New to the trawler life :-)

[Abeneteau]

Hi all,

My name is Andre and I was drawn to the forum because my wife and I are moving to the trawler life after our catamaran was taken out by lightning. Also was made aware of this site because I was reading some threads on aluminum trawlers. We plan on cruising on the great lakes in a LRC 35 Kanter Al trawler which we are having built in St. Thomas Ontario. The project is coming along nicely and should be ready this June '22. Looking forward to the dialog and knowledge in the forum.

Fair seas

 

[Mako]

Hi Andre, sounds exciting. Didn't see any info on their website about that vessel design. Can you share a GA plan, specs or some progress photos?

 

[Comodave]

Welcome aboard and congrats on your new boat. We will need some photos.

 

[Abeneteau]

Hi Mako,
I will have to see what the builder is willing to release. This is a first off custom design trawler. We will be showing it at an in water boat show whenever that happens....the overall specs are 37' LOA 13' beam skeg hung rudder with the prop. shaft and prop protected by a solid keel plate. Powered by a single Volvo D4 300 designed speeds cruising 9 knt 17 knt WOT. Sorry the website is: http://kantermarine.com/

 

[rgano]

This will be fun for us to follow you along as you get into this boat. Don't think you can possibly bore us with details you just can't hold to yourself anymore. When the wife's eys roll back in her head, we here are just getting started. Welcome aboard!

 

[Abeneteau]

Thank you Comodave please see the post to Mako.

 

[Abeneteau]

Hi Rgano,
Looking forward to sharing with you all. Sounds like my kind of people here I like to geek out over boats!!

 

[Jeff F]

Welcome. The new boat sounds exciting. I hope to be by there this spring to have a bit of work done on my aluminum sailboat. Hopefully they'll allow me a peek!!

Where is your home port?

 

[Abeneteau]

Hi Jeff,

Our homeport is Goderich. I'm sure Manfred will give you a tour. He has some amazing boats on the go. A very nice 65' twin mast being built now. They are super busy which is a good thing!

 

[Moonfish]

Welcome aboard!

 

[Abeneteau]

Thank you Darren,
Looking forward to the trawler life

 

[Abeneteau]

Got the go ahead for pictures.

Here are some pics of the Kanter LRC 35/37. The design was actually mirrored to accomodate for easy access to the engine.

 

[Mako]

Abe I’d like to suggest you do something, for safety sake, with the stove. Having a hot stove in that location will prove risky. Switch its location with the sink, or provide horizontal and vertical grab bars next to it.

 

[Abeneteau]

Hi Mako,
I see what you are saying in the fact that as you enter and take one on the side we could drift into the stove if we lose our balance. There is a bulkhead there (not shown on the diagram) that the microwave and range hood are mounted above (also not shown in the picture). The window is half the size and the sliding door opens to that side as well.

 

[Peter B]

I was thinking Mako's suggestion was more in line with the fact that when cooking, usually done at anchor, if you are 'waked', (not uncommon) the liquids are more likely to slop out with the more violent sideways twisting, that the up and down movement that would occur if swapped with the sink. Also easier to have the cooker gimballed if aligned with the hull. Just a thought..?
Looks a nice boat. Similar size the Clipper 34 we used to have, and our cooker was aligned with the hull, not athwartships. We actually never felt the need for a gimble in that position anyway, where we cruised.

 

[Mako]

I used to think that a gimbaled stove would be helpful for a powerboat at sea. My galley-down was forward of the saloon as well. But even in heavy seas I never had a dangerous situation. The electric elements were high friction (not polished glass) and we didn’t use it in really heavy seas. The microwave was our hero in those situations.

Same for the idea of fiddles on countertops. Nowadays those rubber nonslip mats are fantastic.

Does anyone here believe that gimbals or fiddles are necessary for blue water cruising?

 

[LenBuchanan]

Welcome aboard! Nice looking boat. If you do any cruising later this coming summer, let us all know where you're headed. Will keep a look out for you.

 

[N4061]

welcome

I explored this builder a few years back and familiar with some of the work two of the noted naval architects have done. Looks like you picked a reputable company to work with. The boat resembles the new Nordhavn 41 profile and very sporty for a trawler. Nice beam to LOA ratio and with single engine should allow for a nice ER. Will you have ER access from inside the boat? Would be interested to know the cost to build something like this out of aluminum if you feel comfortable sharing a "ballpark" number, if not no worries.

What power choice did you make and what speeds are you targeting?

John

 

[Abeneteau]

I explored this builder a few years back and familiar with some of the work two of the noted naval architects have done. Looks like you picked a reputable company to work with. The boat resembles the new Nordhavn 41 profile and very sporty for a trawler. Nice beam to LOA ratio and with single engine should allow for a nice ER. Will you have ER access from inside the boat? Would be interested to know the cost to build something like this out of aluminum if you feel comfortable sharing a "ballpark" number, if not no worries.

What power choice did you make and what speeds are you targeting?

John

Hi N4061,

Kanter builds a nice boat and since we are Canadian why not support local industry. Hull is a tapered thickness system fully welded Al plate interior of hull is insulated. The ER is very spacious and access from the saloon via a large access panel. Believe it or not the engine will be the last item to be installed. Specs. are Volvo D4 300 with Michigan prop. speeds est. 9 knt cruising and 17 knt WOT. 15 knt fully laden.
200 ga. diesel 150 ga. water. Our cruising speed TBD depending on fuel cons. Bow/stern thrusters, Raymarine elec. w/ AP, CZONE digital switching full system integration/LiFePo Mastervolt DC equipment with extra MV 200 Amp alt. Installing 720 Watt solar system on the cockpit roof. We will be adding systems like a genny and water maker when our travels bring us south. Price is comparable if not less than a comparable new trawler of that size (just have to be willing to wait for the build time).

 

[Mako]

Abe you may wish to explore an alternate to a stern thruster. A well designed Schilling ocean rudder (aerofoil shaped with fishtail wedge, 45+ degree turn angle) will yield similar stern maneuverability with greater thrust and without having to maintain a thruster.

 

[Abeneteau]

Hi Mako,

Wish I would have joined earlier they are already installed.

 

[N4061]

Canadian Built

I’m glade to read your comment about building in Canada and keeping the jobs local. When I decided to build our latest boat (small sailboat) I made the decision to build in the US and promote local builder’s. Best decision I could have made. When I look at what China has done (stealing Intellectual Property and now aggressive with their military) I ask why should I contribute? I’m glade to see Nordhavn start building in Turkey and look forward to other companies returning to the USA with manufacturing of all types. Why not include boats in the mix?

Just my opinion!
John T

 

[Mako]

John T, that’s a very nice thought. Unfortunately it usually comes down to money. If someone wants a new boat and the choice, on their budget, is between a 30’ boat in America or a 50’ boat from China…. well, reality does weigh in as well.

 

[N4061]

Builers

John T, that’s a very nice thought. Unfortunately it usually comes down to money. If someone wants a new boat and the choice, on their budget, is between a 30’ boat in America or a 50’ boat from China…. well, reality does weigh in as well.

No argument, most people (myself included) will look for the best overall value and follow their pocketbook. This will likely never change, and we all may have to wait until the cost of building in countries rises to point where the US can compete again. Again, I mention Nordhavn teaming with a company in Turkey who can outperform their yard in China so possibly the shift away from China has started. We all know the cost of labor and importing from China has increased significantly over the past 10 years so possibly in another 10 years things to really start balancing out? To help with this shift industry will require more investment in technology and some level of automation allowing for high quality boats be built with less touch labor to drive down costs. This being said I don't see a "corporate" approach which only adds overhead costs, companies need to remain lean. Add in the cost of shipping any boat which doesn't fit inside a container, and you have some significant cost savings to help offset our higher labor costs. Then add in the 25% tariff (I believe this is the current percentage on imported boats) and the cost of shipping US built equipment over to China for installation and everything starts adding up.

I heard of two builders who recently ran the numbers and believe they could build mid-size boats (under 50') in Canada and compete with China. Would be interesting to see how this works out and the overall quality but I would be willing to give one of those builders a try. Recognizing we live in a global economy and that will likely never change I still look forward to some level of shift back to the USA for manufacturing and good paying jobs.

Another milestone which may help jump start this shift may be when the demand for boating slows down (for whatever reason) and the market becomes saturated with newer used boats that drop significantly in price. The impact to many builders will be similar to 2007 with reduced orders and shrinking backlog resulting in the loss of any "bulk buying" discounts on materials, reduce margins while still having to deal with rising labor and transportation costs discussed above. Pricing on new boats built elsewhere may then reach the point where they are no longer less costly than building in the US? Again, I see an opportunity for the smaller to mid-size builders on the near horizon and look forward to their success.

John T.

 

[Mako]

I visited yards in Turkey and China for my new build. I prefer the Chinese (or Vietnamese), but my wife the Turkish yard. However that 25% additional tariff is a killer unless you plan to never bring your boat into American waters.

I’d be curious to know which Canadian yards are making those claims, if you could share. Thanks.

 

[Orrville]

Hello Andrea, You are going to love this forum , can't wait to see your new ship, we met in Goderich. Hopefully spending late August in Lake Huron this coming season. Best of luck with the build.
Terry

 

[Abeneteau]

How are you and I remember you both and of course your boat!

Thanks for the welcome Terry. Looking forward to all members expertise since we are transitioning from a sail boat.

The build is going well and we are dealing with some backlog in parts of course through the supply chain. Engine is supposed to be here by months end....hoping for windows in April. We are planning on heading to the North Channel prob. in the second week of July and staying until late August.

Cheers,

Andre

 

[Abeneteau]

Hi Mako,

Not sure what you mean by Canadian companies making claims? I know the USA, Canada and Mexico have a trade agreement therefore no tarrifs. I believe you pay the tax in the respective province in Canada and apply for a refund once the boat is shipped to the US. Not sure what you have to pay in the USA. We found for what we negotiated for price wise was much more reasonable than what new GRP boats on the current new market cost. The one option we did like was being able to dictate what we wanted in a 100% custom boat to us. On top of all this was the unfortunate fact of not being able to travel to other countries due to COVID restrictions was a huge gamble for us with the ever changing travel rules.