Gauge question

[Eli27]

Good evening all. About to set out on my maiden voyage back home, maine to RI. One thing on the bucket list was temp gauge accuracy. My lower helm was reading high and pretty much all over the place. (By the way, 1979 albin 36 trawler)

Last night I installed a new gauge hoping it might work but obviously it didn't. On the bridge it was the same but one day I noticed my oil pressure was around 40psi on the bridge and the lower helm again was around 20 but kinda all over as well.

I can go on for 10 more paragraphs but I'm not. Today I had the idea of swapping the oil pressure and temp gauges just because I knew the oil pressure was better. I noticed the temp gauge seemed a bit more accurate on the bridge as well.

Letting the engine warm up it seemed the bridge was working. I went down to the engine room and put a ir gun on the engine and temp was within 10degrees. I was soooooo happy. I could swap the gauges and be all set.

Here is where it gets "phunny",,,, I walked by the lower helm and the lower gauges were almost identical to the bridge.

So,,, here is my question. Do both keys need to be in the on position for the gauges to read properly? By both keys I mean lower helm and flybridge. If I turn the bridge key off they are not accurate.

When I messed with the temp gauge last night I noticed on the oil pressure gauge it said "dual gauge",,, something.

Does anyone else have the same set up? Is it normal? I'm thinking it is because both gauges report accurate at least on the temp side,, within 5 degrees if what the IR gun shows

As always, thanks

 

[SteveK]

The meer action of swapping may have fixed a bad connection that looked good. I do not think both upper and lower keys must be 'on', that said if they are and you see a difference it may lead to where there is a loose connection solved by applying power from two locations.

 

[Comodave]

Don’t know about your ket situation but it sounds like loose or bad connections in the gauges. I would take all the connections apart and clean them. If that doesn’t fix the problem then it may be a bad ground in the gauges.

 

[Northern Spy]

Usually a ground issue. Gauges are fussy about good grounds.

 

[Barking Sands]

Depends on how its wired. If your upper helm key turns off the gauges then it will likely be wrong unless both are powered. The senders come in single or dual station. If dual station and you shut down one station you'll get half value.

When I redid my upper and lower helms I had the choice to either power both helms from the lower key or have each key power its associated helm power.

 

[Eli27]

Depends on how its wired. If your upper helm key turns off the gauges then it will likely be wrong unless both are powered. The senders come in single or dual station. If dual station and you shut down one station you'll get half value.

When I redid my upper and lower helms I had the choice to either power both helms from the lower key or have each key power its associated helm power.

This is what it seems to be. I checked powers and grounds ar both stations across both gauges and were fine. And I load tested the the terminals with a 1 amp light and it was bright.

The oil gauge at the lower helm had a print on it that said dual gauge. I believe it's wired this way. Not happy but I have proper readings on the 2 most important readings of a lehman engine,,,, oil pressure and temperature.

Dumb design if you ask me but as long as it works.

 

[Barking Sands]

This is what it seems to be. I checked powers and grounds ar both stations across both gauges and were fine. And I load tested the the terminals with a 1 amp light and it was bright.

The oil gauge at the lower helm had a print on it that said dual gauge. I believe it's wired this way. Not happy but I have proper readings on the 2 most important readings of a lehman engine,,,, oil pressure and temperature.

Dumb design if you ask me but as long as it works.

It wouldnt take much effort to change it over. On mine I can just pull the power wire for the upper helm and move it to the output of the lower helm key switch. Then either keep the upper key on or by pass the key

 

[PierreR]

You are describing a similar problem that I have. I never thought about the two key situation and have not gotten into finding a solution yet. I will definitely check the double key thing.

 

[SteveK]

Upper and lower gauges come to life whether I use upper or lower keys by themselves.

 

[Eli27]

It wouldnt take much effort to change it over. On mine I can just pull the power wire for the upper helm and move it to the output of the lower helm key switch. Then either keep the upper key on or by pass the key

That's actually how it's wired. The upper helm will only come on if the lower helm is on. Leaving the upper key in the on position takes care of it all.

I spent over a day trying to figure this out ? but at least I got gauges that work and are accurate.

 

[Barking Sands]

That's actually how it's wired. The upper helm will only come on if the lower helm is on. Leaving the upper key in the on position takes care of it all.

I spent over a day trying to figure this out ? but at least I got gauges that work and are accurate.

There was some discussion here a while back on this. I think it was a thread I started, trying to decide what is better:

Seperate keys upper and lower that can power the panel and start and stop the engines and shut down the warning buzzer.

or

Arm everything from the lower.

I think there was some discussion about locks and shutting down engines from the lower helm only vs upper helm or both, annoying buzzers left on in various configurations etc.

I actually set mine up the way it is now. I can start and stop from either position with either helm powered by its associated key. Shutting down that helm with the key also silences the buzzer at that helm. The only downside is the gauges for water temp and oil pressure not being accurate unless both keys are on, which is how I have operated so far.
I just have to be aware of the gauge issue. I could probably wire it differently. But it has not been an issue.

I honestly cant even remember the discussion and why I wired it that way, but it made sense at the time

 

[Eli27]

There was some discussion here a while back on this. I think it was a thread I started, trying to decide what is better:

Seperate keys upper and lower that can power the panel and start and stop the engines and shut down the warning buzzer.

or

Arm everything from the lower.

I think there was some discussion about locks and shutting down engines from the lower helm only vs upper helm or both, annoying buzzers left on in various configurations etc.

I actually set mine up the way it is now. I can start and stop from either position with either helm powered by its associated key. Shutting down that helm with the key also silences the buzzer at that helm. The only downside is the gauges for water temp and oil pressure not being accurate unless both keys are on, which is how I have operated so far.
I just have to be aware of the gauge issue. I could probably wire it differently. But it has not been an issue.

I honestly cant even remember the discussion and why I wired it that way, but it made sense at the time

And this is EXACTLY how mine is wired. I don't know what you were thinking either. If you rewired with existing gauges then I totally see it and I probably would of done the same. But if you went all out and replaced everything,,,, I'd scratch your head too!

But either way,,,, I've got good gauges.

I took my first real trip yesterday to finish my first of a 2 day trip back home. Newburyport Ma to Sandwich MA. It felt real good being able to sit at the helm and drive the boat while observing my accurate engine gauges. I thought I was going to be opening the hatch every 10 minutes to take a temp reading. (I did,,,, but only 2 times on a 10hr trip) I was super happy about that.

 

[Barking Sands]

And this is EXACTLY how mine is wired. I don't know what you were thinking either. If you rewired with existing gauges then I totally see it and I probably would of done the same. But if you went all out and replaced everything,,,, I'd scratch your head too!

But either way,,,, I've got good gauges.

Lol...I did replace everything. And added some things. The only miscalculation was wiring the upper gauges through the upper key switch. But I have found I just leave the upper key on at all times.

It could easily be rearanged with a single wire from the upper key input power prior to keyed switch, around the key and to the oil press and water temp gauges. But it just hasnt been a problem since in practice, leaving the key on everything works great.

If I start going through locks routinely and end up not liking tbe configutation ill just change it. I drew diagrams for everything but I still have the basic layout in my memory. In another year or two...probably not so much...lol.

 

[Barking Sands]

I keep thinking about the reasons I wired it this way. One was silencing the upper buzzer in a way I wouldnt forget its silenced and two...so no one can start the boat from the upper helm without the locked up lower helm key on.

I just remembered I had it so each helm was independent for starting the engine. But I didnt like that so made the upper helm power go through the lower key.

Seems I cant remember much..lol.

 

[Barking Sands]

And this is EXACTLY how mine is wired. I don't know what you were thinking either. If you rewired with existing gauges then I totally see it and I probably would of done the same. But if you went all out and replaced everything,,,, I'd scratch your head too!

But either way,,,, I've got good gauges.

Lol...I did replace everything. And added some things. The only miscalculation was wiring the upper gauges through the upper key switch. But I have found I just leave the upper key on at all times.

It could easily be rearanged with a single wire from the upper key power prior to keyed switch around the key and to the oil press and water temp gauges. But it just hasnt been a problem since in practice, leaving the key on everything works great.

If I start going through locks routinely and end up not liking tbe configutation ill just change it. I drew diagrams for everything but I still have the basic layout in my memory. In another year or two...probably not so much...lol.

Anyways here are my upper and lower helm gauges completely redone. Its not real fancy..but you should have seen the originals..lol

https://youtu.be/8GBA1fjiGQo?si=7rCrNaBslM0tx3tx

 

[Eli27]

Lol...I did replace everything. And added some things. The only miscalculation was wiring the upper gauges through the upper key switch. But I have found I just leave the upper key on at all times.

It could easily be rearanged with a single wire from the upper key power prior to keyed switch around the key and to the oil press and water temp gauges. But it just hasnt been a problem since in practice, leaving the key on everything works great.

If I start going through locks routinely and end up not liking tbe configutation ill just change it. I drew diagrams for everything but I still have the basic layout in my memory. In another year or two...probably not so much...lol.

Anyways here are my upper and lower helm gauges completely redone. Its not real fancy..but you should have seen the originals..lol

https://youtu.be/8GBA1fjiGQo?si=7rCrNaBslM0tx3tx

That's awesome! I'm happy that mine work. The only problem child is the RPM gauges. They are not reading at all. I'm not concerned with it at this point. My main concern is getting her back home to RI and getting her out.

I'm gonna spend the winter and completely reorganize the through hulls. My plan is to relaunch in the spring with everything under the water line replaces with new and running gear checked.

Next yr when she goes in I want piece of mind of the boat not sinking,,, kinda like it is right now. Bilge pump turns on every couple hrs.

I had my heart set on a Grand Banks and I all I can say is im glad I didn't go that route. The Albin 36 is such a roomier boat. Don't get me wrong,, GBs have that look but you can't deny they lack in space. I can safely say I have more room on my Albin 36 than a 42 GB. And that makes me happy!