end of the weight range for a boat that planes in that size, but it's also lighter than the trawler types. As expected, it's also slower than most of the other planing boats in that size, as the chart I saw for one with standard twin Yanmar 440s shows it not quite making 20 kts at WOT.
 
rslifkin said:
The Krogen Express 52 lists a dry weight of 43k lbs from what I can find. Comparing some other, similar boats, on the more trawler-y side, a Grand Banks 49 lists at 60k lbs. On the heavy end, a Nordhavn 52 comes in at a whopping 95k lbs.

But if we look at boats that are meant to be fast in that size range, most clock in a bit lighter than the Krogen. A Regal 53 Sport Bridge comes in at 36k lbs, and Cruisers lists a couple models in that range. The 54 Cantius is 43,600 lbs, but the 50 is only 36k.

So the Krogen 52 is torwards the upper end of the weight range for a boat that planes in that size, but it's also lighter than the trawler types. As expected, it's also slower than most of the other planing boats in that size, as the chart I saw for one with standard twin Yanmar 440s shows it not quite making 20 kts at WOT.
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rs

Interesting for you and me in his chat about so called "trawlers" [i.e. pleasure boats - lol] that can't get too much past 8 knots:

It appears we are both [I for sure am] quite pleased with our planing hull twin screw boats that are self sufficient, seaworthy, light enough to plane at good speed and small enough with skinny drafts to go into, out of and to fit most anywhere. And, oh yes... our boats can still act like a "trawler" by going just under hull speed

Having boated for over six decades [gonna be seven decades in 1.3 years :D] I've cruised in just bout every type of pleasure boat design there is. Reason I have the boat we use now is because I love its well rounded capabilities - without breaking the bank!
 
Art said:
rs

Interesting for you and me in his chat about so called "trawlers" [i.e. pleasure boats - lol] that can't get too much past 8 knots:

It appears we are both [I for sure am] quite pleased with our planing hull twin screw boats that are self sufficient, seaworthy, light enough to plane at good speed and small enough with skinny drafts to go into, out of and to fit most anywhere. And, oh yes... our boats can still act like a "trawler" by going just under hull speed

Having boated for over six decades [gonna be seven decades in 1.3 years :D] I've cruised in just bout every type of pleasure boat design there is. Reason I have the boat we use now is because I love its well rounded capabilities - without breaking the bank!
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Yes, the more self sufficient cruisers do a good job of being used as trawlers, but with the ability to go fast. However, I wouldn't say mine is shallow draft. In fresh water, I draw 3'8" to the props with full tanks, so I realistically figure it to be 4 feet. In other words, I draw basically the same as a GB 36, Mainship 350/390 or 400, and only slightly less than a GB 42. Looking around my marina, there are only 3 powerboats with a draft as deep or deeper than mine (a 46 Sunseeker, 48 Cruisers, and a 50-something Hatteras). All of the other powerboats around my size draw a good bit less. Basically, I can't get into anywhere without 5+ feet of water (and once I'm down to 6 feet I'm chewing my fingers off).
 
Marin


Marin


Marin


[shrug]
It worked for Beetlejuice...
 
rslifkin said:
Yes, the more self sufficient cruisers do a good job of being used as trawlers, but with the ability to go fast. However, I wouldn't say mine is shallow draft. In fresh water, I draw 3'8" to the props with full tanks, so I realistically figure it to be 4 feet. In other words, I draw basically the same as a GB 36, Mainship 350/390 or 400, and only slightly less than a GB 42. Looking around my marina, there are only 3 powerboats with a draft as deep or deeper than mine (a 46 Sunseeker, 48 Cruisers, and a 50-something Hatteras). All of the other powerboats around my size draw a good bit less. Basically, I can't get into anywhere without 5+ feet of water (and once I'm down to 6 feet I'm chewing my fingers off).
Click to expand...

Our Tolly - 5th one down on the link [scroll down to Spec Data]: 34" Tri Cabin... 33" [2'9"] draft. I'd say she probably hits 3' + draft when fully loaded. Still feel that yours and my boats are fairly skinny in draft. I too do not go into too shallow water. Have my sounder set at 6' warning peep. When we want to go exploring in low shallows we use our tow behind Crestliner outboard. Tolly stays anchored.

Tolly Classified - Model Selection
 
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Art said:
Our Tolly - 5th one down on the link [scroll down to Spec Data]: 34" Tri Cabin... 33" [2'9"] draft. I'd say she probably hits 3' + draft when fully loaded. Still feel that yours and my boats are fairly skinny in draft. I too do not go into too shallow water. Have my sounder set at 6' warning peep. When we want to go exploring in low shallows we use our tow behind Crestliner outboard. Tolly stays anchored.

Tolly Classified - Model Selection
Click to expand...


Might not hurt to measure for sure. My boat has a published draft of 3 feet even. To get that number, they must have measured in salt water, empty tanks and props not installed. That should yield about 3 feet to the keel, as I measure 3'3" to the keel with full tanks in fresh water. And the props stick down another 5" below the keel.
 
mvweebles said:
Can we all agree that there is no universe in which a trawler has use for trim tabs?
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Depends on the hull. Even on a displacement hull or an SD that can barely exceed hull speed, if the design tends to squat excessively at the upper end of its speed range, it's possible (but not guaranteed) that tabs may help it with either a little lower fuel burn at top speed or just a more comfortable running angle. They're usually not worth the trouble to install unless you're going faster, however.
 
rslifkin said:
Depends on the hull. Even on a displacement hull or an SD that can barely exceed hull speed, if the design tends to squat excessively at the upper end of its speed range, it's possible (but not guaranteed) that tabs may help it with either a little lower fuel burn at top speed or just a more comfortable running angle. They're usually not worth the trouble to install unless you're going faster, however.
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Depends on the hull......exactly. Even GB, what many think to be the gold standard for the trawler look, calls their boats cruisers, not trawlers.

Should I add spray stakes at the bow to the list with trim tabs as a quick way to tell a real trawler?
 
mvweebles said:
Can we all agree that there is no universe in which a trawler has use for trim tabs?
Click to expand...
I thought it was obvious the tabs were suggested for a boat NOT a trawler IMO.

mvweebles said:
Depends on the hull......exactly. Even GB, what many think to be the gold standard for the trawler look, calls their boats cruisers, not trawlers.

Should I add spray stakes at the bow to the list with trim tabs as a quick way to tell a real trawler?
Click to expand...
:confused:
Oh, now you are crossing the line, them are nasty talk. You could consider the advice in post 285. :popcorn:
 
Funny, every GB owner I have met in person considered their nboat a trawler.

They might refer to it in different ways depending on the conversation (like...it's a great cruiser when talking cruising), but still a trawler.
 
psneeld said:
Funny, every GB owner I have met in person considered their nboat a trawler.

They might refer to it in different ways depending on the conversation (like...it's a great cruiser when talking cruising), but still a trawler.
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I consider the GB classic the ultimate example of the trawler look. I'm good.
 
rslifkin said:
Might not hurt to measure for sure. My boat has a published draft of 3 feet even. To get that number, they must have measured in salt water, empty tanks and props not installed. That should yield about 3 feet to the keel, as I measure 3'3" to the keel with full tanks in fresh water. And the props stick down another 5" below the keel.
Click to expand...

I go under with mask, fins and appropriate tools nearly every time when anchored and I swim. Do my own cleaning and anode replacements. Decade ago used yardstick to calc draft. Figure 3' draft on Tolly is good to go! Feel that sounder alarm going off at 6' keeps me safe. Already going real slow whenever getting into shallow water... as the beeper goes off I slow to next to nil; ready to reverse - which I often do!
 
Art, at a six-foot alarm set you must get a lot of alarms. If had such an alarm, I'd set it at one or two feet. But then I probably don't boat at your speed.
 
psneeld said:
Funny, every GB owner I have met in person considered their nboat a trawler.

They might refer to it in different ways depending on the conversation (like...it's a great cruiser when talking cruising), but still a trawler.
Click to expand...
Note their advertising from the 1990s.

Screenshot_20210101-193240.jpeg
 
markpierce said:
Art, at a six-foot alarm set you must get a lot of alarms. If had such an alarm, I'd set it at one or two feet. But then I probably don't boat at your speed.
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I'm assuming Art is talking about an alarm set for 6ft depth, not 6ft under the keel.



On my current chartplotter, the alarm depth doesn't take the transducer offset into account. So the alarm is set for 5ft, which means it alarms in 6.7 feet of water (my display is set for surface depth, not depth below keel). In other words, the alarm means I've got 3 feet until definite bottom contact and it's time to start watching the depth closely.
 
Art said:
I go under with mask, fins and appropriate tools nearly every time when anchored and I swim. Do my own cleaning and anode replacements. Decade ago used yardstick to calc draft. Figure 3' draft on Tolly is good to go! Feel that sounder alarm going off at 6' keeps me safe. Already going real slow whenever getting into shallow water... as the beeper goes off I slow to next to nil; ready to reverse - which I often do!
Click to expand...


6' of WATER DEPTH? or 6' BELOW THE KEEL? or 6' BELOW THE SENDER?
How do you have your depth sounder calibrated? I like to use "water depth", so I can compare to charts, but curious what other people use?:popcorn:
Also curious if people think the boat we're buying is a "Trawler" or not . . .

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1982/custom-beebe-passagemaker-3683500/
 
markpierce said:
Art, at a six-foot alarm set you must get a lot of alarms. If had such an alarm, I'd set it at one or two feet. But then I probably don't boat at your speed.
Click to expand...

Mark

My 6' alarm is set to go off when waterline has 6' to sea bottom. That gives me 3' of water remaining under my props. When the alarm happens I immediately slow to just a couple knots... watching my sounder dial closely. Will let the distance on sounder dial go to 4' [that means only 1' water still under props]. At that point I go into reverse at idle rpm... until reaching deeper water.

Until I'm sure there is 10' or better water depth I stay somewhat below hull speed.

Will hit plane at 16 to 17 knots when I'm certain water depth is and will continue to be plentiful. Most of the time I travel at 6.5 to 7 knots. 7.58 knots is my boat's calculated "hull speed". It is fun and cool though... to get up on plane and make time getting some place when desired! A long day travel running below hull speed can become an easy morning. Tolly handles well in sea conditions.
 
I set all my alarms at the sender.
Have been at 2’ indicated many times w/o any sign of grounding. Out the So. end of the Swinomish channel just before dredging. It was showing 1’ at times.

But I don’t need to use my head as a computer because it’s always set the same. But I can set them all to one of at least 3 levels.
 
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