Are you using a Bridle with your anchoring setup?

[HeadedToTexas]

The prevalence of the soft shackle in the boating and off road world should provide plenty of evidence that they always work right, but the on and off nature of anchor loads combined with the cost of failure makes me worry about the soft shackle popping open. Does that ever happen?

 

[boathealer]

How does that attach?

Just slip the soft shackle (orange) through one of the chain links in the rode.

 

[boathealer]

The prevalence of the soft shackle in the boating and off road world should provide plenty of evidence that they always work right, but the on and off nature of anchor loads combined with the cost of failure makes me worry about the soft shackle popping open. Does that ever happen?

Hasn't happened to us.

My view on the cost of failure is that the chain rode is still attached. The noise alone if that happened would alert us to the issue and corrective action could be taken.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Thanks Ray. The price of the soft shackle is certainly right if you make them yourself.

 

[boathealer]

The price of the soft shackle is certainly right if you make them yourself.

Yeah, I went a little overboard with that a while back.......

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Very nice. Love that Fender2Step. Finding that is going to cost me!

 

[fgarriso]

About 80% of the time we use it.
You never know when the wind is going to come up.

 

[High Wire]

We use a Y bridle of about 10 ft length with a Mantus chain hook. We used to use a single snubber but got in trouble during storms to where the boat would yaw and drag the anchor.

 

[Spinner]

All chain rode, in the Pacific NW, and I always use a bridle. This way the boat is always set up for a blow.

Regarding using the catenary...., I was in Desolation Sound in 2019 when an unpredicted storm came through. All-chain rodes were stretched straight!!

 

[High Wire]

We use a V bridle of about 10 ft length with a Mantus chain hook. We used to use a single snubber but got in trouble during storms to where the boat would yaw and drag the anchor.

 

[Simi 60]

You guys that are still using chain hooks should look into soft shackles to attach your snubber/bridle to your chain. They are light, quiet, stronger than the chain (and chain hook) and, as a bonus, way less expensive than chain hooks. We converted and wouldn’t consider going back to a chain hook.

.

I use a victory hook for our everyday snubber
Cheap and the added bonus is it self releases as chain is retrieved and that snubber is short enough that it doesn't touch the water
No need to have anyone up front.

On my storm snubber (4x longer) I use a soft shackle

Of the two I actually prefer the victory hook as it cups and supports the whole link
Soft shackle and most other hooks point load the link.


That hook has seen 80+ knots on our vessel
The anchor chain did deform during that event as we had a short polypropylene snubber vs nylon that we now use.

https://www.samallen.com.au/index_inner.php?page=100003&searchType=&search=&itemID=14354&category=2

 

[BruceK]

Sea Dog chain gripper plate works well for the bridle. Otherwise a snubber line with a bear claw, but I think it loads the chain unevenly.

 

[boathealer]

Soft shackle and most other hooks point load the link.

Isn't every single link of the chain point-loaded?

 

[DCDC]

We have two bridles - 3 strand nylon, 35’x3/4” and 45’x7/8” double braid nylon. Both have SS thimbles and 3’x3/8” dyneema slings, attaching to a Mantus claw chain hook. 3/8” G4 chain and a 125# Mantus anchor. Boat is 56’ and 42 tons.

Have had 200’ of chain+bridle taut in sustained 50 knot winds with 3-4’ seas. Anchor did not move even with a 180° wind shift.

 

[rslifkin]

I don't bother with a chain hook at all. I just prusik hitch the snubber right to the chain.

 

[caltexflanc]

I don't bother with a chain hook at all. I just prusik hitch the snubber right to the chain.

Before I was gifted a bridle that used a chain plate as shown by Bruce K, I did the same using a rolling hitch and a length of three strand. Worked great in some poor conditions.

Here's a chartered Grand Banks 49MY anchored off Indian Key in SW Florida during a squall using that technique; the anchor was (the horror!) a CQR. Note the ensign wrapped around the pole a few times as the wind clocked. We held perfectly.

 

[caltexflanc]

I never had a need for a bridle. I use all chain rode with 5:1 scope. Even in 60mph gusts we do not jerk up against the chain. With a bridle we sail around at anchor much more than without one. I always secure the chain with the stopper and relax tension on the windlass.

Interesting.

As the owner and chronic anchorer of almost the same exact boat (less cockpit)
I am mystified by this. In anything of about gale force or above, our 20' long bridle line was pulled taut, forming a straight line with the chain rode. Which means the chain would have been bar tight sans bridle. We also had the opposite experience with horsing around with/without bridle, though the difference was minimal (not much in either case).

The pulpit and surrounding deck area are one of the habitual spots for softening and water intrusion on vintage Hatts (almost all of which used the exact same pulpit assembly), as well as other long pulpit boats. The leverage created by the anchor rode as the boat rocks and yaws contributes to that.

 

[kchace]

We have 150’ chain, 250’ nylon. When anchored such that we only have chain out, we always use a bridle with a chain gripper plate. The bridle is set up so we can run it out up to 30’ for extra shock absorption if the weather gets sporty. If we have enough out that we’re onto the nylon, we will make sure there’s at least 30’ of nylon out then just cleat it off.

Ken

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Sea Dog chain gripper plate works well for the bridle. Otherwise a snubber line with a bear claw, but I think it loads the chain unevenly.

Bruce and caltexflanc, I did some searching and struck out. Can you describe or post a picture of the Sea Dog chain gripper plate in action? Looks like a winner.

 

[caltexflanc]

Not sure what you mean by "in action", but I never took a picture of the plate mounted to the chain. Here is a pic of the rig

I have to say I like the looks of that Victory hook Simi posted.

 

[Okydowky]

It comes down to who has been woken dramatically in the middle of the night, and learning curves or superstitions of it won’t happen again to me bitches!
We always bridle for probably different reasons.
I think of it as a back up, bridle fails then it’s holy crap time. My chain and winch will then catch me and give me time hopefully to re group.
Definitely takes the strain off pulpit, winch break and definitely evens out the load on the boat front of the boat putting it on a cleat.
Silence, oh I like silence. Almost cures the sound of my galvanize chain being ground off as we do circles all night. You will know what I mean if you have ever slept in a Vberth, another reason why we bought a aft bed. Which is almost to eery quiet and now get up to check because it’s so silent.
We have a single day bridle, pretty cavemanish and our scookum mantus double for a good night sleep. We upgraded this winter to 300’ of 3/8 chain and 73lbs Vulcan, so with this combo it works for us zzzzzzzzzzzZ.

 

[Hippocampus]

Have used a lot of dyneema/spectra through the years. Great stuff but not at all abrasion/chafe resistant. Rope to rope is fine but line to metal is just asking for trouble.
Basically lived on the hook for 7 straight years. Big problem with bridles or snubbers isn’t putting them on but taking them off. In Simpson bay had someone drag in front of us. Dinghies were out trying to help prevent that boat from hitting others. We wanted to move as we were in line to get hit. Had tied the snubbers to the chain. Couldn’t get them untied as it was blowing dogs off their chains. Needed pliers and a spike.
Since then will never tie anything to the anchor chain that could prevent me from leaving quickly. Been liking the mantus device.
In many total boat losses (like the one on the west coast of Mexico) one of the common failures were snubbers broke or chafed through. If using nylon line which is very abrasion sensitive would ALWAYS use a thimble.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Not sure what you mean by "in action", but I never took a picture of the plate mounted to the chain. Here is a pic of the rig

Ah-hah, that makes sense now. Thanks.

 

[psneeld]

Most research I have done and my own practical experience including Practical Sailor agree with this statement....

"Out of all the products that are out there for climbing, Dyneema is considered to be the most abrasion resistant. That means that it is the least likely to be cut on a sharp edge, in fact Dyneema is used to make cut-resistant ..."

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...Vaw1nqXiM5Muipovot6WIvtkU&cshid=1615134352187

I would have no qualms about cutting a single snubber tied on and wouldn't loosen in an emergency.

But because I never had untying a knot that wasn't melted shut, even after 15 years of salvage work, I am not worried. I have had more issues with metal fastenings than knots resisting coming undone. But in an emergency, cut the line.

 

[guy with a boat]

Isn't every single link of the chain point-loaded?

Yes.

 

[rgano]

Using all-chain rode now and with a wimpy little windlass, I use a braided snubber. Used the same snubber on my trawler with a bigger windlass too.

 

[rgano]

I don't bother with a chain hook at all. I just prusik hitch the snubber right to the chain.

I am playing around with an icycle hitch these days.

 

[Hippocampus]

Cut resistance yes. It’s hell to cut dyneema with a knife. They now make standing rigging with dyneema instead of wire. In daily use one of the major concerns is chafe. Can last as long as rod if not chafed and is even lighter. Great stuff. We used dyneema for our running rigging. Everywhere there’s a possibility of chafe put an additional cover on it. Unlike other line it seems UV and chafe points is what necessitates replacement. Creep is reported. In practice hasn’t been an issue of note.
Guess our mileage has varied. Anchoring in the trades with frequent loading and unloading knots get tighter and tighter. Of course snubbers are usually nylon which stretches not dyneema which doesn’t.

 

[guy with a boat]

Dyneema is commonly use as chafe protection over nylon lines and is pretty tough stuff.

Don’t expect a knot to hold, the material is relentlessly slippery. Terminations have to be spliced.

Speaking of splices, you guys that use prusiks or rolling hitches should try soft shackles also; you might be surprised how quick and easy it is. As Hippo points out, that can be important if you need to adjust or remove it in a hurry.

 

[psneeld]

I just guess it depends on how dyneema is used (fore and aft resistance very good, side to side not so good) and how the line is made from it/similar fibers as some are repotedly better.

Most knots do get tighter, too tight to undo...but never had a bowline that did and I used to use it on a shackle to ungrounded boats. Pretty much the hardest use of any line I have ever seen. Of course at some small diameter line...where all knots are hard to undo. But why many here are recommending bends or splices. I use a rolling hitch on my chain and modify it with extra hitches. It may lose the the end hitch but never all and always easy to untie.