Shipping On Freighter Contract Questions

[lwarden]

Just thought I would add, the boat only holds 300 gallons of fuel, so unless we add capacity at ~1mpg going 20 knots we are going to be going into harbors fairly regularly unless they slow way down. Captain took that into account in his approach to harbor hopping and it seems like a sound plan.

 

[Ka_sea_ta]

The quote to truck the boat down seems really high, I assume you've shopped other trucking companies. Or perhaps a hybrid trip where the boat is trucked from Olympia to Brookings or further south maybe to the delta? Then on it's own bottom to SD.. It's getting close to crab season off the Wa. and Or. coast so it becomes just one more issue bringing the boat down on it's own bottom.

 

[BandB]

I see we’re you got the $10,000 quote motoring down the coast. In order to run days only and harbor hop you will need to run at 25 kts in the winter.

Just food for thought, a delivery skipper who runs hard by day and sleeps in the marina at night all at the owner’s expense is over charging for his services, unless he his doing it at the owners request. When you pay $350 a day, I would expect the skipper to run a 24 hour day.

Perhaps much different on the west coast, but here I wouldn't expect any captain to run a 24 hour day for $350. I would expect a crew of three to do so at a cost of around $800 per day. To run daylight only is not overcharging. It's doing what is mutually agreed on. $350 is really on the low side of captain rates today and definitely isn't enough for a 24 hour day. I ask if those of you in other professions feel your daily rate entitles your employer to make you work 24 hours a day. We're talking professionals.

 

[Hippocampus]

Rarely use a captain except when once when insurance required it or in a jam. Even then they are hired as crew. Have done daily rates in the past but also involved in destination point to point rates. Parties involved agree on a fixed amount to “get her done”. Captain is on his own to decide about weather windows and such. Of course owner covers all boat expenses-food, fuel, harbor fees etc. captain decides on crew numbers and personnel. Often crew includes people who want the blue water experience. Have served as unpaid crew when I was younger. It’s a win/win. You learn stuff and get experience . They get a watch stander.

 

[mvweebles]

Just thought I would add, the boat only holds 300 gallons of fuel, so unless we add capacity at ~1mpg going 20 knots we are going to be going into harbors fairly regularly unless they slow way down. Captain took that into account in his approach to harbor hopping and it seems like a sound plan.

All I can tell you is I moved several 20+ kt boats along the coast - tortoise beats the hare almost every time. Fuel docks have greatly reduced hours along the coast during the non-summer or fishing season periods. Add in transit in/out, short winter days, and it's pretty easy to be jammed up for timing. I once missed a fuel dock in Gray's Harbor by about an hour on a Saturday. Owner was off fishing and didn't return until Monday morning. I was with the owner who was a stuck-up dot-com millionaire type on some sort of Atkins diet and convinced he was the smartest guy in the room. It was a loooong weekend aboard his ultra-sleek Sunseeker 55 Manhatten with a jet ski instead of a dinghy. After that, we held it stead at 8 kts and had an honest 700 nm range instead of 300 or so, which is how we ended up in Gray's Harbor from Port Angeles.

Day hopping means getting into Port by 4pm, which means in many instances detouring from rhumbline course by around 2pm. And hoping that the increased tides and currents of winter don't interfere.

To each their own. But would make sure day hopping actually makes sense when you consider all the variables.

Peter

 

[lwarden]

Rarely use a captain except when once when insurance required it or in a jam. Even then they are hired as crew. Have done daily rates in the past but also involved in destination point to point rates. Parties involved agree on a fixed amount to “get her done”. Captain is on his own to decide about weather windows and such. Of course owner covers all boat expenses-food, fuel, harbor fees etc. captain decides on crew numbers and personnel. Often crew includes people who want the blue water experience. Have served as unpaid crew when I was younger. It’s a win/win. You learn stuff and get experience . They get a watch stander.

If we bring it down on it's own bottom I've considered going along for part of the trip, perhaps down to Astoria. That would take a day, maybe two from Anacortes and be a good jumping off place. This would give me a taste of that part of the coast, how the boat handles any weather and get some pointers from a local. Also, being more familiar with all the systems on the boat if something goes wrong right off the bat would be a good thing. I'm a fairly experienced boater and had my ticket back in the 80's running charter boats and such, but all of my experience is in So Cal and Mexico so firsthand knowledge from someone familiar with that part of the coast would be a plus.

 

[Hippocampus]

+1
Lwarden that’s just plain smart. Never stop learning. And learning while having fun is the best ever.

 

[slowgoesit]

Perhaps much different on the west coast, but here I wouldn't expect any captain to run a 24 hour day for $350. I would expect a crew of three to do so at a cost of around $800 per day. To run daylight only is not overcharging. It's doing what is mutually agreed on. $350 is really on the low side of captain rates today and definitely isn't enough for a 24 hour day. I ask if those of you in other professions feel your daily rate entitles your employer to make you work 24 hours a day. We're talking professionals.

Actually, I worked 24 hours a day for less than $200.00/day. It was by my own choice, and I wasn't putting myself at risk like a delivery captain running a nicely appointed yacht offshore, in deep water.

I must not have been "highly trained". I was just living out of a sleeping bag, bathing with water bottles, eating crap food, flying a helicopter, and often getting my ass shot at by unfriendly "natives", for 12 months at a time . . . . . But that was for only about 4 1/2 years of the 21 years I spent in the U.S. Army. But what do I know?

 

[BandB]

Actually, I worked 24 hours a day for less than $200.00/day. It was by my own choice, and I wasn't putting myself at risk like a delivery captain running a nicely appointed yacht offshore, in deep water.

I must not have been "highly trained". I was just living out of a sleeping bag, bathing with water bottles, eating crap food, flying a helicopter, and often getting my ass shot at by unfriendly "natives", for 12 months at a time . . . . . But that was for only about 4 1/2 years of the 21 years I spent in the U.S. Army. But what do I know?

That's all well and good, but has nothing to do with the market rate for delivery captains.

 

[slowgoesit]

That's all well and good, but has nothing to do with the market rate for delivery captains.

You're totally correct, but you miss the point. I was responding to the question you asked about "other professions", as quoted below.

I ask if those of you in other professions feel your daily rate entitles your employer to make you work 24 hours a day. We're talking professionals.

 

[BandB]

You're totally correct, but you miss the point. I was responding to the question you asked about "other professions", as quoted below.

Ok.....I wasn't thinking military or indentured servitude.....

 

[slowgoesit]

Ok.....I wasn't thinking military or indentured servitude.....

Totally agree! On my Wife telling a friend that I had orders to deploy to the sandbox for a third tour, her friend replied, "Well, your Husband just needs to tell them he won't go!" . . . . She had absolutely no idea . . .

Sorry for the thread drift, now back to our regularly scheduled programming.

 

[lwarden]

Just thought I would put a bow on this thread since I like to see a resolution to a thread or question.

We ended up after all this going with trucking the boat down. After a lot of phone calls to Dudley trucking I gave up and called Associated again. They came back with a more reasonable quote of about $14,500 all the way from Anacortes to San Diego which I thought was fair. It took two days to prep the boat and a full day to clean and set it up again. There was another $1,000 in loading and unloading costs and misc. items. Boat measured 15'-4" high when loaded so it needed a pole car up front and a pilot in back. The driver was very experienced in heavy hauling but was new to loading boats so getting it loaded took much longer than expected. Nevertheless, the boat came down without a scratch or any damage. The only thing that happened was a spill of a gallon and half of dirty oil in the bilge that leaked from a cheap Walmart oil drain pan which tipped over in shipping. My fault and not a big deal to clean up.

Overall I was very happy with Associated and I think it was by far the best solution to moving the boat. The folks at North Harbor Diesel who loaded it did a great job and were very patient with the new driver as he tried different setups to get the boat supported.

Thanks everyone for your input, it was very helpful. We are happy to have the boat in San Diego but we already miss the PNW.

Laurence

 

[Sailor of Fortune]

Glad it worked out for you! Now time to enjoy it

 

[Fletcher500]

That price sounds very good for the distance covered. I would have thought it would have been closer to $20K.

 

[balder8]

Question for those of you who have done shipments of yachts on transport ships such as Seven Star, United, DYT etc.

In reading through the contract it appears they assume absolutely no liability at all. The contract I received from one of the shippers is very much for CYA of the shipper and gives no protection to the yacht owner at all. If they drop the boat out of the slings the slings it's on the owner. If they don't lash it down or set the supports correctly and the boat gets damaged, it's on the owner. Etc, etc.

Are you expected to assume all the liability for this? In all my years in business I have never seen such a lopsided contract.

Am I missing something, or am I just that naive?

I appreciate any input from others who have done this form of transport as it's all new to me and pretty unsettling.

Thanks,

You are not naive. And you didn't forget something. I received also a proposal form, two years ago in Europe when considering shipping my trawler from Gibraltar to the Carib.Same story, I discovered there was no insurance at all and that I have to subscribe apart which generated a serious extra cost to a quite expansive quote.
After that, I decided to fill my tanks and steer to Canary islands, directly,"on my keel"!