frequent and very short pump activation

[estauble]

If your exit hose for the bilge pump has a check valve maybe this check valve is failing. This would allow water to run back into the bilge and cause the pump to activate again with just a small amount of bilge water. Cycle repeats.

 

[Ken Ongemach]

since last night I heard some very short pump activation. I thought it is a pump but not sure. it has become more frequent today, every now and then i would hear something is activated, followed by very short flushing sound. it can be heard from both the galley and aft cabin, it sounds closer to the galley.

there is a sump pump in the forward bilge. but I didn't see any motion in the sump pump when the flushing sounds activated. what other pumps or devices are there in the forward bilge that can be activated now and then?

the only change from before is I changed the fuel filters (3 racor and 2 spin-on), tested run the engine for 1 hour yesterday.

If U have a Vac U Flush System, this is a Common Problem. all seal is leaking.. Just put some Vaseline on your finger, open the ball
valve & Smear rhe Vaseline all the way around the seal, to stop the leak. Repeat when necessary.........Ken

 

[Darlin]

Try using a wet vac to vacuum out water and sludge in bilge It works great. Be sure to remove filter from vac before sucking liquids.

 

[paulga]

Where is the ball valve you referred to?

If U have a Vac U Flush System, this is a Common Problem. all seal is leaking.. Just put some Vaseline on your finger, open the ball
valve & Smear rhe Vaseline all the way around the seal, to stop the leak. Repeat when necessary.........Ken

 

[paulga]

Good point thanks.
I read the manual but it doesn't say about removing filters for water

Try using a wet vac to vacuum out water and sludge in bilge It works great. Be sure to remove filter from vac before sucking liquids.

 

[CharlieO.]

Aren't overboard drain lines usually above the water line? I'd be surprised if your sink drains thru the bottom of your hull/keel.

Our sinks drain overboard but our shower drains go to bilge.

Are you sure you don't have a drippy faucet/shower (or other leak) that is causing your bilge pump to cycle?

 

[paulga]

All hand sinks discharge overboard directly, both showers drain through the forward bilge pump. I have confirmed, so this is similar to yours.

The faucets/showers have no dripping. Also tracked the water lines, but found no wet areas. It was likely caused by stuffing box dripping. Last night I checked, the drip rate has reduced to one drop per minute. The bilge short cycling has also reduced to once every few hours. I haven't adjusted the stuffing box yet.

Aren't overboard drain lines usually above the water line? I'd be surprised if your sink drains thru the bottom of your hull/keel.

Our sinks drain overboard but our shower drains go to bilge.

Are you sure you don't have a drippy faucet/shower (or other leak) that is causing your bilge pump to cycle?

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. p. I hesitate to mention this but since it hasn't...Clean out that bilge cavity. One of the pictures shows a mess of black "guck". Aside from contributing to bad odours, it may hide potential pump blocking material (zip tie ends, dropped nuts/bolts or other detritus.


We always had water in our bilge (not a concern to me) BUT it was clean water. You might also think of installing a separate system for your shower water (container with separate pump).

I also notice soap suds in the area in one of your photos. I hope you are not allowing this to pump overboard as it is not terribly friendly to the environment. I found that when cleaning OUR bilges a wet/dry vac to be the best approach whereby any "scum' could be vacuumed up and disposed of safely ashore.

 

[CharlieO.]

All hand sinks discharge overboard directly, both showers drain through the forward bilge pump. I have confirmed, so this is similar to yours.

The faucets/showers have no dripping. Also tracked the water lines, but found no wet areas. It was likely caused by stuffing box dripping. Last night I checked, the drip rate has reduced to one drop per minute. The bilge short cycling has also reduced to once every few hours. I haven't adjusted the stuffing box yet.

I guess I'm still about confused about the larger white hose that is in your bilge. I thought I read that you were thinking it was your sink drain?

In my opinion it would be a good idea to shop vac up all the water there and give it a good cleaning.

I will be adding whale gulper inline pumps or sump boxes for my showers like RTF has shown.

 

[paulga]

I'm considering adding that next summer. I use the marina shower facility. Haven't used the head shower yet.

Please save your project summary and links. That'd be a good example I could follow.

I guess I'm still about confused about the larger white hose that is in your bilge. I thought I read that you were thinking it was your sink drain?

In my opinion it would be a good idea to shop vac up all the water there and give it a good cleaning.

I will be adding whale gulper inline pumps or sump boxes for my showers like RTF has shown.

 

[paulga]

I thought to add an update here. earlier this week I put a half gallon container under the stuffing box to catch the drops, since then I haven't heard the short cycling.

it may take two weeks to top the container up.

 

[Lou_tribal]

Stuffing box dripping is normal, not sure why to put a container there. What is not normal is your pump cycling. In a normal situation your pump should start, dump out bilge water and stop when the level is near zero (not really zero unless you have a dry bilge setup). You should not have the pump cycling every few minutes. If it does it means that either your pump is not able to dump out much water or that the switch is not right or not at the right place.

L

 

[paulga]

At least it stopped the short cycling temporarily. That says without the dripping the pump does not short cycle, right?

Stuffing box dripping is normal, not sure why to put a container there. What is not normal is your pump cycling. In a normal situation your pump should start, dump out bilge water and stop when the level is near zero (not really zero unless you have a dry bilge setup). You should not have the pump cycling every few minutes. If it does it means that either your pump is not able to dump out much water or that the switch is not right or not at the right place.

L

 

[Lou_tribal]

At least it stopped the short cycling temporarily. That says without the dripping the pump does not short cycle, right?

What I mean is that even with your stuffing box is dripping, what is normal to some extend, your pump should not short cycle. As an example mine is triggered and run for about 30 seconds (never really measured time though), enough to clear the bilge near dry, and stops. It takes between 30 minutes to 1 hour to get it triggered again, and my aft bilge is quite small.

L

 

[SteveK]

As an example my bilge pump runs for 2-2.5 minutes once every day for a couple weeks after a boat ride, then it stops, as do the drips.

It was already suggested that the float switch needs to be raised to allow more water to accumulate, get pumped rinse and repeat. As with many other suggestions you choose to ignore and move on to a new issue.

 

[paulga]

yes, that aligned with what i observed, the drip rate slowed down.

not to ignore, the difficulty level is a bit high -- to add shim below the float switch. access is difficult. I saw the detailed steps given by @luna earlier, but i'm not sure about the practice. it would be a good project for later

not sure either if i could insert a piece of wood under the base on the switch side to raise the float a bit

As an example my bilge pump runs for 2-2.5 minutes once every day for a couple weeks after a boat ride, then it stops, as do the drips.

It was already suggested that the float switch needs to be raised to allow more water to accumulate, get pumped rinse and repeat. As with many other suggestions you choose to ignore and move on to a new issue.

 

[SIBERNUT]

Bilge pump screen

On Phelps, the eng rm was flooded half way up the engine. I could not believe how much crap, rotten wood I had to clean out.
Anyway, I took a small square margarine container & punched a bunch of holes in it. Put it over the float switch w a screw.
How's that for cheap?

 

[paulga]

I didn't get it. Is using the butter container the reason that led to pump failure and then the flooding?

On Phelps, the eng rm was flooded half way up the engine. I could not believe how much crap, rotten wood I had to clean out.
Anyway, I took a small square margarine container & punched a bunch of holes in it. Put it over the float switch w a screw.
How's that for cheap?

 

[SIBERNUT]

Bilge

NO- the margarine container acts as a screen to keep ca-ca from getting under the float. Like the screen in the shower sump in the pic

 

[paulga]

it likely is connected to a manual bilge pump located at the starboard side sliding door step which uses a separate through hull.

I guess I'm still about confused about the larger white hose that is in your bilge. I thought I read that you were thinking it was your sink drain?

In my opinion it would be a good idea to shop vac up all the water there and give it a good cleaning.

I will be adding whale gulper inline pumps or sump boxes for my showers like RTF has shown.

 

[paulga]

debris kept the switch stuck open and the pump burnt from continuous running?

where did those water enter into the engine room?

NO- the margarine container acts as a screen to keep ca-ca from getting under the float. Like the screen in the shower sump in the pic

 

[paulga]

I found a spare bilge pump Rule 2000 GPH 7570 LPH and a spare float switch Rule 37A in the aft cabin closet. now I see how the clip works.

paulga.

The url in post #39 shows how to remove the switch from it's base, (likely by pinching the sides of the switch below the pivot point & lifting) thereby exposing the base's mounting fasteners, which understanding that this is a metal plate could very well be small bolts, that are commonly called Machine Screws. If so, there could be nuts on the underside of the plate that you would have to get to in order to remove and reinstall the base of the switch.
From there, fabricate your shim (say 3/4" thick as suggested in post #29 & #32) drill the holes and remount the switch base using the proper length fasteners.

Whether or not this scheme actually works relies entirely on if the volume of water in the top 3/4" of the new level, less the volume of water in the top 3/4" of the old level is enough to compensate for whatever volume of water from the discharge hose was causing the pump to short cycle.

From your pictures of your bilge, I have my doubts.

One thing is for sure, you will have 3/4" more water in your bilge, which to me is a step backwards.

 

[paulga]

does the shower sump connect to the forward bilge pump out hose using some fork fitting, or do you have to locate a spare through hull in the ER (above waterline) to route a hose to?

some through hulls that I haven't seen water come out of are not visible in the ER.

Greetings,
Mr. p. I hesitate to mention this but since it hasn't...Clean out that bilge cavity. One of the pictures shows a mess of black "guck". Aside from contributing to bad odours, it may hide potential pump blocking material (zip tie ends, dropped nuts/bolts or other detritus.


We always had water in our bilge (not a concern to me) BUT it was clean water. You might also think of installing a separate system for your shower water (container with separate pump).

I also notice soap suds in the area in one of your photos. I hope you are not allowing this to pump overboard as it is not terribly friendly to the environment. I found that when cleaning OUR bilges a wet/dry vac to be the best approach whereby any "scum' could be vacuumed up and disposed of safely ashore.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. p. I have no idea how your boat is set up. I don't think putting a "Y" (fork) in an existing line is a good idea.
The unit I posted is stand alone. Meaning shower drain hose(s) connect to the unit and the pump in the unit drains the water when the built in float switch demands such. This is a gravity fill set up meaning it has to be mounted lower than the shower drain(s).


At some point you're going to HAVE get more "up close and personal", with everything, than you seem to have done thus far. Start tracing systems and find out what goes where.

 

[Comodave]

Each pump should have it own through hull. So the sump output should go to a dedicated through hull. Do not Tee it into another pumps hose.