Just Bought a Marine Trader 40

[FlyNavy]

Annapolis MT 40

Thanks for the replies, this forum has already been helpful. This MT 40 has the dual cabin layout with twin Lehmans. It needs lots of work on the salon bulkheads and flybridge deck - water has leaked from the corners next to the benches down into the salon - so I will replace the wood and install two drain holes on each side that port onto the main deck below. It is now docked at my home on the Severn River in Crownsville, MD just above Round Bay. My goal is to have most of the heavy work done by the end of this summer. Keep the tips coming please and I will keep everyone up to date on the restoration. BTW, I go by Scott and can be reached at sabernar@syr.edu.

 

[BillMFl]

Scott, when you get the chance, check both sides of the fly bridge where it attaches to the cabin wall. Mine has a U shaped edge that is supposed to drain towards the aft, but can be clogged up with dirt and debris allowing water to back up and spill down the cabin interior. Hard to reach but I ran a vacumn cleaner hose down the gap to clean it out and then drilled additional weep holes so that rain water could exit down the cabin exterior.

 

[Dougcole]

That was a gift from Doug! With copper prices so high, that old wire returns a king's ransom at the recycling centers.

See John? I'm always looking out for you .

Doug

 

[bfloyd4445]

Well, after 15 years as a sailor and 5 years living on a sailboat, I have finally moved to a trawler (yeah, ALL the guys in the marina have told me all the jokes......BUT I love the room and comfort )

Anyway, she needs some cosmetic work as she has been sort of neglected for a few years.

A 1978 Marine Trader 40 aft cabin.

So, what I really need is a handbook on this boat. Anyone know where/how I might get a hold of one?

Over the next few years I will go through every system and bring them up to speed (and also consider the best use of each)......and to solve some leak issues

Anyway, thank you for your help.

Tim

That was almost a month ago so by now you must have at least taken her to .......some where?? We're dieing to hear your first impression

 

[Ken n Anna]

ex sailors as well...

We too used to live and travel in our sailboat and have switched to a 1977 Marine Trader 40'... miss the sailing, but LOVE The space! My husband really enjoys the space to work in engine room (although im guessing I will end up down there soon- in which case, Im sure I will like the extra space as well) We just acquired our MT about 3 weeks ago and of course are going through it methodically. However we too were hoping to find an owners manual that covered where the original hoses, exhaust, holding tanks, etc... were located... many upgrades over the years and would like to have a base to work of off.. any info or site links would be greatly appreciated...
Thanks a bunch!

Dragonflies crew
Ken n Anna

 

[BillMFl]

We too used to live and travel in our sailboat and have switched to a 1977 Marine Trader 40'... miss the sailing, but LOVE The space! My husband really enjoys the space to work in engine room (although im guessing I will end up down there soon- in which case, Im sure I will like the extra space as well) We just acquired our MT about 3 weeks ago and of course are going through it methodically. However we too were hoping to find an owners manual that covered where the original hoses, exhaust, holding tanks, etc... were located... many upgrades over the years and would like to have a base to work of off.. any info or site links would be greatly appreciated...
Thanks a bunch!

Dragonflies crew
Ken n Anna

Google, google and google some more. Try different variations of your make/model/year for both the boat and engines. Also I found it useful to make a drawing of my hull as though I was viewing it from a birds eye. looking down and all the decks and floors were transparent. I then crawied into every nook and crany, opened every hatch, access panel, etc and marked the exact location of all tanks (fuel, holding, fresh, and their dimensions) thru hull fittings, water lines, etc. I used the first rough draft to make a nice clean drawing that approximated their true location and size. I then labeled each item on the drawing and now have an easy quick reference for the exact location of each and everyone. From the outside, I know every drain port's location and the lines/valves etc connected to it. The hard part is viewing the location of lines that disappear thru bulkheads and such but often making a positive id of one helps to narrow down and help id others near it. Turning on water flow thru lines really helps too as you can feel vibration or temp changes. By activating one single line, valve, function at a time you can trace and identify all the key components. Now if I require assistance from a mechanic I can whip out my diagram and instantly show the location etc. I color coded the tanks and supply/drain lines too which again helps for quick and easy reference to which drain port or thru hull valve a given line is connected to. The electrical system has been harder, but by using a test meter I now know which batteries (4) are served by each of the two chargers. Making another diagram of the boats interior showing the location of all the switches, wall outlets, light fixtures, etc and then selectively turning on/off breakers and switches will give you a diagram of both your 12vdc and 110vac wiring schematic. Tracing the actual route of the individual wires and cables is way too complicated and access way too restricted to be practical in most cases. However, if you do any interior modifications that open up interior structures its an opportunity to make notes on what is hidden there

 

[grahamdouglass]

I bought a Marine Trader 41 in 2007

My Marine Trader 41, measuring 42' from my Anchor to my swim grid looks identical to a Defever 42. From the literature I have read it seams the Chinese would name their trawler just about anything. The one exception is probably American Marine with their Grand Banks. Issues like rotted wood, old systems, unavailable parts are just basic stuff. My advice, which I did not follow, is don't start throwing a bunch of money at it. Use it, go boating. Have fun with it.

Graham
M/V Summer Wind 1
Ladner, B.C., Canada

 

[Golden Gate 37]

Golden Gate 37

Gentle people

Maybe this is not the most approprite thread as I own a Golden Gate 37 - Not a MT, but I think the challenges are similar

I bought my trawler last summer, and the previous owner had done a fantastic job restoring it from a near-wreck state.

Still a lot of work to be done, and I started removing old and useless equipment, and found NO wiring or hosings had been removed when replaced... This is a typical problem when you dont have to concider space an issue

So I removed a lot of old junk, like 3 AC`s!!! (Really not needed here in Norway anyway), and a lot of old wiring and equipment, espescially I got rid of all 110v gear.
I then reinstalled new gear, reconfigured the genset to 240v and have now just about "finished" the restoration (Some job on the fly and outside still awaits me when she comes loose from the ice). "Finished" will always be a joke right? All boatowners know you can never get finished, there will always be something to repair, or a new gadget to install

As previously mentioned by others Google is your best friend in the search of documentation. I found almost all necessary info on my gear, you just got to find serial numbers and such info to be sure you dont get hold of info outdated or relating to another product

A lot of relevant info can be found on Grand Banks official site, but I prefer the GB owners site - check it out, its an awesome amount of useful information to be found!

I still fancy the idea to make a site to gather such documentation, and will gladly contribute with my findings. But in these "dotcom" days there will always be a parasite claiming his wealth on work done by others - right?

So, if I should contribute to such a site I would prefer it to be a part of the trawler forum or an other open solution

 

[Ben]

Hi All - also the owner of a Marine Trader and have thoroughly enjoyed everyone's comments and observations! Have an ADC 136N motor which is American Diesel's Ford Lehman refit.

I am water-savvy, but systems-impaired. Common themes -
1. Lehman engine a tank. My engine has survived my ineptitude so far, and I keep learning. Hopefully won't blow myself up before becoming competent.

2. Windows and wood, not so good. I will likely be yanking and replacing many of mine next season. Have done a bit of repair this year.

3. Wiring. Dead wires from 20 years ago. Once I get some time (I'm not retired and also taking some night school this year), I'd like to modernize the electric layout of the boat. The more I learn the electrics, the simpler they seem. Now I just need to reach them which are tucked away in every crevice!! Pulling everything out and starting from scratch is my conceptual best option. Probably also next season. Everything is old, so it will likely fail at a bad time anyway. I just need to design well sub-panels (thinking fly bridge and forward galley) from the main panel.

Tim, I'm in Oriental at Pecan Grove, same as TomB and Bess, stop on by and say hello if you get the chance. We'll be there boat show weekend.

Hope to keep this thread live, learning a lot from everyone's comments!

 

[SeaMoose]

Welcome to the wonderful world of old Taiwanese Trawlers.

Having worked on my MT for years and years the best advice I can give you is that if you find spots where the plywood core has rotted, replace it in BIG sections. Initially I spent hours "scarfing" small sections only to realize later that it was just as easy to replace an entire wall. I'm at about 60% new boat at this point.

The CHB forum on Yahoo is a good resource, as is MTOA. Work on the boat long enough, and you'll meet every DIY person in the marina.

I do have a wiring diagram for the 34 which at least identifies the circuits, other than that it's not much help.

 

[Tangler]

leak problems?

Mine is called a C&L Puget and there does not seem to be many by that name but it is a taiwanese hull 1977 and my research has indicated it was a member of that family of trawlers to which MT belonged also. this is my 4th year and leaks from the upper deck have been driving me nuts to the point where this year I decided to fix it once and for all!! I determined that the teak deck was only part of the problem. The main problem was the flying bridge where it is mounted to the upper deck. There is a board that runs around the front and along the arms of the bridge that I think has been letting water in since it was built. It had been recaulked many times over the years but unsucessfully. I had water around my windows too...it came from the top deck, not the window frame. I suggest you crawl right inside the bridge cavity during a heavy rain and look for leaks. Most trawlers from that era were built similarly and I suspect most leaks originate here and until that is fixed you wont stop water coming in. Its all fixable and must be done if the boat is to last another 35 years.

 

[capttom09]

[I determined that the teak deck was only part of the problem. The main problem was the flying bridge where it is mounted to the upper deck. There is a board that runs around the front and along the arms of the bridge that I think has been letting water in since it was built. ]

Just finished removing the wood brow, epoxied with West system epoxy, faired, painted, and no more leaks! Quite a job, but worth it.
New headliner was next.
Have pictures if you are interested.
Cheers,
Capt Tom
MT38 Carina
Treasure Island, Fl

 

[BillMFl]

[I determined that the teak deck was only part of the problem. The main problem was the flying bridge where it is mounted to the upper deck. There is a board that runs around the front and along the arms of the bridge that I think has been letting water in since it was built. ]

Just finished removing the wood brow, epoxied with West system epoxy, faired, painted, and no more leaks! Quite a job, but worth it.
New headliner was next.
Have pictures if you are interested.
Cheers,
Capt Tom
MT38 Carina
Treasure Island, Fl

Hey there Capt Tom. I'm about an hour away in North Tampa. I'm chasing one last small leak that trickles down the galley dinette wall when there is a heavy rain. There are outside drain holes in that trim "brow" that runs aft above the galley windows. I have unplugged it several times (chunks of rotted wood) and crawled inside the flybridge locker to try and vacumn debris (not easy for a 6' tall person, haha). Would like to see or exchange pics. Not sure I wiuld tackle that job, but might have it done by our yard.

 

[Tangler]

the water found at my galley window and other places originated in the interior of the Fbridge through that brow board and then pooled inside until it reached a hole where wires traversed down to the main cabin. other holes allowed the water to travel. I experienced the same thing when i worked in the rv industry. the leak is at one end but the water may not show up at that spot but yards away from there doing damage all along the way.

 

[capttom09]

Don't know how to attach pics to a posted message, but send me your e-mail and I'll forward pics to you.
Cheers, Capt Tom

 

[Ben]

the water found at my galley window and other places originated in the interior of the Fbridge through that brow board and then pooled inside until it reached a hole where wires traversed down to the main cabin. other holes allowed the water to travel. I experienced the same thing when i worked in the rv industry. the leak is at one end but the water may not show up at that spot but yards away from there doing damage all along the way.

I just replaced a chunk of wood in my cabin, coating around the window liberally with silicone. A better plan in the future will be to yank the whole wall, but it's clean and dry now until I replace the windows probably next year. Good luck with your water. I know I'm learning a lot fixing my walls.

 

[Ruthless]

Tim, Which marina are you in? We are coming to new bern Wed-Fri (by land) staying at the doubletree, looking for winterhavens for next year for the boat. If we see you we'll give you a shout.

 

[BruceK]

The leaking "eyebrow"molding is definitely not restricted to MTs.
Imagine your boat lying head to 30 mph wind in driving rain, where does the water go after it enters via the defect? A long way, causing rot every inch.

 

[Ben]

Tim, Which marina are you in? We are coming to new bern Wed-Fri (by land) staying at the doubletree, looking for winterhavens for next year for the boat. If we see you we'll give you a shout.

Are you looking in the Neuse? Wet or dry? If wet New Bern Grand is very good due to its proximity to the town. New Bern is very pleasant. If you want further down river, closer to other sites, Pecan Grove is modern and well-protected. We really like Whittaker Pointe because it's a great facility, and the dockmaster Ashley is top notch, but the protection from the south westerlies is minimal.

Good luck!

 

[Ruthless]

Are you looking in the Neuse? Wet or dry? If wet New Bern Grand is very good due to its proximity to the town. New Bern is very pleasant. If you want further down river, closer to other sites, Pecan Grove is modern and well-protected. We really like Whittaker Pointe because it's a great facility, and the dockmaster Ashley is top notch, but the protection from the south westerlies is minimal.

Good luck!

We are planning to spend Nov and Dec in the New Bern area and cruise to SC/Ga area for Jan-March. Hubby is retired airline so we can fly in and out for long weekends etc since I am still working. We winterized in the slip this year and it was a pain, the thought of winter getaway whenever we want seems like a better plan. Last winter we were in Manteo and it was a nice mild winter but more south is better.

 

[Ben]

We are planning to spend Nov and Dec in the New Bern area and cruise to SC/Ga area for Jan-March. Hubby is retired airline so we can fly in and out for long weekends etc since I am still working. We winterized in the slip this year and it was a pain, the thought of winter getaway whenever we want seems like a better plan. Last winter we were in Manteo and it was a nice mild winter but more south is better.

New Bern is good. Fresh water. Hardware store you can walk to. About 10 good restaurants you can walk to. Floating docks at the marina.

 

[Ruthless]

New Bern is good. Fresh water. Hardware store you can walk to. About 10 good restaurants you can walk to. Floating docks at the marina.

We loved it! Liked the downtown location. Went to Oriental for lunch.

 

[Ben]

We loved it! Liked the downtown location. Went to Oriental for lunch.

Lots of good food places (something like 10 in walking distance) in New Bern and a few ( 3 or 4) good ones in Oriental. You'll enjoy. Very relaxing areas both of them.

 

[obthomas]

Hi I am a new member here and own a 1984 43' Marine Trader LaBelle. Like you it was my first trawler but have owned for three years now. The best way to learn about your boat is to explore it. I started in the engine room. I have Volvo TAMD40B's. You can get free online service manual if you search. I started by cleaning the bilges, first the engine room, then wherever else I had access. There were years of accumulated tie wraps, hose clamps, and other debris. I then manually tested each bilge pump (3) location. Replaced several and cut and recrimped wiring so all functioned perfectly. Checked all hoses and belts and hose clamps on the engines and on any thru hull fittings. Opened and closed all thru hull valves to make sure they functioned properly. Two were frozen open, badly corroded and were replaced. My boat has two large stainless steel fresh water tanks. Each has a good sized access port. Open and inspect yours! You will be surprised what might be growing in there. I drained both of mine, manually scrubbed them with detergent and bleach combo (there was greenish brown slime floating in both). I then refilled the tanks with fresh water and added bleach to sanitize the tanks and all lines. Engines had low hours and started/ran fine. I change oil, filter and air filter every season. The boat came with Racors with sight bowls and fuel looked clean, some dark particles, probably algea, but not too bad. Added algaecide and fuel conditioner and ran down old fuel before refilling tanks. Changed Racor filters at end of first season and they have stayed clean since. Your fresh water lines are likely to be the old grey colored plastic that are no longer readily available. Save any lengths you remove (and also any fittings) to reuse for repairs to other sections. I replaced my water heater with a ten gallon residential style at a fraction of the cost of a marine grade water heater. It will probably last as long as I will (I'm 70). The previous owner had installed an ElectroSan direct discharge head in the master bath (lucky me) but the foreward head was a rusted mess so I tore it out an replaced it with a porta potty that so far has never been used. I had numerous small water leaks around widows, portholes, and hatches. New seals and caulking took care of that. I have had three very enjoyable seasons with no major problems until Mrs Captain was at the helm and snagged a large very heavy lobster trap and bent the port shaft. This opened Pandora's box. All the Cutlass bearings were worn, the shafts were worn and the drive saver couplers were in bad shape. So my first expensive repair is now under way. We live aboard for weeks at a time, mostly in a full service marina so we have a full size 110v Refig/freezer combo in the galley. I tore out a shabby looking propane stove/oven and removed the propane tank too. I don't like propane on a boat. We use the microwave, electric skillet, crock pot and barbeque grill for cooking. So thats it for starters. I have emptied and cleaned every compartment, nook and cranny. We have a walk around queen bed in MBR and I use a small humidifier to eliminate condensation and mildew. The boat rides very smoothly. A fine entry, and hard chines combine for a smooth ride and very little roll. The electrical system has not been a problem so far but I have spent a lot of time tripping switches and breakers to be sure of what they turn on and off. If you haven't already bought insurance, you will likely have to get an insurance survey, and it will point out things that need attention. My list was rather long but easily handled myself. Good luck and feel free to ask any questions.

I'm a new member and it is almost as if I wrote the passage above. I bought a new to me 40 foot 1985 MT Labelle Sundeck 3 years ago and am only now slowing down with the refits.

 

[tallswede]

There is a Marine Trader 40 Europa style trawler for sale in my local marina. Looks to be in decent shape. Has a single Ford Lehman. I'm thinking of going to look at it this weekend with my wife. This would be a major step up in size for me as the largest boat I've owned was a 27' Chris Craft Constellation mahogany boat I restored 20 years ago. I think I have a handle on what to look for though any tips would be nice if you have them. I'm sure if we progress and actually consider buying a survey will be needed. Can anyone give me a ballpark number for what insurance on a boat of this size runs? Just want to get a few ducks in a row first. I probably ought to consider selling off some of my fleet first LOL. They are asking $34K for it, how does that sound? Thanks.

Kevin

 

[obthomas]

If the asking is $34K for a 40 footer it must be a fixer upper. Insurance will be around $1K per year. The problem with an old boat is you can put another $30k in fixing it up and at the end of the day you got a $60K boat or worse a $45K boat. Good luck and take your time and reflect before you buy. Its a big deal.

 

[SeaMoose]

Agreed, sounds too good to be true.

Take a flashlight and look at the tops of the fuel tanks for rust.

Crawl around the decks, and gently push on the sides of the house right above the decks. My expectation is that it will be soft, and if you rap on it with your knuckles it will return a dull thud, not a solid one. This means the core underneath is rotted.

Do the same thing under the windows.

If you're willing to spend three or four years re-coring, and have a place to work on it that's covered, and you can pick it up for $20K, you could come out even. If you're going to pay someone else to do the work, a better price would be $10K... unless it's so bad that the main stringers are rotted, in which case it's worth the salvage price of the engines, no more.

 

[tallswede]

I know it sounds too low, but we are in kind of a back water and the owner seems to be in distress and needs to sell. I'll definately be looking for soft spots after reading your post and some of the others on this site. All the help I can get on things to look for are helpfull Thanks.

Kevin

 

[BillMFl]

Ford Lehmans are tough reliable diesels that are relatively inexpensive to rebuild compared to other makes. MT's usually have good solid hulls. Big roomy boats for the money. Water leaks are almost always an issue. Start with the headliners. Mine were clean and dry, no water stains. That would be a very good sign if true for your boat. Next look at all the interior wood, especially around and below windows. The thin mahogeny or teak veneers rot out very quickly and or buckle if there are leaks. Also look at the floors for water stains (dark colored or faded areas. You can assume that there is moisture in the various decks with almost any older boat, but decks have enough glass to hold up for almost forever. There may be some soft spots. Porthole window have seals that become brittle and eventually leak. The seals are fairly easy to pick out with a sharp pointed tool. I replaced mine by buying rolls of seal material that had adhesive backing on one side and then just crammed into place with a screen roller tool. I have gradually replaced a lot of connectors for lights, bilge pumps (replaced all the pumps) and you should check them manually. A survey will scare you but will also show you just how much you will have to do. Some things can be put off to the future but all safety related will rquire immediate attention. You may as well get a survey before you buy because Insurance Companies will require one anyway if you buy it and then apply for insurance. Expect lots of stuff to be done, and its much better if you can do some or most of it. I have enjoyed working on mine but it has taken a lot of time.

 

[Peter B]

I agree, the price does sound too goo to be true. Even a 30 YR old vessel of that type and size here in Oz would be $150k +/- a bit, if in good condition. However, if it is basically sound all round, and it is the personal circumstances that are affecting the price - ie need a quick sale, and unlikely where it is, then it sounds an exceptional buy.